Red Drive!!!

[Alexis Vanier]

I think the idea of having a RAID-0 unit with 4 semi-removable cards just misses the point of such a device and simply shifts the costs to the user while effectively defeating the advantage of CF by losing the mobility they allow for. I think it's not really like RED to bring to life such an halfed baked (I don't mean this as insult to your idea Dylan. The concept is interesting but I think you'll see my point) concept.

I think in the long run the SSD RAID drive would provide an answer to the need for fast writing shock-proof medium while being less expensive than a bunch of cards in some odd raid holder. That would actually be like an oversized DIY (more like FIY (fill it yourself) P2 card...

I'm pretty sure that in the end, SSD drive pricing will go down (especially with Apple trying to make them mainstream with the MacBook Air), performance go up. Especially true if the RED SSD RAID were to come out something like next year. That would result in a convenient solution at a lower price tag than what is currently advertised by RED.

My 2-cents.

(I'm waiting for a huge render to finish... which explains the abundant ranting.)

P.S. Not bumping the drives makes sense... but it's like saying that you shouldn't drive you Ford pickup in the mud. It's true... but if you don't you'll always wonder how it is!

 

[Deanan]

I built a 4x CF raid but it was neither cost effective, practical or compact in the end. However, the future is looking good...

 

[Dylan Reeve]

I think it's not really like RED to bring to life such an halfed baked (I don't mean this as insult to your idea Dylan. The concept is interesting but I think you'll see my point) concept.

You're on my list!!

Nah, as I started typing it (moving it from random idea to actually thinking about it) I can see the problems.

That said, if you could buy a somewhat inexpensive casing, with the right connectors and hardware in it, then fill it with four decent CF cards and use it like, as you say, a DIY P2 card...

I've certainly seen the hardware for sale to do this (although the one I looked at was IDE not SATA) but it really is a sort of bastardisation... You don't get the benefit of the CF cards (easy swap out), so why bother?

For a while I lamented RED's lack of more than one CF slot, but then again I realise the problems in having a recording that spans cards (both P2 and EX do this, but can have odd results - it's not really worth it). Introducing a 4-card RAID thing would be like the opposite of that - four-slots, but the cards couldn't be transferred or handled individually (although it would be fairly trivial to make an application to do it - but no one like to be tied to a specific copying program).

I guess what I'm imagining isn't so much a multi-slot CF mount, but more of a 'fill it yourself' RED Flash unit. But yeah, I certainly see the drawbacks of such and idea.

 

[Rich Schaefer]

I did some more testing today with my RedDrives. I put a hostess tray on my Cobra and took a few spins. This car is built for racing and rides like it with very stiff suspension. The roads were not smooth nor rough. I shot 4k 2:1 @29.97. Here is the rig:

 

[Rich Schaefer]

Run 1 was the RedDrive in the RedCradle. Results not good! 999 droped frames! 10 minutes of post record time.

Run 2 drive in bubble wrap. 140 dropped frames. Here is what it looked like:

Run 3 lots more bubble wrap. 36 dropped frames. Here is what it looked like:

Run 4 I used a CF card (@23.98) 0 dropped frames, no problems!

It might be possible to isolate the drive to be able to do this. If we get a break with the rain tomorrow, I might try again. Obviously CF is the way to go if you don't have to shoot 30p!

 

[Brook Willard]

Those are the best pictures ever!

 

[Warren Kommers]

Is there a way to extend the distance of the drive and/or battery from the camera? To put it on your hip or in the car in this case. Extension cables?

 

[Wes Printz]

Run 1 was the RedDrive in the RedCradle. Results not good! 999 droped frames! 10 minutes of post record time.

Run 2 drive in bubble wrap. 140 dropped frames.

Run 3 lots more bubble wrap. 36 dropped frames.

Run 4 I used a CF card (@23.98) 0 dropped frames, no problems!

It might be possible to isolate the drive to be able to do this. If we get a break with the rain tomorrow, I might try again. Obviously CF is the way to go if you don't have to shoot 30p!

Conclusion: if there's any vibration anticipated use CF or explain to production the 8 rolls of bubble wrap on the camera department expendables list.

