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  • Hey all, just changed over the backend after 15 years I figured time to give it a bit of an update, its probably gonna be a bit weird for most of you and i am sure there is a few bugs to work out but it should kinda work the same as before... hopefully :)

Leica-M Survival Guide (Dragon and Weapon)

Serge, can you post a pic or video showing the 38mm diameter part of the 21mm 'Lux lens housing extending beyond the lenses bayonet mount when focused to infinity?
 
Scott -- WC belt clip w/ Anton Bauer plate & just the Base Expander ... ? [Is there another belt clip that will take AB batteries ?]
Tx,
Serge
“Perfection is achieved, not when there is nothing more to add, but when there is nothing left to take away.”
― Antoine de Saint-Exupéry, Airman's Odyssey

scott devitte said:
http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/214061-USA/Leica_11604_Summicron_M_28mm_f_2_0_Lens.html
http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/1217508-REG/leica_11672_summicron_m_28mm_f_2_0_asph.html

Previous and newer version with no protrusion. I'll see if B&H will let me try them out.

I want to rig the Helium in the lightest way possible a a carry anywhere camera.

4.7 screen

New small RED v mount battery and there you are.
Click to expand...
 
Serge Polevitzky said:
Scott -- WC belt clip w/ Anton Bauer plate & just the Base Expander ... ? [Is there another belt clip that will take AB batteries ?]
Tx,
Serge
“Perfection is achieved, not when there is nothing more to add, but when there is nothing left to take away.”
― Antoine de Saint-Exupéry, Airman's Odyssey
Click to expand...
products_store_dsmc2-jetpack-sdi-expander-front.png
products_thumb_DSMC-Battery-Belt-Clip2.jpg


I want to use these with my Pag v mounts, problem is DSMC Jetpack SDI not shipping yet.
 
10991327_1554452991470686_4409429993066768524_n.jpg


I have high hopes for this little guy on the Helium. I have a nice collection of Canon LTMs. The nice thing about them is that with the adapter tight in the M mount you can screw them off and on. It can be a real pain in the ass to get M mount lenses off and on the RED M mount adapter. These incredibly comfortable loafers are by Velez in Colombia.
 
Les -- will do. It may take a day or two to get to it ..
Tx -
Serge

Sorry about the double post ..

OK, here is a video of the 21mm

https://vimeo.com/177333606
pass is Toothpick

The video somewhat blows my theory of what & where the binding occurs, as the floating elements never protrude beyond the
the metal frame (chrome parts) -- except that one place in the center frame, foreground, where the mount has a "dip."

As I see it, the only place where the floating elements are not shielded from the OLPF "baffles" is at the "dip." The floating
elements do elevate, but below the top part of the chrome surrounds of the flange. The exit pupil does not move, so it seems
very unlikely the exit pupil is hitting anything as the lens goes from 1.2m-1.5m, and then starts to bind. It sort of has to be
the floating elements that's causing the binding. But how ?

Hmm. Need to think about this before any "carving" on the OLPF.

Back to the drawing board -
Serge
PS Les, the dimensions of the DSMC1 and DSMC2 look to be identical.

Les Hillis said:
Serge, can you post a pic or video showing the 38mm diameter part of the 21mm 'Lux lens housing extending beyond the lenses bayonet mount when focused to infinity?
Click to expand...
 
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Second video -- this time of the 21mm 'Lux (left) and the Zeiss ZM 35mm f/1.4 (right). I tried to get the two lenses such that
their flanges were absolutely level with each other. The Zeiss flange may be a tad higher than the 'Lux. The 'Lux exit pupil
is definitely a bit taller (pokes deeper) than the Zeiss. Doesn't look that much deeper, but the 'Lux may possibly seat enough
deeper that it is what caused the indentation that Les pointed out.

And the video sure proves that I'm not going to put any professional focus pullers out of work ...
https://vimeo.com/177345127
pass is "Toothpick"

Tx -
Serge

Les Hillis said:
Serge, can you post a pic or video showing the 38mm diameter part of the 21mm 'Lux lens housing extending beyond the lenses bayonet mount when focused to infinity?
Click to expand...
 
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Thanks for the video's Serge.

I suspect the 21mm 'Lux rear lens element is extending less than a millimeter (maybe even half a millimeter) between 1.5m and infinity on the focus scale, which would be very hard to see externally, but which could still be enough movement to stop the focus ring from turning.

If so, that's actually good news, as it means you'd have to remove very little material from the OLPF holder to make the lens fit.
 
