Nov. 3rd take 2...

[IAN SUN]

Blast from the past!

I'm having trouble imagining how you would operate this rig.

This best I can come up with is this guy:

Hey Alex, this is who would take command of the Scarlet 3D construct.

 

[Adam Johnson]

I'm sure the government will be shooting Red Epic during there "first" documented meeting with aliens. I sure would be

 

[Häakon]

hands down RED creates some of the best images but the only way you can put a RED camera in everyones hand is if it's cheap. Look at the 7D...60D..T3i yeah the images suck but people will buy them without complaining even though we all know the truth (except producers haha).

if we can get a brain that starts at $3500 then RED can do what Canon does and then some.

I'm really confused I get that RED wants to satisfy customers but they've already won the battle, they have the baller'est camera around but only for the few who need it. Hopefully Nov. 3 changes all that.

Post of the year.

 

[Nuka Wølk]

The XL-1 was my first big boy camera. I loved that thing!

Yup. XL-1 - me to the camera I used to make my first film before that I'd only been playing around, making "short's" with "small" camcorders and my school's HUGE VHS camera Oh dear...

 

[Phil Anderson]

Well, that would be awesome, if a Scarlet (interchangeable) brain came in at $3500. That would indeed create a large stir. The only potential advantage the DSLR type shooter would have then is a large chip, which many have fallen in love with. But with 3k/4k, HDRx, RAW, overcranking to 120/150, etc. Scarlet would definitely attract people anyway. But I'd be surprised to see a price that low. I think right now if they can get the Scarlet (fixed) with the touch screen, Redmote, CF module, for under $7k, it would make a great splash.

 

[Paul Ellington]

I think people are asking RED for a bit much no? More features = more $... DSLRS don't look nearly as good as red, even with the big chip, and oh you wanna shooting something moving faster ... Say hello to my friend jello... DSLRS are not even in the same ballpark, which means they shouldn't be compared, and price-point to price-point should in fact be different.

 

[Zeb B]

N3 N3 N3 N3 N3 N3!!!!​

 

[Kirk.Attard]

I totally agree with Paul.. I think all the hype is making people excpect too much of Scarlet.. It wont be a cheaper version of Epic. Epic is so competitively priced already as it it. We wont get a Scarlet for say 6000$ but with 4k instead of 5k forexample. That would be ridiculos. Scarlet will be a whole new little beast... I'm not trying to think too much about the specs so I will be blown away once it gets out. But expecting the Scarlet to be 4k and 120 fps insted of 300 for a third of the price is asking a bit too much I think.
Scarlet will target a much larger audience I think and that opens tonnes of possiblities. From the snobby rich dad wanting to film his little kid blowing her candle in RAW to the aspiring film maker trying to break in the industry with a mini series or perhpas a high end commercial or music videos.

The thing is. Epic is such and amazing camera as is that I really cant think where Scarlet will fit. I'm sure Jim and co have done their homework well. I have faith in that. So I leave it in their hand to blow us all away.

 

[Phil Anderson]

I understand that. But after the talk three years ago of 3k at $3k (granted, a very different design) and at NAB Ted talking about a working Scarlet for "about $6k", to now face a price approaching $10k - a 40% increase, even if Scarlet is 4k, would put a lot of people off I think.

 

[Travis Freeburg]

Yup. XL-1 - me to the camera I used to make my first film before that I'd only been playing around, making "short's" with "small" camcorders and my school's HUGE VHS camera Oh dear...

Same here....

I miss both of my XL-1's... they just don't make em like that anymore lol....

 

[Zeb B]

Quik Math:
6 to 10 is an 80% increase
10 to 6 is a 40% decrease

4K Raw at $10K is a bargain

 

[John Caballero]

If there is anything good about RED... it is the core belief that 1080P (or 2K) is not a reasonable replacement for film. We started our business based on this belief. Finally, it seems like others have finally agreed. No matter what happens going forward, our success and legacy will be based on this simple thought. 1080P is not good enough. 4K delivery is.

This statement from Mr. Jannard on another thread no doubt confirms that the Scarlet will be 4K. Now, sensor size?

 

[Phil Anderson]

Quik Math:
6 to 10 is an 80% increase
10 to 6 is a 40% decrease

4K Raw at $10K is a bargain

Is it? When you were perfectly willing, and preparing, to spend $6-7k for 3k? But compared to what else is out there, in that regard, yes.

I know adding percentages is strange, but is increasing a price from $6k to $10k an 80% increase? I'm no mathematician.

