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  • Hey all, just changed over the backend after 15 years I figured time to give it a bit of an update, its probably gonna be a bit weird for most of you and i am sure there is a few bugs to work out but it should kinda work the same as before... hopefully :)

Quick Look - LG 31" DCI 4K Monitor

Thanks for the review, definitely worth considering buying one! Though I truly love my 2x 27inch HP Dreamcolor screens at the moment.

On a side note; I see that you're playing League of Legends, we should play some together someday ;)
 
Kirk.Attard said:
...Do you think that other programs like Maya and Nuke will have issues to run this or will they just scale accordingly...
Click to expand...

Would like to know how the Maya viewports handle this as well ;)
 
Phil, could you do a quick test: open some windows on Windows desktop (even better if you have also some desktop gadgets), then power down the display without powering down the PC - then power up the display again. Have all your windows shrunk in size and are they bunched in the top left corner of the display, along with all the desktop gadgets?
 
Blair Thornton said:
Phil, How do you switch this display to 10-bit on the nMP ?
Click to expand...


You would need to use something like the BMD UltraStudio 4K but the question is, does it become a monitor as oppose to a desktop display.

I cant confirm that its 10-bit, someone please chime in on that :)
 
Blair Thornton said:
Phil, How do you switch this display to 10-bit on the nMP ?
Click to expand...

You can't. OS X doesn't allow 10-bit. It's one of those design flaws that Apple has refused to address but you can bet your ass they will push it out like a hot pizza when Microsoft fully supports it on Windows. Linux does it just fine.
 
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Petri Teittinen said:
Phil, could you do a quick test: open some windows on Windows desktop (even better if you have also some desktop gadgets), then power down the display without powering down the PC - then power up the display again. Have all your windows shrunk in size and are they bunched in the top left corner of the display, along with all the desktop gadgets?
Click to expand...

Yes. This is a Windows thing. I'm working on a way to fix this behavior. Basically once the monitor is no longer detected Window's is switching to a safer resolution hoping to detect a monitor. I'm nearly 100% positive there's a registry key that can be modified to make this not happen.
 
10 bit support is nearly identical on Windows and OSX in terms of how to implement it. It's not natively available within the OS GUI layer, but can be accessed via DirectX on Windows or OpenGL on both Windows and Mac. In terms of OpenGL, it requires GPU-specific extensions to be created by the software developers on both platforms. We do see this level of support on Windows in some applications, rarely on OSX. Mostly because on OSX the GPU hardware that would actually support 10bit color is only available as aftermarket solutions for Mac systems and these are often not officially supported. Once in a while we see official support for something like the Quadro 4000 and 5000, as the most recent examples, which do support 10bit color. And yet, no software I know of made any attempt to support that ability.

In terms of proper grading monitors, regardless of which platform, it's best to run them from a proper dedicated I/O solution like a BMD, AJA, Matrox, etc.. card or box. We then gain proper frame rate control and response, color space management and LUT application, amongst other features. Some of these solutions do provide GUI desktop extension onto the connected displays if you find you want more real estate for application space.

I don't know if or how the LG 31" would handle 10bit signal input. It seems that it does support 10bit via HDMI as an input signal, and apparently should also accept 10bit via display port. Beyond that, who knows and I haven't seen anything yet about anyone trying such things. ...I'm sure Phil would like to connect it to a DeckLink 4K or IO4K for us. Right, Phil? ;)
 
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Jeff Kilgroe said:
10 bit support is nearly identical on Windows and OSX in terms of how to implement it. It's not natively available within the OS GUI layer, but can be accessed via DirectX on Windows or OpenGL on both Windows and Mac. In terms of OpenGL, it requires GPU-specific extensions to be created by the software developers on both platforms. We do see this level of support on Windows in some applications, rarely on OSX. Mostly because on OSX the GPU hardware that would actually support 10bit color is only available as aftermarket solutions for Mac systems and these are often not officially supported. Once in a while we see official support for something like the Quadro 4000 and 5000, as the most recent examples, which do support 10bit color. And yet, no software I know of made any attempt to support that ability.

In terms of proper grading monitors, regardless of which platform, it's best to run them from a proper dedicated I/O solution like a BMD, AJA, Matrox, etc.. card or box. We then gain proper frame rate control and response, color space management and LUT application, amongst other features. Some of these solutions do provide GUI desktop extension onto the connected displays if you find you want more real estate for application space.

