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  • Hey all, just changed over the backend after 15 years I figured time to give it a bit of an update, its probably gonna be a bit weird for most of you and i am sure there is a few bugs to work out but it should kinda work the same as before... hopefully :)

Is this camera a joke?

What do you mean by "Switch Thread" ? i am a bit confused about this forum..
thanks,

yoni
 
dont be confused i`ll ask here

which build?--------------------------13
redcode 36 or redcode 28?
recorded to CF or Drive?---------------question 2 is important
4k or 3k or 2k?----------------------4k
16:9 or 2:1?------------------------16:9 switched to 2:1
ASA setting?-----------------------
 
Build 13
REDCODE 36
Both HD and FC gave us CODEC ERROR and DF
4k and later 4k 2:1. (The 2:1 seemed to be smooth. But I'll wait for the editor to open the footage before I declare it all happened..)
ASA settings: 320 on day 1 and 400 on day 2 (for exposure reasons)
Bottom line is that if I'll take my LACIE drive here and do the cha cha cha it's gon'a fail. Problem is that camera work is a lot about cha cha cha unless y'r lucky enough to be Theodoros Angelopoulos..
Maybe an extended HD cable will solve the problem of movement. After all it's built to carry a HD and at the same time not recommended to use for hand held. Strong contradiction here.
 
yoni maron said:
Build 13
REDCODE 36
Both HD and FC gave us CODEC ERROR and DF
4k and later 4k 2:1. (The 2:1 seemed to be smooth. But I'll wait for the editor to open the footage before I declare it all happened..)
ASA settings: 320 on day 1 and 400 on day 2 (for exposure reasons)
Bottom line is that if I'll take my LACIE drive here and do the cha cha cha it's gon'a fail. Problem is that camera work is a lot about cha cha cha unless y'r lucky enough to be Theodoros Angelopoulos..
Maybe an extended HD cable will solve the problem of movement. After all it's built to carry a HD and at the same time not recommended to use for hand held. Strong contradiction here.
Click to expand...

Yoni Yoni....
handheld-----use cf
probably you had a bad Drive cable too....did you tried a backup cable/or drive...?
And Redcode 36 to CF is not a good idea

So you made two mistakes.
 
yoni maron said:
Build 13
REDCODE 36
Both HD and FC gave us CODEC ERROR and DF
4k and later 4k 2:1. (The 2:1 seemed to be smooth. But I'll wait for the editor to open the footage before I declare it all happened..)
ASA settings: 320 on day 1 and 400 on day 2 (for exposure reasons)
Bottom line is that if I'll take my LACIE drive here and do the cha cha cha it's gon'a fail. Problem is that camera work is a lot about cha cha cha unless y'r lucky enough to be Theodoros Angelopoulos..
Maybe an extended HD cable will solve the problem of movement. After all it's built to carry a HD and at the same time not recommended to use for hand held. Strong contradiction here.
Click to expand...

Ok the HD should take some abuse (of course within consideration). Normal handheld should be possible but if you want to be sure change to CF cards or definitely if you want to cha cha cha. Although It seems like there must be a dodgy connection with this one (I would report it to the rental house).

I'd like to say that changing to 400ASA for exposer reasons doesn't matter. This is RAW it will always record in 320, the rest is just meta data for the preview, a setting showing you a gain function. It's only relevant if you want to see it in the preview monitor, so to speak.

The 2:1 should work like a charm so don't worry there (fingers crossed).

As for redcode 36 on CF, well I think you know already that's not possible.


regards,


Fredrik Callinggard
 
By the way redcode 36 on CF cards is not possible because the files are to big in bandwith. They're 36MB/s, hence redcode 36 and the CF cards are not fast enough for that. I believe it's actually stated in the manual but could be wrong.

