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  • Hey all, just changed over the backend after 15 years I figured time to give it a bit of an update, its probably gonna be a bit weird for most of you and i am sure there is a few bugs to work out but it should kinda work the same as before... hopefully :)

RED Cambook

Michael Wiegand said:
Just like the iPad works underwater... for a bit. ;)

People have been diving with our charts for a long time now, here is a link to Tom Campbell http://www.dsclabs.com/tom_campbell.htm (scroll to the bottom to see our chart underwater)

However, the RED Cambook has many perforations (so it can be Cerlox bound) and therefore is not a candidate.

Thanks,

Michael
DSC Labs
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Hey, Michael I actually knew that - just teasing - those charts are sweet. Btw already have had my iPad underwater in a waterproof bag. :-)
 
I picked up one of these at NAB (prototype?) And its been fantastic. I highly recommend it.

rick
 
It's very simple - it's because it's accurate, and it's measured accurate and checked accurate before it leaves DSC Labs.

I have umpteen "other" charts, all of which are meant to have "the same" colours on them. None of them match, and some are so utterly bad to be worse than useless. DSC charts are not like that. They're accurate.

Graeme
 
Brook Willard said:
Nice! Will there be any specific back-end support for this chart and matching cameras in RCX?
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Yes the working folks who actually know why we use charts would like to know what the plans are?

I pray this IS NOT glossy like so many DSC charts of the past. Many folks will be happy who Color for a living:)

I would like to know more about the RGB RedColor swatches? Thanks Graeme!
 
Yes glossy - the question is why?

Glossy charts are a bit of a pain to use - if you get a light on them at the wrong angle you get a nasty flare in the image. However - even on a matt chart you'll get a flare, but it's diffuse and it's hard to see, but it's still effecting the colours.

Because the flare is is so easy to spot on the glossy chart you know when it's effecting the colours. On a matt chart, you may have flare effecting the colours but not easily spot it.

Other than that, glossy charts have a higher dynamic range, but for me, the real benefit is seeing flare so you can avoid it.

Graeme
 
What is the estimated lifespan of the book before it should be replaced?
 
Red Cambook, not a book!

Red Cambook, not a book!

Michael Kontaxis said:
Yikes... that's expensive. Can someone explain to me why laminated paper costs so much money?
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Hi Michael, our charts are not made with paper. I'd tell you how they are made, but I have signed a non-disclosure agreement with DSC Labs. ;)

Also, it's not a book. It is high quality charts in the "form factor" of a book. The charts are mounted on acrylic.

Michael
DSC Labs
 
Mark Phelan said:
What is the estimated lifespan of the book before it should be replaced?
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Hi Mark, the lifespan that we guarantee is 2 years (the charts have a recommended upgrade date on them). In other words, if you think the colors or grayscale (the grayscale must be neutral) have changed out of our tolerances in the time before the upgrade date, send it back to us and if it has, we replace it at no charge.

Also (as this is a common question and all the questions on this forum have been great) we do not read the charts with a camera, we use photospectrometers. Sure, they have been modified to our crazy (narrow) tolerances, but that's what we use. ;)
 
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Graeme Nattress said:
Yes glossy - the question is why?

Glossy charts are a bit of a pain to use - if you get a light on them at the wrong angle you get a nasty flare in the image. However - even on a matt chart you'll get a flare, but it's diffuse and it's hard to see, but it's still effecting the colours.
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Thanks Graeme. Indeed glossy charts are pain in the ass but I would like to know why the RED Cambook is glossy? Does it have to be glossy? Did DSC ask those designing/making the chart "Matte or Glossy"? Is that a DSC mandated requirement for every "custom" DSC chart? I noticed the same thing when using the Sean Fairburn 3D chart.

My last question for those in charge of the Chart creation. How were Red Rocket users taken into consideration when designing the Chart?

Looking forward to seeing the new software to go with it:)

Many thanks,
 
Dane Brehm said:
Thanks Graeme. Indeed glossy charts are pain in the ass but I would like to know why the RED Cambook is glossy? Does it have to be glossy? Did DSC ask those designing/making the chart "Matte or Glossy"? Is that a DSC mandated requirement for every "custom" DSC chart? I noticed the same thing when using the Sean Fairburn 3D chart.