I don't know if or how the LG 31" would handle 10bit signal input. It seems that it does support 10bit via HDMI as an input signal, and apparently should also accept 10bit via display port. Beyond that, who knows and I haven't seen anything yet about anyone trying such things. ...I'm sure Phil would like to connect it to a DeckLink 4K or IO4K for us. Right, Phil? ;)
Click to expand...

I'll see what I can do with the Decklink 4K info. Got a couple of shooting related things I'll need to get to first. I'm likely building a new system next month and I'll be doing a lot of hardware tests then and that can happen for sure.
 
Ready to press buy but cant find this option anywhere on the net.
 
Jeff Kilgroe said:
10 bit support is nearly identical on Windows and OSX in terms of how to implement it. It's not natively available within the OS GUI layer, but can be accessed via DirectX on Windows or OpenGL on both Windows and Mac. In terms of OpenGL, it requires GPU-specific extensions to be created by the software developers on both platforms. We do see this level of support on Windows in some applications, rarely on OSX. Mostly because on OSX the GPU hardware that would actually support 10bit color is only available as aftermarket solutions for Mac systems and these are often not officially supported. Once in a while we see official support for something like the Quadro 4000 and 5000, as the most recent examples, which do support 10bit color. And yet, no software I know of made any attempt to support that ability.

In terms of proper grading monitors, regardless of which platform, it's best to run them from a proper dedicated I/O solution like a BMD, AJA, Matrox, etc.. card or box. We then gain proper frame rate control and response, color space management and LUT application, amongst other features. Some of these solutions do provide GUI desktop extension onto the connected displays if you find you want more real estate for application space.

I don't know if or how the LG 31" would handle 10bit signal input. It seems that it does support 10bit via HDMI as an input signal, and apparently should also accept 10bit via display port. Beyond that, who knows and I haven't seen anything yet about anyone trying such things. ...I'm sure Phil would like to connect it to a DeckLink 4K or IO4K for us. Right, Phil? ;)
Click to expand...

Could you use the display port on a RED ROCKET-X to drive 10-bit to this display instead of a DeckLink 4K or IO4K ?
 
Hard to say what the output spigots on the RR-X might do until they are enabled…

With all due respect to the hardworking RedTeam, it sure seems to be taking a long time to get the RR-X video outputs live. IMO this is a high priority for a lot of folks who really want to shoot on RED but need tools like the RR-X to support workflows more similar to other systems, particularly on projects with stringent deadlines.

Cheers - #19
 
Phil Holland said:
Yes. This is a Windows thing. I'm working on a way to fix this behavior. Basically once the monitor is no longer detected Window's is switching to a safer resolution hoping to detect a monitor. I'm nearly 100% positive there's a registry key that can be modified to make this not happen.
Click to expand...
Would love to hear the solution, if you find one. Thank you.
 
Phil Holland said:
Yes. This is a Windows thing. I'm working on a way to fix this behavior. Basically once the monitor is no longer detected Window's is switching to a safer resolution hoping to detect a monitor. I'm nearly 100% positive there's a registry key that can be modified to make this not happen.
Click to expand...


This is an ongoing problem with spanned desktops and MST displays in general. I haven't found any fixes yet. Hoping that Microsoft offers up some better support in the near future. I'm being told that large desktop, MST, and "retina" type scaling is looking to be better supported in Windows 10, but I haven't bothered with the preview releases myself. And I don't think it's all there just yet anyway.

It seems to happen on certain large resolutions that are not "standard" and can happen when the system wakes from sleep as well. It's like it reverts window sizing and placement to something 'safe.'

Phil Holland said:
I'll see what I can do with the Decklink 4K info. Got a couple of shooting related things I'll need to get to first. I'm likely building a new system next month and I'll be doing a lot of hardware tests then and that can happen for sure.
Click to expand...

Hehe, no worries. Not trying to put you on the spot or anything. :)
 
So the money question is, what is the max resolution the retina macbook pro with thunderbolt 2 output to this display? I could use the HDMI port at 3840x2160 24hz, but what is max out of displayport on this rig?
 
Jeff Kilgroe said:
In terms of proper grading monitors, regardless of which platform, it's best to run them from a proper dedicated I/O solution like a BMD, AJA, Matrox, etc.. card or box. We then gain proper frame rate control and response, color space management and LUT application, amongst other features. Some of these solutions do provide GUI desktop extension onto the connected displays if you find you want more real estate for application space.

