KOMODO....

[L. Langer]

I won't pretend that I know what this camera is, but if it's what I think (and hope) it is, then it will sell very well to people that want the power of RED in a small hand-held body for run-and-gun work.

 

[Jarred Land]

Absolutely. I have no doubt what Red does is incredibly difficult. but what irked me the most about the Hydrogen was the lack of communication - there are still people over at h4vuser.net saying Android Pi is coming and asking when Red monitoring will be possible. And who can blame them when nobody from Red has told them otherwise?

I understand that too. But I hope you can separate Komodo from that experience. remember, Hydrogen until the news was a completely separate company operationally from RED Camera. Different engineers, different marketing , different Manufacturing , different sales , etc... everyone except for Jim. Even h4vuser I have nothing to do with. So I totally understand the confusion, as even internally it was confusing

Silver lining though now we have Tommy and Jamin and a bunch of really incredible talent that came from Hydrogen at Red now that are already making huge improvements to the business. So it actually did make us stronger.

 

[Jarred Land]

Ouch :tongue_smilie:

Oops sorry didn’t mean for that to be an ouch... you called yourself the pain in the ass guy and I thought you wore that as a badge of honor. I like it I almost wanna change your little thing under your name here to that.

Nobody likes a critic. You have a ton of critics here for being a critic.

A lot of people see you as ”that guy” that goes to a house party and tells the owner of the house in front of everyone that he cuts his grass wrong. But I know you are more than that and you just want things the way you want them.

Just remember If that’s who you want to be.. “ That Guy” , and you want a little less friction from being that guy, then you probably need to be a bit more open to people disagreeing with you. I think you spend way too much time here fighting with people that don’t agree with you. That approach may make you appear to be a lot less ad hominem

 

[Robert Hofmeyr]

I understand that too. But I hope you can separate Komodo from that experience. remember, Hydrogen until the news was a completely separate company operationally from RED Camera. Different engineers, different marketing , different Manufacturing , different sales , etc... everyone except for Jim. Even h4vuser I have nothing to do with. So I totally understand the confusion, as even internally it was confusing

Silver lining though now we have Tommy and Jamin and a bunch of really incredible talent that came from Hydrogen at Red now that are already making huge improvements to the business. So it actually did make us stronger.

Okay. I'll try. Thanks for your time Jarred. Let's see where this thing goes.

 

[Bob Gundu]

People can say what they want about RED, but the fact that you can engage here with the President speaks volumes.

Love you man.

That said, I think the direction that Komodo is going is super smart. Not that long ago before the ARRI Mini, RED was used by everyone for gimbal and aerial work no matter what the main camera was. I have a feeling Komodo is going to be that Trojan horse again.

 

[Samir Patel]

^^ just wish it was out sooner. But patience is a virtue

 

[Han Vogen]

People can say what they want about RED, but the fact that you can engage here with the President speaks volumes.

I will agree with this. As a potential first time Red buyer I am happy to see upper management openly corresponding with customers.

Can we expect to see this camera released in 2019?

 

[Nathan L Collett]

You need to swing big to make a meaningful change/improvement/invention and sometimes those big swings miss. I know it seems like the end of the world to some people, but we have been here before.

REDRAY, The Projector, The Meizler Module, A whole bunch of 3D stuff that you guys never even saw, etc. etc. etc. The 8k VV Dragon Almost suffered the same fate. Some of you remember that... And Gemini too... that almost didn't work out.

I know from the customer side of the fence all this stuff seems easy... like the pain-in-the-ass-guy telling us "o just add a few extra frame rates for me please, how hard could it be" .... but making stuff is hard... specially when you are the first to do it.

well said. I think some of us who have been with red from near beginning with red one are worried that the competition could take the company down. at the sametime this could be positive, failures leading to better results. I want red to continue even if I ever change to another camera because the industry needs red, to push, prod, fail and achieve new boundaries.

 

[Nathan L Collett]

I understand that too. But I hope you can separate Komodo from that experience. remember, Hydrogen until the news was a completely separate company operationally from RED Camera. Different engineers, different marketing , different Manufacturing , different sales , etc... everyone except for Jim. Even h4vuser I have nothing to do with. So I totally understand the confusion, as even internally it was confusing

Silver lining though now we have Tommy and Jamin and a bunch of really incredible talent that came from Hydrogen at Red now that are already making huge improvements to the business. So it actually did make us stronger.

