Guessing game...

[Eki Halkka]

Okay, let's speculate ;-)

Scarlet will be as before - the same lens, electronics etc. Except for the sensor. Let's assume that they have found out that the imaging circle of the fixed lens covers more than just the 2/3" sensor area without too much vignetting, so they upgraded the sensor block. It will be slightly bigger, i.e. 3/4" to 1", with 4K resolution. The current electronics should be fast enough to push 4K at 60 fps, and the specs for 3K crop would of course be the same as before. This would miraculously cause just a slight price increase, if any.

That'd be pretty cool... and in the realm of theoretically possible (though not probable).

 

[Gabriel Winebrenner]

$5K for a Scarlet Interchangeable, $8K for a Scarlet Interchangeable and set of mini-primes.

That would VERY NICE! Here's hoping the interchangeable rolls out the same time as the fixed. Just wish they would use a ccd sensor for the 2/3rd sensor. That would truly make this a crash cam (image more stable under rolling shutter conditions since there will be no rolling shutter; or at least have global shutter utilized in the cmos to get rid of the rolling shutter; although I would just prefer the kodak ccd sensor...) and a bit more super 16 and less clean IMO (something I kind of love at the moment). Great news however. Glad Jim came through with the revelations.

 

[Marko Hocevar]

I have no need to speculate anymore. Nov 3rd is just a step away when you look back where the road started in 2008.
I'm not even nervous about the price cause I'm committed

 

[Ryan Farnes]

I would be very happy if the fixed lens was turned into a detachable zoom BUT that's a fairly significant change in the whole design and I doubt they've had time to go back to the drawing board in the two months since we last got Scarlet info.

However, they've potentially been working on a "new Scarlet" since they determined they were disastrously delayed in the wake of the tragedy in Japan. So, they've possibly been working for months on this new setup, whatever it is.

All the "confusion" about Scarlet interchangeable (and EPIC-S maybe?) might have something to do with this. Not sure that EPIC-S will be rolled into a Scarlet, or vice-versa, but I'm intrigued by the prospect of an S35 sensor that you'd crop for 2/3" glass with setting dependent on the resolution and sensor crop you're shooting at.

Either way, I'm somewhat confident that RED doesn't want to release a sub-4K camera. It muddies their whole push for 4K acquisition, finishing and distribution. I wonder if the "new Scarlet" will do 4K.

 

[Gabriel Winebrenner]

All the "confusion" about Scarlet interchangeable (and EPIC-S maybe?) might have something to do with this. Not sure that EPIC-S will be rolled into a Scarlet, or vice-versa, but I'm intrigued by the prospect of an S35 sensor that you'd crop for 2/3" glass with setting dependent on the resolution and sensor crop you're shooting at.

If RED goes w/ a S35 sensor then it will be cmos. I'm hoping they stick w/ 2/3 and go for CCD instead of CMOS. That would make the cam truly unique and different completely from the R1 and Epic.

 

[Steve Wake]

Ted said a couple of things in one of the interviews from IBC linked on another Scarlet thread: (paraphrasing) Scarlet is meant to fill the gaps in user need not met by Epic; and we discovered some things couldn't be built. And there's Jim with "We know what you want."

My interpretation: Scarlet will be good not only for lower-budget indies, it will be adaptable for efp, doc and other run 'n gun. And second, there has been some rethinking on design and construction. The former is just a reminder that RED knows that the potential user base for Scarlet is extremely diverse and no one has been forgotten - it provides a framework for speculation. The latter lets our imaginations run wild. As for how much of our speculation is realistic - I think RED has looked at every option we can think of and more. Viable options have been drawn up and possibly prototypes produced looong ago. Perhaps even an upgrade path through the Monstro generation of sensors has existed for a year or more. Jim's been pretty excited about Monstro lately, and there was talk of an interesting typo(or was that a bean spill?) in the heading of one of Jim's threads last night. Production problems related to complexity and the tragedy in Japan have probably intensified RED's re-examination of ALL options for Scarlet for at least the past 6 months - a long time for a company as quick and agile as RED.