Les -- Caliper on order -- I'll try a rough measurement of the width of the main 'Lux & Zeiss barrels tonight. With caliper (when it arrives), I'll get a more accurate measurement on the barrel widths, and also the min & max extensions of the main barrels of both the 'Lux & the Zeiss.
==== update ==== Did a rough measurement of the 'Lux's outer cylinder -- 36mm diameter and a rough measurement of the inner cylinder that moves the Floating Element -- diameter is about 30.1mm
I think this says that I'm going to have to whittle a great deal off the OLPF. If it can take that much whittling. See added blue arrows. Need to clear the 36mm diameter of the outer cylinder -- vertical is the tightest -- looks like I need an
additional 6mm,and also need 3mm or so horizontally.



+++++++++++++++++
Operation Started

Caliper arrived. Looks like 14.05mm or so for the depth from Leica Flange to max extension of the exit pupil (which looks to be
a constant to me, no matter what the focus is). The outer-most barrel is 36+mm in diameter, it's the barrel that moves & is the
Floating Element focus mechanism. Inner barrel is 28.9mm - it reaches out the 14.05mm from the Flange to the lens exit pupil.

The "surround" - that thin plastic inlay that establishes the 33mm horizontal & 30mm vertical limits of the opening -- can
be fairly easily removed. It is glued in place & with a little coaxing, it comes away, leaving a much wider and slightly taller opening.

At first, I put a small piece of soft cloth under the inlay and then tried to use scissors to "whittle" the inlay down a bit, but the
inlay plastic disintegrates when the blades attack it. Black plastic shards and shrapnel everywhere. Not good. But I then noticed
that the inlay had come loose -- daylight ! It was then fairly easy to pry it loose.

OK, so for the 21mm 'Lux this is good, but not good enough. What remains when the inlay is removed is an under pinning of
very tough aluminum at the curved upper and lower extremities. Requires a laser to cut or maybe a Dremel and a very steady
hand & then some very serious clean up !

.. followed by some dull black paint to kill the bright aluminum that will be left exposed. I need a bit more than 36mm for the 'Lux
to fit & removing the inlay has opened the vertical to maybe 31mm from 30mm. There is a fair amount of aluminum under the inlay.

If you have a lens with a narrower "tokhes" .. like about 31mm MAX, then just removing the glued-on inlay will probably do the
trick if you need more room.

News when it happens ... no film, as my only OLPF is in a state of flux ..

Tx, Serge

PS Did a "toothpick" measurement of the distance from the OLPF to the Leica Mount Flange: 15mm
Measured the distance from the 21mm 'Lux flange to the max extension of its exit pupil: 14mm

So very, very close, but no contact (maybe lots of CA, etc., but we're not that far along yet).

Definitely looks like I need to remove 6mm vertically & 3mm horizontally, if the floating element barrel is ever going to
extend beyond 1.2 / 1.5 meters. Thinking about how I'll remove that much. The area under the vertical "round" sections (where
the blue arrows point to) has some "reinforcing" material, so it probably won't be just cutting the thin "baffles."

To be continued ...
Serge

Aug 10 update
+++++++++++

Got this from Peter at Leica (BTW, Peter has been very helpful !):
Diameter of moving barrel (the floating elements ?) is 36.2mm ± 0.1mm. Bought a Dremel® and attacked the aluminum vertical
top & bottom & destroyed the OLPF. Bought a new OLPF & RED overnighted it to me (only had one OLPF). Got the tungsten-carbide
bits (was using the finer finishing bits), and did a test on the damaged OLPF & the tungsten-carbide bits do a better job, but it still
takes a great deal of grinding. If there is another attempt, it should go better.

Waiting to see if the 8K Vista Vision OLPFs have a wider vertical & horizontal opening, and if so what are the dimensions. RED
has been ultra silent on this question. Will continue to gently poke them.

Les Hillis said:
Thanks for the video's Serge. I suspect the 21mm 'Lux rear lens element is extending less than a millimeter (maybe even half a millimeter) between 1.5m and infinity on the focus scale, which would be very hard to see externally, but which could still be enough movement to stop the focus ring from turning. If so, that's actually good news, as it means you'd have to remove very little material from the OLPF holder to make the lens fit.
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Lakis -- welcome to the forum ! As I recall, the 24mm is closely related to the 21mm in that it also has a floating element. The focusing mechanism for the floating element is a barrel that surrounds
the main lens housing. This 'outer barrel' is, I think, what is impacting the OLPF housing. At least, this was/is the case with my 21mm.

