October 30th Announcement Feedback

[Leaf Baimbridge]

Could I talk the person taking the product photos into throwing something in like a coin to get a sense of scale?

 

[David J. Shuman]

Jim & RED Team, SIMPLY AMAZING STUFF!!! - Love the 8X Lens, Definetly a Scarlet or 2 in my Future (2 for each eye) - Thanks Red for sharing all of this with us.

 

[David Rasberry]

I'm curious as to how friendly this 1-ring fixed lens will be to "vertigo" shots (zooming in while the camera dollys out and pulling focus)

logic tells me not very, though i could be wrong.

if RED offers a good 3-ring zoom lens to go with the 2/3" non-fixed at a reasonable price then i guess thats the route i'll take.

Considering that zoom and focus moves are likely to be programmable, it should be very friendly to that type of shot.

 

[Shane Nassiri]

AND ridiculing those with a different point of views is also very good corporate culture. So much so that people who agree with me can't say it in public and had to send me a PM instead. :thumbsup:

Red is anything but a conventional corporate culture. The good far outweighs the bad, in this case.

 

[Jannard]

You are right. Creating a feedback program which is made only from very early Red One owners, who were ready to put a deposit for a camera before it even existed, or when it was not fully functional, users who are extremely technical, and who are a very certain type of people, are those users who are perfect to test a new system which is meant to be mass produced and sold to only "slightly" less sophisticated users.

Not to mention that from the above type, they should also be the ones who are extra patient (who are less bothered by faults and problems), and who are early cult followers (who will probably prefer to keep some remarks to themselves over making Red think they are "bitches" and get flamed).

This will ensure a wide range of feedback indeed and that is exactly the type of people who should test a new mass produced system which is meant for everybody.

I didn't say they do it "solely for the purposes of people telling them everything is ay-okay", and I understand this is meant to reward early users, but it is also a little counter productive and I just tried to point that out.

AND ridiculing those with a different point of views is also very good corporate culture. So much so that people who agree with me can't say it in public and had to send me a PM instead. :thumbsup:

I think that you (and those that PM'd you) have missed the point. SS shot Ché on pre-production cameras moths before the 1st RED ONEs were released. All he had was 24fps, run-stop, record to compact flash and Build 2 (or something like that). He had original color science, and not much more. He told us what he wanted, yet never complained or felt the need to trash us in public for what was missing. He knew what he was getting into and chose to go with it. SS was the ultimate "glass half full" guy... perfect for an "Alpha-tester". That's what we need with the Tattoo program. Pretty easy stuff to understand. What we learned (without complaints or drama) from SS lead to many improvements and fixes. And the movie got made.

Some people feel the need to "over-dramatize" an alpha or beta program.. to "expose" weaknesses that we already know about. This isn't helpful in early development. If one doesn't understand this... no problem. But that person is just not a good candidate to help with the Tattoo program.

Peter Jackson and Soderbergh ARE on the Tattoo program. They aren't afraid to tell us what they think. But they also have vision where the program is and where it is going. And are patient while we fine-tune the cameras.

It sounds like you are confused that we only want to hear good things. That is not the case. A "good" tester does tell us the bad stuff... all of it. He/she just does it in a way that is productive.

When SS had heat issues (now solved) on the 1st day of the shoot, his team told us, used ice packs to keep going, and waited for a firmware upgrade. SS didn't post the issue... I did. And I posted it the same day we found out.

So what exactly is your point? I don't quite get it.

Jim

 

[Eki Halkka]

Considering that zoom and focus moves are likely to be programmable, it should be very friendly to that type of shot.

Yep - Sony's HVR-Z1 has simple programming: record start and end zoom / focus settings, set the length of transition, then play those back (it might have had rudimentary ease in/out control too, i've forgotten).

I've used the feature once, a few years ago... you guessed it, for a track in / zoom out shot. It made things MUCH easier, as there's two less variables to worry about: just concentrate on the dolly and framing and the camera does the rest.

 

[J. Eric Camp]

DoubleO,
First off, you might want to add a name to your sig to comply with the board rules.

Secondly, what are you expecting to accomplish with this dialogue?
Red is going to conduct a closed beta program using trusted and DEMANDING users that will run the gamut of users archetypes. This is a good thing. When (and if) you get a RED product it will be a solid piece of kit. How is this a bad thing?

