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  • Hey all, just changed over the backend after 15 years I figured time to give it a bit of an update, its probably gonna be a bit weird for most of you and i am sure there is a few bugs to work out but it should kinda work the same as before... hopefully :)

It‘s a great camera, but... some odd quality issues on #112

Deanan said:
They all have adjustable mounts (via shims). The new mount makes
it easier and faster to adjust.
Click to expand...

Yes, Deanan, but once it is set it's set. No other camera needs this adjustment. As mentioned earlier, I prefer a collimated exact distance of 52mm.

Sebastian
 
ready2roll said:
Thinking of this, it comes as a surprise to me that no other digital camera like D20, Dalsa, Genesis, Weisscam, SI has something like an adjustable lens mount.
Click to expand...


Deanan said:
They all have adjustable mounts (via shims). The new mount makes it easier and faster to adjust.
Click to expand...

Except Genesis.. NO shims for adjustment of the FFD there.

How I understood ready2roll's question, was: is the sensor physically connected to the PL Mount, which can be removed. From What I have seen of the camera, NO, the sensor is not connected to the removable portion of the PL mount. You would not want the sensor being removed from the camera, except by highly trained personel. The sensor is or should be in a fixed position behind the OLPF.
 
The point

The point

overlandfilms said:
FWIW, if I walked into a 1st AC situation and was faced with all metric lenses, I'd be on the phone with the rental house for a replacement set immediately. The rest-of-world is metric and they should have an appropriate toolset for their market. Every 1st AC in the room should agree on this. Period.
Click to expand...

That IS the point.

As far as now we "the rest of the world" had no better official reply than "We just won't do it".
I expect something better from this forum. I do.
Otherwise i wouldn't spend my time here.
We have to decide to cancel our lens orders or not, wasn't this forum intended for this kind of situations?

Just tell us why and we'll decide what to do with our orders OR we could try to find a solution together (like extra money, waiting more etc.)

Anyway, STILL thinking RED is underestimating a critical customer issue.
 
Stephen Williams said:
Hi Deanan,

Very easy, place the shim between the mount & camera!

Stephen
Click to expand...

Obviously but...One piece meaning the sensor and mount are physically attached as one piece. That is not obviously the case as the sensor, intermediate pieces, and PL are all connected but not one piece as was implied.
 
Deanan said:
Obviously but...One piece meaning the sensor and mount are physically attached as one piece. That is not obviously the case as the sensor, intermediate pieces, and PL are all connected but not one piece as was implied.
Click to expand...
Deanan - it is all a bit confusing. The best way would be if you / Red could publish a technical drawing - so we all could imagine how it is and speculating has an end.
It is really a little horror for us - because so many people are reading on this forum and calling us asking stupid and non stupid questions.
 
ready2roll said:
But I do feel the PL mount should be a lot smoother, or let's say more Arri-like <snip> and one goal was to get the mount less sticky....
Click to expand...

It is interesting to read this; and I am beginning to wonder whether RED has a qualified metallurgist, or at least someone with sound knowledge in this field?

This all sounds to me like a classic case of stick-slip.

There are numerous ways to surface treat aluminum. It's not just a one-anodize-fits-all. Care needs to be taken as to what the mating material is, and exactly what the requirements are of the part in question.
Strength of the part's material (7075) is only a small portion of what the material has to be capable of. Since this is a mount that experiences another material being run against it NUMEROUS times during lens mounting/removing; I am now beginning to wonder excactly what surface treatment that 7075 underwent, considering the descriptions of #112.

RED, if you're listening, aluminum can be treated in a plethora of ways to suit one's needs. Something like a dry-lubricated hard surface treatment should be looked at and tested. There's ways to bring the friction coefficient down to 0.05!
I wonder if RED just went to some company and said: "Make this ring anodized.....in black please."?

Sounds like a different treatment of the alu ring could solve (or to large degree negate) these "sticky" problems.
:construction:
 
Pig said:
It is interesting to read this; and I am beginning to wonder whether RED has a qualified metallurgist, or at least someone with sound knowledge in this field?

This all sounds to me like a classic case of stick-slip.

There are numerous ways to surface treat aluminum. It's not just a one-anodize-fits-all. Care needs to be taken as to what the mating material is, and exactly what the requirements are of the part in question.
Strength of the part's material (7075) is only a small portion of what the material has to be capable of. Since this is a mount that experiences another material being run against it NUMEROUS times during lens mounting/removing; I am now beginning to wonder excactly what surface treatment that 7075 underwent, considering the descriptions of #112.

RED, if you're listening, aluminum can be treated in a plethora of ways to suit one's needs. Something like a dry-lubricated hard surface treatment should be looked at and tested. There's ways to bring the friction coefficient down to 0.05!
I wonder if RED just went to some company and said: "Make this ring anodized.....in black please."?

Sounds like a different treatment of the alu ring could solve (or to large degree negate) these "sticky" problems.
:construction:
Click to expand...

Finally somebody asks the right question.
 
Curran Giddens said:
After reading this thread all I can say is .... At least we got T-stop marks at no extra charge! :mellow:
Click to expand...

Hi,

On the Zooms they do indeed have a 'T' mark, interesting to know how accurate they are. The primes are marked with 'F' stops.

Stephen
 
Stephen Williams said:
Hi,

On the Zooms they do indeed have a 'T' mark, interesting to know how accurate they are. The primes are marked with 'F' stops.

Stephen
Click to expand...

The 300 mm is marked with F stops. But there's no definite answer about the marks on the other primes yet. I suppose they will have T marks as well.
 
big lebowski said:
The 300 mm is marked with F stops. But there's no definite answer about the marks on the other primes yet. I suppose they will have T marks as well.
Click to expand...

Hi,

When you don't get an answer, then it's fairly obvious (to me).

Stephen
 
Deanan said:
They all have adjustable mounts (via shims). The new mount makes
it easier and faster to adjust.
Click to expand...

could RED explain/show "HOW to Adjust" the new mount ??

also many are going to be using other mounts - how does one get the new PL mount off ?? and back on ...
 
Jim posted this about the new adjustable PL mount:

Loosen the two bolts you see, twist to establish back focus. Lock down. Done. It is solid as a rock when you are finished. The internal threads are fine so it is easy to find absolute zero (or 52mm). The internal mechanism is pretty ingenious.

The original mount works just like all film cameras... it was shim based. Soderbergh's 1st AC checked the mount every single day while shooting two movies on RED prototypes. He never adjusted the mounts once (he did adjust all of them prior to the beginning of the shoot).

Every RED ONE out there with the old mount can be adjusted to be perfect. But all mounts need to be checked and adjusted for "feature film" perfection. And the shim based systems only allow trained professionals to do it. Add in the need for a complete set of shims for any technician to do it and you have a recipe for delays and disappointment. I just did not like the concept of "it has always been done this way, so let's keep doing it that way. This mount is better. Much better. That speaks to the core philosophy of RED.
 
Jarred Land said:
dont assume...

:shiftyph34r:
Click to expand...

Hi Jarred,

Then I hope all the markings on the primes have witness marks & are really accurate, like other lenses 'made in England'

Stephen
 
Phil Bates said:
but I am concerned with the reports of weird friction in the mount and stickyness.
Click to expand...

Phil,
Just to clarify...as best I can determine reading this thread it is only 1 report of "stickyness"...not reports. Before everyone freaks out, lets wait on more information from additional users.
 
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