Red Mysterious SKULL

[Scott Crawley]

OK, I'll play.

The guesses for the object below have to do a better job of explaining what the part outlined in purple is and where it would most logically go. I think it holds BNC connectors, outlined in orange. If that's true, wherever this thing goes, front or back, you'd think the connectors would be on the dumb side of the camera.

The part outlined In purple extends off of the dumb side of the camera. It contains ports or controls of some kind, though I'm not convinced they are BNC. What we can see looks more oval in shape.

If it goes on the front of the camera (such that the BNCs are on the dumb side):

a) once cables were plugged in, it would make using the Switchblade difficult and would seem to preclude using the DSMC Side Handle altogether

It would definitely interfere with the regular side handle, but may be angled in such a way as to play well with the switchblade. This part may in fact be the reason why the switchblade was created. This question though, is why my mind is open to the idea that these are controls rather than connectors but that would be a departure from all of the Red designs we have seen thus far.

If you are correct and these ports do interfere with the switchblade, you then have a basis for the argument that this part is a companion to the new part with the "w"skull pictured on it. If that were the case it would be very limiting and if this is not a part the user can install I would say it is much too limiting. That is why I conclude that it will play well with switchblade.

b) you have to account for the large, open space outlined in blue. I'm assuming the green edge sits flush against whatever it attaches to. Based on where the pins are currently located behind the lens mount, this piece oriented in that position means the space in blue greatly exceeds the very thin lens mount and leaves the part outlined in purple sticking way out in the front of the camera.

i don't think it is as deep as you suggest. I believe the mount sits in that blue outlined space and sits flush with the front of the purple outlined portion.

c) assuming the green edge sits flush against what it's attached to, unless the black plastic piece that surrounds the pins is spring loaded, it doesn't seem to correspond to how current lens mounts attach. And, don't the mounts themselves only have 12 contacts? So, how would the 13th pin on this thing communicate with the mount?

The pins I presume do have spring to them just like all the others currently in use in the system. Yes, there is a new pin in the series, suggesting enhanced capabilities within new lens mounts. There may also be, as Jarek indicated, an additional female connector like the one we see on the back of the camera, below a similar but shorter row of pins.

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[Brian Boyer]

Purple as I quoted. It's too large. The wing is smaller than that. You have included part of the skull.

Freya

Gotcha. Yes, you did quote me referring to the purple part.

So, you're saying the part to the left of the pink line (I updated the image) is part of the "Skull" and the part to the right of it is part of a wing?

I guess that means what you're calling "the Skull" is the very thin piece outlined by the red, green and purple lines? It seems you're saying the pins face frontwards towards the lens.

If that's the case, wouldn't the large area outlined in blue be much too big to neatly attach the lens mount, making the wing sit way out in front of the Skull? Why wouldn't the wing sit further back so everything lines up flush on the front of the Skull?

I'm just trying to understand your take.

 

[Björn Benckert]

Another random thought..

(if and) When RED release a medium format sensor .... what would they need to do to the front of the camera to support a larger sensor?

Could the 'future' that would excite a Stills photographer - be one that delves into medium format?




AJ

That could be it and the pins in the bottom of the flt thing is the same as the current mount connectors...

 

[Scott Crawley]

I propose that "thin is in" refers to the OLPFs. I believe that new OLPFs will themselves be thinner, and drop in.

Oh now we are cooking!

YES! I was trying to work out how you could use the skull in a way that "Thin is in" would be practical in a real world way becaue I think that it is all intended to be even smaller than before but then there is the heat issue but I think you have it!

I knew once I posted it you guys would work out all the details!

Freya

 

[Freya]

That's a much better picture! Thanks Scott!

Yes the wing is the bit up to the pink/magenta line. That detaches from the skull (the rest of the photo).
You can take the wing off the skull when the skull is connected directly to the body if you want.

The wing provides what you need for operating the camera directly from the skull.

That's my take on it!

Freya

 

[Brian Boyer]

i don't think it is as deep as you suggest. I believe the mount sits in that blue outlined space and sits flush with the front of the purple outlined portion...

Here's a screenshot of an Epic Dragon with the lens mount removed. The mount and the space it sits in looks at least 3 times as thin as the blue area.

If that area is as thin as the current mount, I'm going to go out on a limb and say there's no way the flat part outlined in red, green and purple, which is even thinner, is what Freya is calling "the Skull." Sorry, Freya.

Open pic in a new window for a larger version.

 

[Scott Crawley]

That would be very cool but unless Red engineers figured out a new way to dissipate heat or a new stone cold sensor, this can't be right. There is no heat sink visible in the new Red part and the sensor is, as Jim used to say, a thermonuclear reactor.

You can see the vent on the heat sink of the Alexa in the picture.

I like Freyas idea. So basicly something like a "Arri Alexa M" but even more portable?
That would explain #‎thinisin and why a photographer might get excited...but who knows

 

[Freya]

I guess that means what you're calling "the Skull" is the very thin piece outlined by the red, green and purple lines? It seems you're saying the pins face frontwards towards the lens.

If that's the case, wouldn't the large area outlined in blue be much too big to neatly attach the lens mount, making the wing sit way out in front of the Skull? Why wouldn't the wing sit further back so everything lines up flush on the front of the Skull?