 

[Gavin Greenwalt]

When Jannard says "good feedback" I'm sure he's referring also to the diligence of the negativity not the content.

Your bug report should say:
"When I restart the camera the first time I attempt to load the new color science I lose one channel of audio. If I disable the monitor output first and then apply color science and then re-enable monitor output the audio will work."

That's "good feedback".

Bad feedback is:
"My audio stopped working."

Really bad feedback is:
"Audio doesn't work and I deleted all the log files."

 

[Imran Farouk]

I always thought though to be in this industry you had to be some what sophisticated with this stuff, it's not going to people that are picking up cameras for the first time, if they are going to make the investment (4,000 is quite a bit of money for some people) then surely it would make sense that they bothered to understand the system. If they want to know what the difference is between their short film and those of Sundance standard, they'd study and understand the faults in their productions and bring it up to par with it.

Either way right they will be sophisticated. Hardly a fan boy as I still use my FX-1 for most shoots, the R1 is a bit heavy take around and also, given some areas we use it in, we just don't feel too safe bringing it along given some of the stories of it being stolen. The camera's brilliant and i love its abilities whenever I've used it. I wish i could use it everyday. Though I would hate to have someone join the program and pretty much send the RED team back to the drawing board...instead rather someone propell them forward and the program forward. I'm sure there's some Epic's being tested around the place already (assuming here!) but I would hardly say the guy thats buying a Sony camcorder from Best buy will suddenly see the Scarlet next to it and go 'wow...I'll buy this!'...its harder, more sophisticated but obviously a lot more latitude to what can be done with it...

All Jannard is looking for (which they are chosing so they will find) is those users that are pretty much willing to put this in the worst of situations (So...Peter Jackson hooking it up to a plane etc. with the potential for hell to break loose!) and to put it in the best of situations. Give positive and negative CONSTRUCTIVE feedback. Its not a difficult concept...I don't see any other company currently opening their doors like this...

We will all find flaws with the camera, Stage Two and Three that maybe stage one didn't...when it comes to the masses then...it'll be a great camera...its then your choice to have it or not...

Early investors isn't such a bad thing but its those that were willing to take a dive and take the wild ride. Basically they understood what they were getting themselves into thats all the point of taking the lower serial numbers is. Doubt RED wants someone coming back whilst alpha testing going 'MY PRODUCTIONS GONE TO HELL CAUSE OF THIS CAM!'...

Anyway...if those people that PM'd you are afraid of saying it? why think it? its an open forum. No one is going to come in the middle of the night and tear you apart...feedback pushes this world forward..discussions do too...its what lead to Stage Two if I'm not wrong... :biggrinjester:

Edit:

Think the worst feed back is:

"Audio doesn't work.Fix it."

"What was wrong?"

"Don't know."

"Log files?"

"You needed those?!"

 

[JanneJansson]

Peter Jackson and Soderbergh ARE on the Tattoo program. They aren't afraid to tell us what they think. But they also have vision where the program is and where it is going. And are patient while we fine-tune the cameras.

hehe, RED really turned the world upside down. In a normal world everybody would complain to have untested and buggy equipment. In a normal world you don't have A-list directors beta testing cameras that every other joe-smoe will use. I love it and, I also want a TATTOOOOO! ..but stageII is also wonderful :cheers2:

 

[Djordje]

Jim,why do you eaven bother to writte when he is obviously not well-meaning.
I have something to say to "DoubleORed" and all others who share his point:

You see,I live in a country where typical familly can't afford a consumer still camera for 300$ or more..I am in the same situation. I also have a childish dream that someone would just give me for free camera I want and that it would have all the good things inside etc. because I have no money..But I dont think like that. No metter how tough it is I am overthrilled what Red is doing,I am watching and enjoying just watching this good revolution,and I can't comprehend people who complain about something ,because, yesterday-only few people could make a movie,but tomorow-anyone could make one-THANKS TO RED
So,I could complain(for lack of money)-but I dont, and you shouldnt-but you do..Is this ok for you ?