I don't know if or how the LG 31" would handle 10bit signal input. It seems that it does support 10bit via HDMI as an input signal, and apparently should also accept 10bit via display port. Beyond that, who knows and I haven't seen anything yet about anyone trying such things. ...I'm sure Phil would like to connect it to a DeckLink 4K or IO4K for us. Right, Phil? ;)
Click to expand...

I apologize if this is getting off topic, but I think it's applicable here...

Phil, or anyone else ... Is anyone successfully using a DeckLink 4K Extreme 12G (https://www.blackmagicdesign.com/products/decklink/techspecs/W-DLK-25 , which requires PCIe 2 x8) in a Sonnet Echo Express III-D Thunderbolt 2 PCIe Expansion Chassis (http://www.sonnettech.com/product/echoexpress3d.html, x8 electrical PCIe 2.0) for grading ?
 
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Blair Thornton said:
I apologize if this is getting off topic, but I think it's applicable here...

Phil, or anyone else ... Is anyone successfully using a DeckLink 4K Extreme 12G (https://www.blackmagicdesign.com/products/decklink/techspecs/W-DLK-25 , which requires PCIe 2 x8) in a Sonnet Echo Express III-D Thunderbolt 2 PCIe Expansion Chassis (http://www.sonnettech.com/product/echoexpress3d.html, x8 electrical PCIe 2.0) for grading ?
Click to expand...

I'm 100% not a Mac user for any of my workflows, so using the chassis is something I know nothing about (Jon Snow over here). However, I have used a Decklink 4K Extreme in a PC setup. I haven't used the 12G yet. It's fairly new to the market.


Matt Ryan said:
So the money question is, what is the max resolution the retina macbook pro with thunderbolt 2 output to this display? I could use the HDMI port at 3840x2160 24hz, but what is max out of displayport on this rig?
Click to expand...

Don't know exactly if and what the MacBook Pro limitations might be, again, not a Mac dude. However, DisplayPort is what I'm using to connect with via the nVidia Titan and that's working fine at 4096x2160.



Some of the workflows I've explored thus far are proxy and native .R3D editing through Adobe Premiere Pro CC, grading in Resolve and Adobe SpeedGrade, a variety of uses of Redcine-X Pro. Plus a million other applications I use for various things. Some of the more "graphic" related things have made my noggin hurt a bit because those deal with very specific pixel to average display values, that's a whole other bag of beetles though.
 
I think I'll just use it as a secondary monitor connected to the Titan. Like this I wont have to deal with super tiny icons and general GUI problems with other programs like MAYA and NUKE. I'm quite happy with the real estate I get with my Dell so I might keep using that for now. As long as the LG is color accurate I dont think I'll have problems beacuse its 8bit. When a more straightforwarrd process of going 10 bit is available then I'll jump there. What do you guys think? Will I still have problems using it as a secondary monitor? All I want is a good screen to view my 4k content well after all..
 
There seems to be some sort of issue with the GPU support and drivers on the MBPr. The LG has been reported by others as running fine at 60Hz for the default retina scaled modes. However, attempting to use it at native resolution results in a max of 50Hz, even though there is technically no difference in terms of signal going to the display from the GPU. Perhaps it will be sorted with a software update soon.

Can't comment on the DeckLink cards in a TB expander. Never used one there. I don't do much with TB expander boxes, my workhorse systems are PC's with real slots to use. I still use plenty of Macs and actually prefer OS X over Windows any day, but they're not always the right tool for the job. FWIW, I see a lot of people spending stupid amounts of money to make their beloved Mac systems into a do-it-all workstation and while it can work, it never works as well as one would hope.

Only reason to buy the DeckLink 4K 12G card is if you can use the 12G SDI enhancements. If you'll be using the HDMI ports, the standard 4K Extreme card is just as good. Personally, I think the AJA io4K is a superior solution however if you're running Resolve, you're locked into BMD hardware. For the 12G card, there is not enough bandwidth in a TB2 port to utilize all of its SDI functionality, so consider that if you go the expander route.
 
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I got asked for a screenshot of how I'm working in DaVinci Resolve mere moments after that last post, here's what it looks like:

 
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