Take a look at the floating element as it extends as you focus the 24mm toward infinity.

Next, measure the diameter of this extending barrel. You can do a crude measurement by taking a piece of, say, unwaxed dental floss and tying a knot in it to mark a starting point. Then wrap the floss
around the outer (floating element) barrel and note where the floss crosses the knot. Measure the distance & compute the diameter. Or get hold of a good caliper. Chances are you will find that the
floating element diameter is much greater than 30mm (see Les Hills' measurements in a previous posting). So it's probably the top of the OLPF that the 24mm is hitting.

I wound up thinking about using a Dremel to carve out enough room (36+mm needed for my 21mm), and have postponed any more Dremel activities after my first "learning" attempt. If your
measurement is around 30mm, then -- once you remove the thin plastic "surround" of the OLPF -- you may have just enough room for the 24mm.

When mounting the lens, put the focus to the nearest distance first, then very slowly & gently start to move the focus toward infinity. I found that the 21mm nudged the OLPF at about 1.2m. You may
find that the 24mm can focus further -- it would be another data point if you could share that point of nudging the OLPF with the forum.

As a last resort, you might try without any OLPF. I did & found that the OLPF also changes the plane of focus, so at infinity the 21mm was "in focus" at maybe 9 feet. I added an external UV +IR
filter and the lens was sharp, even in the corners, and required only a moderate amount of color correction. Still, 9 feet was as "distant" as it could focus. The images looked quite sharp, though.

This help ?

Tx,
Serge
Lakis Amarantithis said:
I have problems mounting this lens on a Dragon with the Red M mount. http://www.red.com/store/products/dsmc-al-leica-m-mount
Is there any way to modify the 24mm M Leica 1.4 or any advice to fit this adapter?
Thanks.
Click to expand...
 
Hi Serge!
Thank you for your valuable advice. Of course, I'm sure it helps. The 24mm 1.4 is a gem and I really like to see if I can use it. I will follow every step and get back to you.
Lakis
 
Lakis -- you are more than welcome ... and your data will fill in more of the unknowns about the 24mm 'Lux.

BTW, there is another thread on Leica-M

[h=1]Dragon + Leica M lenses - Whats your favorite leica m lens with Dragon??[/h]
You might want to browse it as well.

Tx !
Serge

Lakis Amarantithis said:
Hi Serge!
Thank you for your valuable advice. Of course, I'm sure it helps. The 24mm 1.4 is a gem and I really like to see if I can use it. I will follow every step and get back to you.
Lakis
Click to expand...
 
I'm going to Cinetec in Munich an then to photokina hopefully to see these. Really hoping they work on RED mount
 
Lakes --

Peter Brieger from Leica Germany sent info that the 24mm 'Lux has an extension of 12,2mm (OK, he's European, hence the comma) so you should not hit the OLPF
because of this dimension, since the OLPF is maybe 14mm or even a bit more from the rear flange. Good news on this part.

But Peter also sent that the diameter is 30,1mm -- hence you are probably just hitting the plastic "surround" of the OLPF at the top & bottom.

Suggest you do a very accurate measurement of the vertical opening on your OLPF. IIRC, it is pretty much spot on at 30.0mm -- but if it is a
shade less, that'll only make the diagnosis of the lens being just a bit too wide at the top & bottom to make it through the vertical of the OLPF that much more
likely to be correct. If brave, you may think about removing the plastic "surround" of the OLPF -- it is just lightly glued and may get you an extra
mm or so of clearance.

Good luck & please repot what you find & do -
Serge


Lakis Amarantithis said:
Hi Serge!
Thank you for your valuable advice. Of course, I'm sure it helps. The 24mm 1.4 is a gem and I really like to see if I can use it. I will follow every step and get back to you.
Lakis
Click to expand...
 
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Would anybody on this thread be interested in playing with some RD3's from my Canon LTM's 35,50,85,100 shot on Helium with M mount?
 
Scott -- Wow ! Please, Oh please, some .r3D files from Helium + whatever lenses you have shot with via the RED Leica-M mount !
Name your way of distribution.

Thanks !
Serge
PS Could you also measure & post the vertical & horizontal openings of your Helium 8K OLPFs ....


scott devitte said:
Would anybody on this thread be interested in playing with some RD3's from my Canon LTM's 35,50,85,100 shot on Helium with M mount?
Click to expand...
 
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