Jim,dont waste time with us-go work while you are young,go and make us happy.
P.S. I dont see how - you made me happy months ago

 

[Justin O'Neill]

I second that "red-itable" (ya i went there) scarlet footage would help a lot in terms of making sure my editing suite is ready to go. 3K footage is certainly going to be strenuous on some systems, although proxies etc. should facilitate that.

Brad, things have really changed for editing REDCODE RAW in the past 6 months. I am sitting here with my jaw on the floor after installing REDCINE-X on my windows vista machine. Drag n' drop R3D files into the timeline and select resolutions from "full" to "1/8". Rez change is realtime with a click of the mouse. At 1/8 rez I can edit 4k RAW files directly on a modest windows machine. You have got to try it.

This same workflow is available in Adobe Premiere and Vegas 9 now. Drag n drop RAW files onto the timeline and cut at whatever rez your machine can handle. No waiting for transcoding. It just works.

 

[Michael Brennan]

Programable zoom and focus?????

complete game changer .... again

The technology (shot boxes) has been around for decades, making it readily available for PL mount is new.


Mike Brennan

 

[Brad Walton]

Is the Scarlet 2/3" Cinema a DSMC system?

 

[Ivana]

Jim,why do you eaven bother to writte when he is obviously not well-meaning.
I have something to say to "DoubleORed" and all others who share his point:

You see,I live in a country where typical familly can't afford a consumer still camera for 300$ or more..I am in the same situation. I also have a childish dream that someone would just give me for free camera I want and that it would have all the good things inside etc. because I have no money..But I dont think like that. No metter how tough it is I am overthrilled what Red is doing,I am watching and enjoying just watching this good revolution,and I can't comprehend people who complain about something ,because, yesterday-only few people could make a movie,but tomorow-anyone could make one-THANKS TO RED
So,I could complain(for lack of money)-but I dont, and you shouldnt-but you do..Is this ok for you ?

Jim,dont waste time with us-go work while you are young,go and make us happy.
P.S. I dont see how - you made me happy months ago

Honney,I think exactley the way you do. It is realy waisting of Jim's time for answering to these guys instead of resting (I am wondering how is he managing to do all that he is doing?!)...
I hope that I'll also make my husband happy by taking the loan from bank for that precious RED Skarlet beauty.

Good luck Jim!

 

[Jarred Land]

Is the Scarlet 2/3" Cinema a DSMC system?

Absolutely...

 

[Steve Murray]

There isn't a person in the world who is more happy about this than me, I have been waiting for something like this for 10 years. I am going to quite my job as a web designer and write/direct a feature, I just started a 4 weeks time editing course this week and I'm planning to start writing the scrip within a few weeks.

I think the 2nd of this persons 11 posts explains a lot...

Real name please.

 

[Rick Presas]

Yep - Sony's HVR-Z1 has simple programming: record start and end zoom / focus settings, set the length of transition, then play those back (it might have had rudimentary ease in/out control too, i've forgotten).

I've used the feature once, a few years ago... you guessed it, for a track in / zoom out shot. It made things MUCH easier, as there's two less variables to worry about: just concentrate on the dolly and framing and the camera does the rest.

this is reassuring. I've never done it any other way that "the old fashined" way (ie: 2 AC's and a very frustrated dolly grip)


EDIT:

Jim or Jarred,

That scarlet fixed pic looks awesome. If my brain is scaling it corrctly, then it looks like the brain/lens itself will be SMALLER than it is in that picture! thats exciting!

 

[Gavin Greenwalt]

Its not a difficult concept...I don't see any other company currently opening their doors like this...

Lots of companies have closed betas. I don't see this being any more open than most other companies, the market is just much smaller so degrees of separation are less.

Canon and Nikon always field test their beta cameras with professional photographers. The Genesis/F35 all went through pretty extensive beta programs. I think the F23 was beta tested on Speed Racer amongst other productions.

 

[Antoine MARTEAU]

Some people feel the need to "over-dramatize" an alpha or beta program.. to "expose" weaknesses that we already know about. This isn't helpful in early development. If one doesn't understand this... no problem. But that person is just not a good candidate to help with the Tattoo program.

Jim

Maybe "one" should go back to work...
Criticism is not the issue. How one point out a problem is...
Not helping at all...
:frown2:

Good luck to all Tatoos...