My prediction/wish list:

1. Monstro generation sensor. So much DR that HDRx is rendered obsolete.
2. One Scarlet to rule them all. 8x zoom is now removable. Has PL mount because the housing needs to be large enough to contain the electronics.
3. S16 or similar sized sensor - larger than 2/3" So lenses still need to resolve no more than 100 lp/mm to optimize resolution with 4k, or if still 3k - this lowers the lp/mm requirement, making the 8x zoom a little easier to manufacture. We've never known the size of the image circle for the Fixed 8x or the mini-primes, so maybe this did not require that big of a change. Or maybe RED solved the manufacturing problem with an upgrade and redesign (that was already on the drawing boards).
4. Simpler side handle - removable with cord back to the brain to increase flexibility and ENG type controls. The original DSMC side handle seems to me made primarily for people that want to shoot stills style and need all those controls under their right hand. Something happened to practically double its projected price, too. This could cut cost for the Scarlet package and give us a more appropriate handle that could replace a grip on a shoulder rig or clamp to a tripod handle.
5. Bayonet mount on the Zoom for RED wide and tele adapters.

 

[Lawrence Bansbach]

I like the Scarlet just the way it is. 2/3 is perfect for me. Would be nice if that fixed lens wasn't fixed (but still came with the package), but hey, who's complaining.

I like 2/3-inch, too, but Jim has positioned Red's announcement squarely against Canon's. Most pundits think Canon will announce a camera with an APS-C-size sensor, and most of the hype in video cameras recently has surrounded sensor size. Even though Scarlet fixed might be superior in every other way, I can't see Jim conceding such a spec, no matter how overhyped it is. Also, when asked about the Epic-S, which was conspicuously missing from his recent roadmap, he replied, "The camera you want is later this year."

Regarding the 2/3-inch format and 3K sensor, Jim has been a little more cryptic. His statements "What seemed like a good idea 3 years ago might seem completely wrong today" and more recently "Many times we announce a product, then realize that what seemed like a good idea... wasn't as good as we thought. Particularly when it doesn't measure up to 'our new and better idea'. That = change." seem to be aimed at 2/3-inch Scarlet, which was announced 3 years ago.

So, my reasoning that Scarlet may be S35 is as follows: (1) a camera named Epic-S is missing from the schedule but Scarlet (singular) remains, (2) a camera comparable to the Epic-S will be announced and/or shipped latter this year, (3) Red will no longer announce product details until the product is ready to ship, and Scarlet's details and ship date will be announced near the end of the year, (4) a 3K, 2/3-inch camera may be a concept whose time has come and gone, and (5) Scarlet is being positioned against what many presume to be a large-sensor (and possibly 4K) Canon camera. Therefore, unless Red announces another Epic-S-comparable S35 camera not on the roadmap between now and the end of the year, an S35 Scarlet looks to fit the bill. But, hey, I've been wrong about Red many times.

Everyone saying that is will be 4k/5k and have a S35 sensor... I think that might hurt Epic sales, no?

Probably no more than Epic-S would hurt Epic-X and -M sales.

 

[Sergio Perez]

Thinking about it a bit more... Red and Canon could really be doing a partnership. Red seems to have an interesting relationship with Canon- why would they go Canon Mount on Epic first? A mount that "talks" to the camera and uses IS?

I think there's something going on there...

 

[Aaron Holmes]

I'm looking forward to see what, if anything, they produce for a run-n-gun microphone solution. Will there be an accessory shoe add-on where I can drop a shotgun mic without all kinds of wild handles on the thing? Will there be a stereo mic that mates with the front of the camera somehow? If it's not a situation where I can afford to use an external recorder for my audio, it's probably one where convenience and size are critical. I'm hoping there's a good answer here, as having to hang a big XLR expansion box off the back of the camera would really poison things for me.

-aaron

 

[Phil Holland]

I think anybody hoping for a 2/3rds sensor is forgetting that beyond whatever Canon has up it's sleeves, Sony currently has two S35 cameras ranging from $5k to $16k. RED seems to desire to stay ahead of the pack and their history shows it. It would be a shame if Scarlet was smaller that S35. I really can't see RED doing that. They will likely want a camera to last a few cycles here.

 

[Jason Madeja]

I'm guessing Scarlet will have an upgrade path to a new sensor called Scorpion - a mini-Dragon.

 

[Bryce O]

The only thing I can think of is that maybe the "brain" is now two parts... a sensor module and processing module. Maybe you can now buy a s35 or 2/3" sensor... but choose your Redcode flavor. Maybe a cheaper "inde" 2k Redcode processor for under $5,000, all the way up to 5k for $20,000.

Either way, I just want RAW... I don't care if it's only 1080p even. I'm sick of codecs. They are old broadcast-TV era nonsense. They just don't make sense these days. Even if Scarlet was only 2k or something now, I would still buy it. :cornut:

 

[Paul S.]