Kind regards,


Fredrik Callinggard
 
OK one last time cause I got to leave the house:
The problem was CODE ERROR and DROP FRAMES. Steve mentioned no DIT on set and now everyone is holding to it. A DIT position was invented for the HD workflow and multi server trucks wiring etc.. I managed many smaller HD shoots with no problem. No control box no server trucks. No I didn't work on SPIDERMAN..
NO " DIT " would be able to solve our problems. He could have however relax me with a quick massage..well I got a nice PA for that.
We solved it partially by shooting on FC and using 4k 2:1. And I'm just a focus puller right !? so what do I know..
The problem is that this camera doesn't like to be moved while shooting. Its a Harddrive. Period. That was the problem and it drained our blood on both days of shoot. The questions now are to be moved to a producer's forum. Seriuosly. There is not to much to say here anymore. Image is crisp. Workflow has serious limitations. Maybe removing the HD from the camera with extension cable would make a huge difference.
 
I could be wrong and it was REDCODE28 ? I most ask the rental house. Yeah the ISO change was for monitor referance off course..

Thanks Wierdcrew and K.BERLIN
 
yoni maron said:
OK one last time cause I got to leave the house:
The problem was CODE ERROR and DROP FRAMES. Steve mentioned no DIT on set and now everyone is holding to it. A DIT position was invented for the HD workflow and multi server trucks wiring etc.. I managed many smaller HD shoots with no problem. No control box no server trucks. No I didn't work on SPIDERMAN..
NO " DIT " would be able to solve our problems. He could have however relax me with a quick massage..well I got a nice PA for that.
We solved it partially by shooting on FC and using 4k 2:1. And I'm just a focus puller right !? so what do I know..
The problem is that this camera doesn't like to be moved while shooting. Its a Harddrive. Period. That was the problem and it drained our blood on both days of shoot. The questions now are to be moved to a producer's forum. Seriuosly. There is not to much to say here anymore. Image is crisp. Workflow has serious limitations. Maybe removing the HD from the camera with extension cable would make a huge difference.
Click to expand...

Dear Yoni,

Have you read K Berlin's posts and mine? We're explaining what went wrong with your shoot.

Code error happens when you're trying to shoot wrong format for the storage you have - like redcode 36 to a CF card, because the card is not fast enough. Or when the storage is not formated correctly.

That shooting 2:1 on CF solved it was something that anyone could have told you.

As for the hardrive it seems to be faulty and it could happen to the best. Most probably also the reason for frame dropping.


Regards,

Fredrik
 
weirdcrew said:
Dear Yoni,

Have you read K Berlin's posts and mine? We're explaining what went wrong with your shoot.

Code error happens when you're trying to shoot wrong format for the storage you have - like redcode 36 to a CF card, because the card is not fast enough. Or when the storage is not formated correctly.

That shooting 2:1 on CF solved it was something that anyone could have told you.

As for the hardrive it seems to be faulty and it could happen to the best. Most probably also the reason for frame dropping.


Regards,

Fredrik
Click to expand...

you are right

WITH A DIT HE WOULDNT START TO SHOOT HANDHELD TO THE RAID AND NEVER EVER WOULD TRY TO SHOOT REDCODE 36 to CF cards...

mybre in a couple of days he will ask how to handle duplicated reel names and start again with such a thread.----hope not
 
K.Berlin said:
you are right

WITH A DIT HE WOULDNT START TO SHOOT HANDHELD TO THE RAID AND NEVER EVER WOULD TRY TO SHOOT REDCODE 36 to CF cards...

mybre in a couple of days he will ask how to handle duplicated reel names and start again with such a thread.----hope not
Click to expand...

I think the problem here is that he feels that what good is a DIT, he has been one. While we mean one that has experience with the camera and foremost this forum, so he has true knowledge of the camera.

I think the general problem with this shoot is still as we feared. Very competent people who didn't know that this camera needs more than just reading the manual.


regards,


Fredrik
 
yoni maron said:
OK one last time cause I got to leave the house:
The problem was CODE ERROR and DROP FRAMES. Steve mentioned no DIT on set and now everyone is holding to it.
Click to expand...
i was pretty silent so far.
IMHO the incompetence of the involved team should rather interest the producer.

i would *not* pay a team witah such failures which additional dares to sell its shortcomings as technical fault: no matter what camera. in the contrary, to be prcise.



A DIT position was invented for the HD workflow and multi server trucks wiring etc..