I'm just trying to understand your take.

That's okay!
I'm having a hard time getting what you mean here tho. If the blue is the front of the camera then the wing in the picture would be further back rather than way out in front.
I'm not sure I understand how the lens mount area could be too big either.
I could understand what you meant if you were saying it was too small but...
Lens mount area could be larger so that it can accomodate larger sensors and the larger lens port needed for large format sensors.

Freya

 

[Scott Crawley]

I see what you mean, but I am assuming we should expect new lens mounts because of the 13th pin.

You could of course be right, and I am very much off track.

I am stuck with the idea that this can't be the sensor block because of heat removal apparatus or the lack of it, but maybe that IS the engineering epiphany that Jarred was referring to recently. That might explain why Jarek is seeing the "bulky port" on this part.

It is very exciting to consider, particularly as a route to medium format sensors. I think I am running out of straws to reach for however.

Here's a screenshot of an Epic Dragon with the lens mount removed. The mount and the space it sits in looks at least 3 times as thin as the blue area.

If that area is as thin as the current mount, I'm going to go out on a limb and say there's no way the flat part outlined in red, green and purple, which is even thinner, is what Freya is calling "the Skull." Sorry, Freya.

 

[Freya]

Here's a screenshot of an Epic Dragon with the lens mount removed. The mount and the space it sits in looks at least 3 times as thin as the blue area.

If that area is as thin as the current mount, I'm going to go out on a limb and say there's no way the flat part outlined in red, green and purple, which is even thinner, is what Freya is calling "the Skull." Sorry, Freya.

Thanks for that photo! It's somewhat helpful although a bit small.
I see where you are coming from now although you are assuming that the lens mounts remain the same on the skull.
However I think I can see bigger problems in that photo.

Have to think about it.

Freya

 

[Brian Boyer]

Thanks for that photo! It's somewhat helpful although a bit small.

Open in a new window. It's much bigger!

 

[Freya]

Okay something odd happened there!

 

[Elsie N]

If what Freya is suggesting is true (and I hope it is) then I should hope the #gladiboughtadragon means there would be a VERY customer friendly trade in of our Dragons for such a unit. If not, then I hope the footage cuts well with Dragons. '-)

 

[Freya]

I'm not ready to drop my rather wild and crazy idea but I can see some issues.
Look at the photo above again.
There appears to be a black female plastic connector in front of the gold male connectors.
Something plugs in there.
Plus the gold connector is different. Two rows of pins and not one.

It also looks like there might be a latch of some kind on the right rear of the connectors, although in this photo it's more of a grey fuzzy blob, so my imagination might be running too far away here.

Again we have no reason to suppose that the lens mounts will remain the same however.

Freya

 

[Freya]

If what Freya is suggesting is true (and I hope it is) then I should hope the #gladiboughtadragon means there would be a VERY customer friendly trade in of our Dragons for such a unit. If not, then I hope the footage cuts well with Dragons. '-)

I'm not suggesting a new sensor right now. Just a new casing for the sensor that can be detached.
So you would still have the dragon sensor but you could remove the skull from the body and sensors could be interchangable.
In that instance your dragon sensor would never be obsolete because you could still use it for a different look, even when a new sensor comes out.

Freya

 

[Elsie N]

I'm not suggesting a new sensor right now. Just a new casing for the sensor that can be detached.
So you would still have the dragon sensor but you could remove the skull from the body.

Freya

My thoughts are that they wouldn't simply make a package change without making a performance change... of some kind. Maybe the same sensor with different characteristics.

 

[Freya]

Okay lets go back to the drawing board.
There are a lot of issues with that idea.
Lets look at it from the angle that this is the skull (it has the right filename for starters) and that the other photo is maybe the bit attached to the side:

Oddly this picture reminds me a bit of the red one but there we go.

Freya

 

[Freya]

Yeah maybe that idea is too much of a stretch like Brian suggests.
I think all this talk of dragons and skulls has made me expect magic and not applied science.
Oh well.

Freya

 

[Scott Crawley]

If this is a new sensor block and we are looking at the bottom, then it would have to live forward of where the current sensor sits. Otherwise, I think this area where purple meets yellow would protrude toward the back of the camera, potentially overlapping the area where side handle modules attach. That doesn't seem entirely likely. Considering it sets off a cascade of bizarre thoughts like:
If the sensor has moved forward, what then would go in the space in which current sensor resides? Could it be an entirely new cooling unit? It would have to be, no?

What we are contemplating suggests either an entirely new cooling unit, or entirely new lens mounts. Are either of these reasonable?

 

[Freya]

If the sensor has moved forward, what then would go in the space in which current sensor resides? Could it be an entirely new cooling unit? It would have to be, no?

What we are contemplating suggests either an entirely new cooling unit, or entirely new lens mounts. Are either of these reasonable?

We could be looking at the connector for the sensor unit I guess. Perhaps with built in fan.
It's just that now we know that isn't the same connector as on the front of the dragon, we don't really have the evidence to back the whole thing up.
So we are now looking at ways to work around what we are looking at and to fit the theory into the existing evidence, which is not so good.
I've looked at everything and without any more data there is nothing that can really back the theory too much, although it did fit in so nicely with so many other things.

Freya