 

[IAN SUN]

This statement from Mr. Jannard on another thread no doubt confirms that the Scarlet will be 4K. Now, sensor size?

I don't really think it settles the question of what resolution Scarlet will come in at.

The question that RED has already delivered an answer to is: "what is the resolution standard that is good enough to replace the Gold Standard of 35mm film?".

Epic (and in many ways the R1 before it) is the camera that delivers the resolution to be a worthy successor to 35mm film.

Scarlet is another beast entirely. Many beautiful films, documentary and drama, have been shot on S16mm and that is a format that cries out for a digital reincarnation.

 

[Lawrence Bansbach]

Quik Math:
6 to 10 is an 80% increase

No, it's not. It's an approximately 67% increase.

 

[Iain Philpott]

Ian, can you clarify your terminology and units? The Epic produces a 14 MegaPIXEL image, and yes, it can't be expected to be the equal of a 100 MegaPIXEL image. In terms of MegaBYTES, a TIFF from EPIC should be about 80 MegaBYTES in file size. (14 MegaPixels) x (16 bit depth) x (1 Byte per 8 bits) x (3-color RGB) --> ~80 MB TIFF. EPIC owners who have pulled TIFF stills from motion are welcome to correct me.

First of all forget the difference between 8 bit & 16 bit. Yes I know it doubles the file size but in the real world does it effect resolution - not in one iota. First of all it is not a Tiff. You can make it a Tiff but it is not one by origination. As to doubling the colour space (16 bit v 8 bit)- does not matter - it's unprintable by most magazines. 80Mb file - you are in dreamland. The absolute most it can be of usable (printable) file size is 42mb and that is only if as a RAW file it processes the same as currently our still frames from Canon & Phase do - and I'm not sure it does?

I am firmly in the DSMC camp but let's not proliferate things that are just not true.

 

[Phil Anderson]

Scarlet is another beast entirely. Many beautiful films, documentary and drama, have been shot on S16mm and that is a format that cries out for a digital reincarnation.

I agree there Ian. I would add a lot of broadcast television; shows from dramas, to reality, to on location are shot with large, cumbersome 2/3" chip cameras, augmented by small camcorders with small chips and highly compressed images. In the right hands Scarlet could replace both of these at once, while increasing image quality, likely by a considerable amount. Imagine shows like Frontline, Axe Men, Travels to the Edge, etc. shot with Scarlet.

 

[Iain Philpott]

Scarlet has two routes. It can be a 2/3rds chip at 4k (which is possible) or it can be a S35 chip at 4K. It can stay a movie camera for whoever wants to use it, as just that a movie camera. At S35 I am in the Q. At 2/3rds I am sort of in the Q. If RED genuinely wants Scarlet to be seen as a DSMC camera then 2/3rds is not an option. If I am (at a average quality of stills) going to persuade my clients of an alternative capture of stills and motion then S35 is an absolute minimum. I still stand in line for EPIC stage 4 because at the moment that is the only camera in the world that genuinely offers a true DSMC capability.

 

[David Rasberry]

This statement from Mr. Jannard on another thread no doubt confirms that the Scarlet will be 4K. Now, sensor size?

it takes 4k to match the resolution of S35mm film scanned at 4k. 3k matches 16mm film, and is plenty of resolution for a 2/3" camera, as good as Alexa. I don't see Red producing a 4k 2/3" camera, it doesn't make sense given the tradeoffs in other areas.

I can see them producing either an APSC 9mp s35 sensor at 4k same format as the original RED 1 M sensor or a 3k 2/3" or both. There is nothing to say there will only be one Scarlet.
It is possible from some remarks Ted made in interviews at IBC that Red can't make the fixed lens 2/3" currently due to parts availability issues with the lens. If this is true, I expect them to most likely produce a 4k S35 model or true super16mm sized 4k interchangeable model instead. Given the strong market movement toward larger sensors, an APSC sized 4k model seems more likely to me.

 

[Scott Miller]

Here is my epiphany, sorry Jim for ruining the Nov 3 surprise Of course this is probably already guessed by someone I missed, so apologies..


Mini-Primes.... 5 piece suite, all T1.8... $6000

All Epic-X Stage II customers have been emailed, Stage II is essentially fulfilled.
(Based on this weeks acceleration. Monday, emails for April '08, Friday multiple Aug '08 emails, 1 month every 1.5 days)

Stage III is opened.

(I am leaving the Scarlet alone )