I think this is important to note. hydrogen got tons of flack online and it diminished red but its not red. but it kinda felt like it was.

 

[Nathan L Collett]

People can say what they want about RED, but the fact that you can engage here with the President speaks volumes.

Love you man.

That said, I think the direction that Komodo is going is super smart. Not that long ago before the ARRI Mini, RED was used by everyone for gimbal and aerial work no matter what the main camera was. I have a feeling Komodo is going to be that Trojan horse again.

amen. lets hope red changes the game the way we know they can.

 

[Edward Saltau]

I shoot a lot of wildlife with a helium on a Movi. If this can become my new gimbal camera that I basically never have to take off the rig I’ll be very happy. I can keep the 50-1000 on the helium and have the Komodo setup for the gimbal at any moment. However, for wildlife, most of everything I shoot is in the 40-60fps range. I’m very much hoping that the Komodo will do 60fps at full res for this reason. The BBC and Nat Geo request everything to be delivered in 7k (unless you need the frame rates) so 6k can probably be justified by having a camera specially for the gimbal rig. But any further drop in resolution and they’ll stick with the Helium.

 

[David J. Buchanan]

I wish RED would focus on ONE oven and make the color as good as it can be.

Then, focus on the processing in the body and making that as good as it can be, with the same compact size.

 

[Christoffer Glans]

I almost wanna change your little thing under your name here to that.

That's a bit tempting hehe

That approach may make you appear to be a lot less ad hominem

I might be a critic, but I rarely, if at all falls into ad hominem per its definition. If there's one thing I dislike, it's when people start criticizing someone on a personal level. I don't mind being a critic, as long as the critique or argument are on-topic and subject. I could fall back on my philosophy schoolings since its purpose is to reduce any kind of bias and fallacy, but that level of analytical rhetoric would drive people even madder

 

[paulcurtis]

Jarred, why are Hydrogen owners getting a discount on this camera? I agree it creates expectations and I struggle to understand what the rationale is when Komodo is a bad fit for most Hydrogen owners

I preordered the H1 on day one because of the camera side and also the suggestion it would control the Red as well. Neither of which really turned out - but it was my choice to pre-order and that's fine. But if that choice turns out that i can save on what i really thought i was going to end up with now then that's kudos to Red and a loyalty issue...

Also that tease of global shutter is major news... or just a very fast read out?

The jello in cameras has bugged me for years, even on screen, it's like an instability and certainly trying to work with that footage can be a nightmare.

This to me is a really really big deal...

cheers
Paul

 

[Mathias Erichsen]

...remember, Hydrogen until the news was a completely separate company operationally from RED Camera. Different engineers, different marketing , different Manufacturing , different sales , etc... everyone except for Jim. Even h4vuser I have nothing to do with. So I totally understand the confusion, as even internally it was confusing

Just checked, and besides from having the Hydrogen announcement here on reduser.net, I also got my order receipt from no-reply@red.com... I ordered my Hydrogen within a couple minutes after the announcement so this may have changed at some later point, but that surely made it a bit confusing.

Looking forward to Komodo is released and as far as what we have seen so far, I’ll most definitely buy it.
Really hope the Hydrogen-discount is good

 

[Lauri Kettunen]

.... but making stuff is hard... specially when you are the first to do it.

Thank you Jarred. The whole thing around Hydrogen starts to make a lot of sense. It sounds you are effectively saying: the vision was to make a small and light "media machine" and employ in it the new sensor you had started to develop. That would have been the camera module for Hydrogen, and all this had fulfilled Jim's long term goal of a pocket size professional camera (at least since "the 3K for 3K$ camera" project).

Since something did not go as planned –I can truly appreciate the difficulty of making some embedded digital system for the first time– with Hydrogen, the goal was shifted to Komodo. It will not be a media machine –whatever that meant– but Komodo will realise the (or Jim's long term?) goal of as small and light professional quality camera as possible. And that's marvellous.

With hindsight, is it fair to say, there was a bit of wishful thinking behind marketing Hydrogen in a rather early stage when not all critical issues were solved? This is not criticism, as without such kind of thinking there would be far less new innovative things. Instead, I think, many would appreciate if Red truly recognises quite many old customers shared the risks of the Hydrogen project although very little of information were given of the risks beyond possible delays. I think that was a significant sign of trust on the Red developing team.

