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  • Hey all, just changed over the backend after 15 years I figured time to give it a bit of an update, its probably gonna be a bit weird for most of you and i am sure there is a few bugs to work out but it should kinda work the same as before... hopefully :)

I took apart a Redmag SSD...

Bruce Allen said:
So what kind of witchcraft does Blackmagic Design know if they can make a $325 device that writes at extremely high sustained rates to consumer SSDs?

Bruce Allen
www.boacinema.com
Click to expand...

BMD has witchcraft. You can bet on it. You gotta see what they drink in that joint! If the peripherals business ever starts testing for performance enhancing drugs BMD and Red are gonna be banned for a whole season:-)
 
Actually, the Redmag thing is a bit of a red herring in my view (pardon the pun).

The Red Drive points the way: 640GB for $900.

I've spoken to a few people about my vision on alternate storage, including AJA people, and I think the way forward is a rear-module RAID. Red SSD *costs* for a variety of reasons... it's non-trivial to squeeze 100% uninterrupted performance out of a single 1.8" device, there's QC, and yes there's probably a fair margin there; as another poster pointed out, R&D has to be recouped somewhere. Bare 64GB drive... probably $60 in quantity... throw the duds out, built custom housing, recoup R&D... $950 64GB Redmag.

The way to slash media costs is RAID. Redundant Array of *Inexpensive* Drives.

I envisage a rear module, about the size of the quad battery module, with slots for four removable 2.5" SATA devices. A RAID controller with sufficient cache to smooth out any bumps, and likely a small internal battery to give a few seconds extra recording time for cache protection. YOU get to choose the drives. Feeling conservative? Use four ultra-high performance SSDs in a mirrored configuration. Feeling lucky, or doing a long stint in the field? Use four 1.5TB spinning drives in RAID 5 for protection. Between the cache and the RAID, the exact performance of individual drives shouldn't matter too much; the precise opposite of shoe-horning your storage system into a single compact 1.8" device, where individual drive performance is make or break critical.

That's how I would do it. That's how I MAY do it, if I can get the people in place and the free time to pursue the project. And if AJA don't build something like it first! The chances are not good, especially in terms of time; I can raise the capital if I have to.

If it was made, and proved reliable, would YOU buy it?

Mike
 
Guess question is:
Will RED pless it and not say it voids your warranty.

I can see why RED wants to have full controll on media from a reputation POV.
And of course the cashflow.
 
Gunleik Groven said:
Guess question is:
Will RED pless it and not say it voids your warranty.

I can see why RED wants to have full controll on media from a reputation POV.
And of course the cashflow.
Click to expand...

I own a PIX 240 ... Hate using it... The qaulity on the cards is much better. I bet the 512GB is at least 4K or 4.5K and guess what... I would pay it. (once I saved up)

- p
 
im sure its fine to open up red ssds, even build your own ssds.. just don't post details on the forum!
 
I just finished 4 weeks of filming in all kinds of conditions in central america. My 4 SSDs held out great without a single hitch. The only real issue I have with them is that one can't erase any clips on camera; this is a major drawback as not every shot is worth keeping.
 
Bruce Allen said:
It might be... 5K at 3:1 is around 150MB/sec, right?

Blackmagic Hyperdeck Shutte - $325

Writes uncompressed 10bit 1080p 4:2:2 60i with audio.

That is: 165MB/sec.

Guaranteed to work on a $400 512GB Crucial M4 according to Blackmagic FAQ.

165MB/sec is plenty for any format SCARLET supports, and most formats that EPIC supports, right?



No, not their cinema camera. Their $325 Hyperdeck Shuttle. Which writes at much higher data rates.

Bruce Allen
www.boacinema.com
Click to expand...

i want to high five you ;)

.. can't wait for my bmcc to arrive..
 
Marcos Montenegro said:
I just finished 4 weeks of filming in all kinds of conditions in central america. My 4 SSDs held out great without a single hitch. The only real issue I have with them is that one can't erase any clips on camera; this is a major drawback as not every shot is worth keeping.
Click to expand...


Did you try secure format?
 
Nick Timmons said:
I took one of my 128GB REDMag SSD's apart, and I wanted to know if I should share what I found, or if RED employees would frown upon that kinda thing in this forum. Perhaps someone could chime in? I don't wanna be a ass about it.
Click to expand...

Im intrigued why you would want to do this ?

If when you have prised it open and peered in side, what will you do with what ever you find in there ?
 
Paul Ellington said:
Did you try secure format?
Click to expand...

I think he means ability to delete individual clips, to save space. Useful in many non-film style shoots such as wildlife or documentary. Asked for many times in the past, alas with no luck.
 
ericyoung said:
I think he means ability to delete individual clips, to save space. Useful in many non-film style shoots such as wildlife or documentary. Asked for many times in the past, alas with no luck.
Click to expand...

You know, I'll probably get shot for saying this but I sometimes wish RED firmware was more open and 'hackable' - Magic Lantern style. Such features could be added by third parties; the demand is there as you say.

Choice is a nice thing to have... I've never bought into religious-style 'my way or the highway' thinking, but that's a pretty universal trait amongst hackers!

Mike
 
Rob, you're absolutely right. Perhaps the cameras are loss-leaders, and they make up it with the cost of SSD media and the like. Who could begrudge RED for trying to stay in business? R&D is probably really expensive!

One bit of misinformation that seems to be spreading is how fast modern SSD's are.
In my 8-month-old laptop, I have a 256GB SSD that can hit 400MB a second and stay there all day. Writing a contiguous stream of data is easy, in fact. Random write performance is usually much harder to keep up.
 
Nick Timmons said:
Rob, you're absolutely right. Perhaps the cameras are loss-leaders, and they make up it with the cost of SSD media and the like. Who could begrudge RED for trying to stay in business? R&D is probably really expensive!
Click to expand...

That's exactly how I see it. I doubt the cameras are literal loss leaders, but I am sure the margins are fatter on accessories and rather slim on brains.

R&D is, without question, very expensive.
 
And no...I didn't drop the card, and then decide to open it. No moving parts makes it easy for the card to survive many times the deceleration that would be fatal to a person. :)
 
If you brick your $1500 Canon SLR with a hacked firmware, it's not the end of the world. When you brick something that costs over $40,000, it might be the end of the world.
 
Nick Timmons said:
If you brick your $1500 Canon SLR with a hacked firmware, it's not the end of the world. When you brick something that costs over $40,000, it might be the end of the world.
Click to expand...

Bricking is one thing... hacked firmware on a $40,000, or even $10,000 professional camera is another thing entirely. If you're shooting with that $1500 SLR, or $1000 GH2 with hacked firmware and it chokes trying to record at a higher bit rate or with some random feature turned on. If you're running a hacked Epic or Scarlet with, say, a cobbled-together SSD or some new feature turned on and it ruins a shoot, you're giving the camera a bad name in the industry. That's something that hurts Red as a company, and every Red owner, operator, and rental house who have invested in Red products and expertise in a line of work that demands reliability on high budget productions.
 
It might be the Magic Lantern guys hacked the Canon firmware to make up for some serious functional short comings (and perhaps to show Canon the amazing video tools that can coded on an ARM).

As RED readily listen and absorb - they are a creative superset. I don't therefore think there is any need to hack their firmware.

AJ (xML)
 
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