I think RED have decided they will not build anything that achieves less than 4K 2:1

 

[Sverker Hahn]

Or Epic-S (or whatever Scarlet S35 had changed into) and Scarlet are now one and the same. 3K is past and now it's 4K, S35 sensor... For less than $10K.

One can dream, right?

You are right - there will be a Scarlet with fixed lens, 4K and S35 sensor. There has been nothing about Scarlet for such a long time, during which Red has transformed Scarlet to the size of Epic. Why have four cameras in two almost identical sizes? I think there will be two Scarlets, the F with fixed lens, the C (cinema) for interchangable lenses and one Epic X ...

 

[Jesper Sichlau]

I think Scarlet is now only one camera. Perhaps the fixed, it gotta' be 4K or at least QuadHD. Some has suggested merely a interchangable one with the zoom lens as a seperate lens. If that's even possible I guess that would be the best solution for all.

I think Epic-S (Scarlet S35) is no longer with us. It has become one of the 'surprises' and has become a new camera Red Scorpion which would be a morph between the Epic-S and the Scarlet Interchangable. The Epic-S always seemed to deliver much of the same as the Epic-M and X. Therefore I guess it would be much wiser to concentrate on the original crowd closer to the original pricetag at around 7-10.000 for the brain only. This should be a S35 sized sensor at 4-5K with up to 60fps. Maybe with a whole new sensor, but if so this camera would not be out for a while. This camera would be in direct competition with what soon might be coming from other companies.

 

[Sam Eilertsen]

Wishful thinking aside...as of the "ten questions" thread in late June it was still 2/3". That was the camera that Joseph got the play with and that was the camera Ted was running around with. Jarred is saying "announce then ship". Do you really think, give the years they've spent developing a 2/3" 3K camera that they managed to completely change it up in a few months, to the point where it's tested, bug-free, ready to ship?

4K is a little less far-fetched but still unlikely. My bet is a future upgrade to 4K.

That said, I'd love to be wrong

 

[Gabriel Winebrenner]

Wishful thinking aside...as of the "ten questions" thread in late June it was still 2/3". That was the camera that Joseph got the play with and that was the camera Ted was running around with. Jarred is saying "announce then ship". Do you really think, give the years they've spent developing a 2/3" 3K camera that they managed to completely change it up in a few months, to the point where it's tested, bug-free, ready to ship?

4K is a little less far-fetched but still unlikely. My bet is a future upgrade to 4K.

That said, I'd love to be wrong

It's starting to all make sense to me now. Perhaps the 2/3rd sensor in conjunction w/ the 3k resolution and zoom lens was actually giving RED some headaches. With the push to 4k, etc.., maybe RED was like, we'll just throw in the s35 sensor which works fine with 4k and the zoom and can upsell the fact that it is now 4k as opposed to 3k, which I had thought I heard would be unnecessary, 4k that is if not problematic, on a 2/3rd sensor. The masses seem to want 35mm over 16mm, so perhaps this move to an s35 sensor and 4k has some validity.

 

[Jesper Sichlau]

It's starting to all make sense to me now. Perhaps the 2/3rd sensor in conjunction w/ the 3k resolution and zoom lens was actually giving RED some headaches. With the push to 4k, etc.., maybe RED was like, we'll just throw in the s35 sensor which works fine with 4k and the zoom and can upsell the fact that it is now 4k as opposed to 3k, which I had thought I heard would be unnecessary, 4k that is if not problematic, on a 2/3rd sensor. The masses seem to want 35mm over 16mm, so perhaps this move to an s35 sensor and 4k has some validity.

If I had to choose between a 3K S35 and a 4K 2/3" sensor I would choose the latter - if Red would offer relatively cheap and good primes/lenses for the 2/3" sensor format.

 

[Perry Wilson]

Or Epic-S (or whatever Scarlet S35 had changed into) and Scarlet are now one and the same. 3K is past and now it's 4K, S35 sensor... For less than $10K.

One can dream, right?

oh so you mean a camera that would make the R1 worth uh NOTHING? except nostalgia of coarse

 

[Doug Beatty]

I'm on board with those guessing 2/3 and 4K.

There will be two flavors: fixed ($12K) and interchangeable ($15k) with the choice of PL or EOS mount for those that opt for the interchangeable route.

Then Jim will jump over Sony and Canon's CEOs and slam dunk a basketball for the win as time expires.