 

[NateWeaver]

I had a drive on my shoot Thursday night.

Not a problem from the drive...

 

[Poi Boy]

I did some more testing today with my RedDrives. I put a hostess tray on my Cobra and took a few spins. This car is built for racing and rides like it with very stiff suspension. The roads were not smooth nor rough. I shot 4k 2:1 @29.97. Here is the rig:

A hostess, a Cobra and a Red..What a nice combination.
Aloha
-A

 

[Finner]

RICHCAM I dig your style man.

 

[Jarred Land]

Rich your first shake rattle and roll tests are pretty consistent with what we found.. on helicopters or cars without a stabilizer your gonna run into trouble.

As Deanan said... jolting them around when they are spinning not only will give you dropped frames, but you have the risk of shortening their lifespan tremendously.

Keep the spinning platters happy by using them handheld or studio/tripod use... if your gonna strap them to cars/helicopters or roller-coasters use the CF or the Solid State Drives ( when they come out ).

nice car man btw..

 

[Evin Grant]

Somebody with more time, money and mechanical engineering experience than common sense should design a small Iso-Elastic arm for the Red drive cradle like a mini Steadi-cam arm. I don't think you could sell it but it would be a very fun project.

 

[Paul Leeming]

Here's something I used to use when I had a silent PC:

Building a version of that to suit the RedDrive shouldn't be too hard and would totally isolate it against hard vibrations. Just ensure sufficient clearance relative to the strength of the 'O' ring rubbers and perhaps have a material damping the extremities in case it bottoms out.

I'm not in a position to build them but hopefully someone else out there might see a market for one. I know I'd buy one if someone made it at a reasonable cost.

HTH

Paul

 

[Harry Clark]

Rich,
A Red One AND a Cobra? MAN, your wife is even more patient than mine!
If you get a chance, try to rig up a microphone shock mount type thing with surgical tubing (Mark at offhollywood suggested this in another post regarding a stabilized head/techno combination on a camera car)
If there are no technical issues with voltage drop or data loss, an extension cable to put the drive off-camera would be very useful, both to isolate the drive but also to jam the camera, stripped down, into a corner, on a car dash, or whatever.
Cheers,
Harry

 

[S. Um]

Obviously CF is the way to go if you don't have to shoot 30p!

Rich, thanks for the tests. It's nice to know the limits of your tools.

Is CF not fast enough to record 30p?

 

[Rich Schaefer]

Paul, I like the bungie rig! Test that for us. I will try to make us something like that.

Yes, my Wife is patient. The Cobra is a project that keeps me around the house.

Nope, the CF cards can't handle 30p....yet. I have faith that someday they will be able to handle it.

Here is a quick. non-graded QT of the run. This was with the CF card, but you can see the conditions. It looks smoother than it is (14mm lens):


(If this clip doesn't load, try later, too many are watching at once.)

 

[Mark Pugh]

Here's something I used to use when I had a silent PC:

Building a version of that to suit the RedDrive shouldn't be too hard and would totally isolate it against hard vibrations. Just ensure sufficient clearance relative to the strength of the 'O' ring rubbers and perhaps have a material damping the extremities in case it bottoms out.

I'm not in a position to build them but hopefully someone else out there might see a market for one. I know I'd buy one if someone made it at a reasonable cost.

HTH

Paul

Paul
What is that case made for?

 

[Paul Leeming]

That particular device is used in PCs to quieten the HDD by isolating it from transmitting vibration to the case. It worked wonders and the only thing you could ever hear was the tiny tick of the heads moving. I imagine today's drives would work even better.

Here's a review link:

http://www.silentpcreview.com/article39-page1.html

In the RedDrive case it is not for acoustic vibration suppression but rather to isolate the drive against external vibration, much like microphone bungees do. I figured it might inspire someone to build a Red capable version, or even for Red themselves to have a go.

HTH

Paul

 

[Wes Printz]

Rich, Good thing that guard rail did not jump out and grab the camera at the beginning of the clip, or you would have had bigger worries... Might have put a dent in the door of the Cobra.