 

[Jarred Land]

Thank you Jarred. The whole thing around Hydrogen starts to make a lot of sense. It sounds you are effectively saying: the vision was to make a small and light "media machine" and employ in it the new sensor you had started to develop. That would have been the camera module for Hydrogen, and all this had fulfilled Jim's long term goal of a pocket size professional camera (at least since "the 3K for 3K$ camera" project).

Since something did not go as planned –I can truly appreciate the difficulty of making some embedded digital system for the first time– with Hydrogen, the goal was shifted to Komodo. It will not be a media machine –whatever that meant– but Komodo will realise the (or Jim's long term?) goal of as small and light professional quality camera as possible. And that's marvellous.

With hindsight, is it fair to say, there was a bit of wishful thinking behind marketing Hydrogen in a rather early stage when not all critical issues were solved? This is not criticism, as without such kind of thinking there would be far less new innovative things. Instead, I think, many would appreciate if Red truly recognises quite many old customers shared the risks of the Hydrogen project although very little of information were given of the risks beyond possible delays. I think that was a significant sign of trust on the Red developing team.

Yup... totally get it. Ambition and hope doesn't always lead to reality... I've learned that lesson a long time ago. It's why Komodo doesn't have a public spec sheet yet, because like I have with the last few years of RED camera releases, you hear them when they are ready. I hope that you all get that with Komodo.. I've been very upfront with what Komodo is not from the start.

 

[Rakesh Malik]

Much of this stemmed from days of Mysterium-X and it was a bit more of a littered minefield of variety of visual quality. Things like ND and IR Contamination, crappy LEDs, etc. All played a role. There's some absolutely stunning Mysterium-X work out there though.

My first experience with a Red was on some dufous' old Mysterium-X (Epic, IIRC) camera. Ht was "teaching" a class on using Red cameras which ended up taking around 4x as long as simply reading the manual and playing would have, but since it was less expensive than renting a Red for the same amount of time at least I got to try it. The footage was nothing great out of the box, which was as much due to the lighting as anything else (the dumbass didn't get me much time to light, and the classmates didn't know what the <bleep> they were doing, so they weren't much help).

When I started manipulating the footage in Resolve though, I was really surprised at first how much latitude there was, and second how nice I was able to make the fairly flat original look in spite of not having the lighting that I wanted.

Once we got to these advanced sensors with way more color and less of an issue under different color sources then following that with the tone mapping of IPP2 to help fix some of the out of gamut chaos life has been pretty good when it comes to what people get straight away.

Agreed. I've done a few shoots now where we delivered the footage without grading, and we'll be screening one such short tonight.

I can certainly enhance it a bit in grade, but even straight out of the camera it looks very good in Resolve. Even better in Mistika and Scratch though... Resolve doesn't seem to get the tone mapping right with the IPP2 settings, but Mistika and Scratch both do.

I shot something with spooky hard color earlier this year that pretty much was the worst stress test for any camera to capture due to the high gamut and saturation of the colors themselves as well as extremely broad dynamic range. A few times during that shoot I paused to consider that this was actually being captured in a single, well exposed image somehow with texture, detail, and stability. That shoot still blows my mind on just how filled up the scopes were.

I've been impressed by how well the Helium handles the crappy LEDs that cheapass concert venues use, though it also has the side effect of showing very starkly how bad those cheapass LEDs really are...

 

[Fahnon Bennett]

Yup... totally get it. Ambition and hope doesn't always lead to reality... I've learned that lesson a long time ago. It's why Komodo doesn't have a public spec sheet yet, because like I have with the last few years of RED camera releases, you hear them when they are ready. I hope that you all get that with Komodo.. I've been very upfront with what Komodo is not from the start.

I for one appreciate the transparency, and wish more companies would follow the example. It helped me decide not to wait for Komodo after all, and instead get a Scarlet W (which I havent bought yet). It was the max frame rate comment that made the decision for me as I cant have an A camera that doesn't overcrank.

 

[David Rasberry]

Will there be any inherent advantage to H1 integration with Komodo over other similar class smart phones?
I am weighing whether to buy one at the current discounted price.