My last question for those in charge of the Chart creation. How were Red Rocket users taken into consideration when designing the Chart?

Looking forward to seeing the new software to go with it:)

Many thanks,
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Hello Dane, Graeme mentioned flare and dynamic range - that is completely correct. We have been asked about the glossy issue since 1999 when it was implemented... and more than happy to explain why! ;)

The fact that the lamination extends the life of the chart is just a happy side effect, that is not the "why".

Michael
 
Yes, it's glossy, and it's glossy for the reasons described. Basically, you can see when a reflection is causing issues and adjust accordingly, whereas on a matte chart you could be relying on a colour that has been effected by a reflection but not be easily able to see that there's a reflection altering that colour.

Graeme
 
Graeme Nattress said:
Yes, it's glossy, and it's glossy for the reasons described. Basically, you can see when a reflection is causing issues and adjust accordingly, whereas on a matte chart you could be relying on a colour that has been effected by a reflection but not be easily able to see that there's a reflection altering that colour.

Graeme
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Reflections can be seen by the naked eye (or in the viewfinder, or the monitor) and therefore can be adjusted by tilting the chart, usually downwards because you don't have lights below the lens. Flare can often not be seen by the baked eye (but is certainly seen by the camera and by the waveform monitor or histogram), so if you were to test a matte chart with a scope you would see the wfm moving up and down, depending on the angle of the chart (and it's reflectance)... so what or when is accurate?
 
Red Cambook faq

Red Cambook faq

Graeme Nattress said:
Yes, it's glossy, and it's glossy for the reasons described. Basically, you can see when a reflection is causing issues and adjust accordingly, whereas on a matte chart you could be relying on a colour that has been effected by a reflection but not be easily able to see that there's a reflection altering that colour.

Graeme
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My fault for not posting our FAQ page right away!

http://www.dsclabs.com/faqs.htm
 
I've been using this chart for a few months now and Ive been very happy with this chart.
I looked everywhere for a high quality well made chart that will last me several years. Its thick and made out of an acrylic that feels tougher than other charts.

It helps that Graeme check it out, seems to like it and that RED has their stamp on it.

Flat out its very well made and love it.
Michael was helpful in the purchase, and I get nothing at all for saying this.
I just like the product.
my mistake for mentioning they can customize it for you, they dont.

Enjoy it.

Luis Flores
 

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Jarred Land said:
We just got in the new RED/DSC labs RED Cambook Test Charts.

We worked closely DSC labs to make the perfect group of test charts for use with the RED camera.

8 x 11.5" Wire bound book that includs a custom calibrated ChromaDuMondewith an additional 6 over-saturated color chips orchestrated by our own Graeme Natress,
as well as 2 framing charts ( one of them with a 18% grey background) that cover 2:1, HD and 4.5k Wide formats unique to the RED.

1278793322.jpg


Price is $425 for the book, will be in the RED.com store by the end of the day monday.
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Jarred - will You make the chart available as a reference RGB file as well? Or at least with the purchase of the physical chart?
EDIT: This would allow for 3rd party SW to be developed to auto-balance shots with the chart in it...

Cheers

Peter
 
Peter Majtan said:
Jarred - will You make the chart available as a reference RGB file as well? Or at least with the purchase of the physical chart?
EDIT: This would allow for 3rd party SW to be developed to auto-balance shots with the chart in it...

Cheers

Peter
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That RGB would be mighty usefull to calibrate studios and workflows....

Great idea Peter!
 
I second that idea! (the chart file)
 
I'd love to see a version of the chart that isn't in a book, but is a larger form chart [similar to the DSC charts I've come across in the past]. The value to me as a DIT isn't in the framing or focus [have tools for that] but in the color. And bigger charts are awesome.
 
Brook Willard said:
I'd love to see a version of the chart that isn't in a book, but is a larger form chart [similar to the DSC charts I've come across in the past]. The value to me as a DIT isn't in the framing or focus [have tools for that] but in the color. And bigger charts are awesome.
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If there is a demand for that, I expect that we would do it. However, the price won't be anywhere near the Cambook. The color chart in the RED Cambook is very close to our ChromaDuMonde 28, which starts at $964

Michael
DSC Labs
 
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