I managed many smaller HD shoots with no problem. No control box no server trucks. No I didn't work on SPIDERMAN..

yoni maron said:
NO " DIT " would be able to solve our problems. He could have however relax me with a quick massage..well I got a nice PA for that.
We solved it partially by shooting on FC and using 4k 2:1. And I'm just a focus puller right !? so what do I know..
Click to expand...
I thnink its called:
LEARNING BY EARNING.
with that attitude, workers get at least and max *one job* here.

yoni maron said:
The problem is that this camera doesn't like to be moved while shooting. Its a Harddrive. Period. That was the problem and it drained our blood on both days of shoot.
Click to expand...
i think that such basic thin as gravity would overload your planning.
zherefore, siomply said: you have been giving a terrible recommendation: steday and HD is stuoid. Steady and C7F is cool.

yoni maron said:
The questions now are to be moved to a producer's forum. Seriuosly. There is not to much to say here anymore. Image is crisp. Workflow has serious limitations. Maybe removing the HD from the
Click to expand...
camera with extension cable would make a huge difference.[/QUOTE]

i think we will see many selfpromoted dits bitching about a product they cleary cant handel.
 
A quick point:

Yoni - you mentioned that you shot Redcode 36 and Build 13. Redcode 36 was not introduced until after Build 13. You had to either shoot using Redcode 36/Build 15, or using Redcode 28 (with Build 15, 14, 13....).

Not sure it matters much at this point... but, who knows, it might help.
 
Thanks P.Harril. Obviously we shoot Redcode28. So the failure with the FC was still there.
And to our dear german friends that developed a nasty vibe: I am here not for you but for people like me who are always learning. I never said I am a DIT, on the contrary but your English is well, not so good now is it ?
I will therefore say goodby to the members of this forum as I refuse to be dragged into this personal insult crap. I kept my posting professional and accurate I hope the report helped anyone.
Thanks and good day.
 
I was on a production like this recently. A couple of the guys on the crew decided to blame all the problems on the camera (another HD camera). It came out later through the bonding company investigations that the there was negligence during prep. The crew didn't prep the cameras properly or take time fully understand the camera. End result is the producer got screwed.
 
Fact is that RED is still pretty much a beta camera. There are still features in development. In this scenario you need to do your homework ahead of the shoot, or hire someone who has.

We've shot 4 music videos and titles for a TV show on RED so far, and have had no serious problems at all. We've used predominantly CF and not found the turn around or load time to be a problem.

There is nothing fundamentally wrong with the camera, it just requires a little knowledge. It will become smoother and easier, but at the moment it is what it is.
 
Yoni, I don't see why you take personnally was was first intended for Patryk. Had you come on this forum in the first place, with your own tone and questions, even angry at the camera, you would have been helped and answered by the most supportive community I've ever seen. Everyone here makes sure this camera brings answers and amazing experience.

And being the professionnal you claim being, you should know where this camera stands in it's development at the moment, with it's miraculous features and mad flaws, or as a camera operator, you have been living in a cave for the past 2 years.

Other than the personnal stuff made by owners, all commercial, feature, video or documentary work made with this camera yet has been handled by extensively backed up crews with deep DI knowledge and competence. All the crap you experienced with the camera that day still results in a lack of information and preparation.

Had you posted BEFORE your shoot a simple post like:

"Hi guys, I'm gonna shoot my first Red job tomorrow, could you help me to make sure I have a smooth shoot with the Red, I'm a bit scared of the camera...
-What's the best stable build I should use?
-What's the recommended media? HD or CF?
-What format? etc, etc, etc..."

You would have had instant response, MORE questions from other users to go deeper in understanding your job, etc...

All has been said here about the technical issues you experienced, and the rest was about attitude from Patryk. You felt insulted? Had he not opened the discussions by calling 3500 people indoctrinated morons making the most stupid mistake of their lives, we wouldn't be here.

PS: A lot of people still tried to help you out and answer your questions with their bad manners. I hope you will change your views over this community and that once the dust has settled, you will realize how priceless this forum is once you will be reconciliated with the camera.
 
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