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  • Hey all, just changed over the backend after 15 years I figured time to give it a bit of an update, its probably gonna be a bit weird for most of you and i am sure there is a few bugs to work out but it should kinda work the same as before... hopefully :)

Form factor

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Ace

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I thought Id start discussing in particular the ergonimic and hand held factors of this camera. This also includes weight distribution and add-ons for handheld steady work.

RED in the past has focused on shifting the paradigm, albeit that paradigm did need to touch home with every professional user. "No more gaffer tape" was a step in the right direction..

No one says you have to hold a camera a certain way, or that it should be a certain shape. When it comes to something physically interacting with the human body, formfactor is up for grabs!

Personally, id like to see a camera which is the opposite of the red one. One that needs NO cage or add ons to be able to be maneuvered and held from ANY side. If i want to hold it upside down left side up, hold it from the top, cradle it from the bottom, i should be able to without any modification. Handheld on the field just needs that flexibility.

2. It should look inconspicuous. RED one was a rocket launcher. Lets have a camera for covert operations. The James Bond of video cameras. The pierce bronsan/sean connery edition and not the daniel craig edition.

3. This is going to sound silly.. but can the camera have a gyro like swivel so that people with arthritis dont have to twist their wrists to keep it level... I will be posting some ideas of what id like the camera to have when i have some time..

any other ideas about hand holdability and form factor?
 
small enough to mount atop a sports helmet without hurting a snowboarder!
 
I agree with you. I think that especially in this day and age, ergonomics shouldn't be an after thought (or after-market). I caught a lot of flack for suggesting this the first time around. Perhaps with the "pocket" form factor, we'll see a design that's more accepting of the fact that humans will interact with this device. This actually shocked me.... wasn't the initial success of Oakley due to ergo handgrips?

For Red 1, there were a couple of cameras that really got ergonomics right (416, 235, LT), but RED took a different path. The good thing is that in the compact market, there's NO competition for "best ergonomics," they all suck. Blazing a new trail should be pretty easy to beat everything on the market for picture quality AND ergo.
 
It astounds me that you you have to hold a hand held camera in a fixed joint axis, when your wrists have 6 unconstrained degrees of freedom, yet your wrists have to conform to this silly strap on the side of a box to keep the camera steady.
 
I want it to fit right here over the RED logo.

5_1197957553.jpg
 
It needs to be able to easily fit atop a helmet for 2k recordings of snowboarding, hang-gliding, skydiving, surfing, etc. The main unit should only output raw then have a separate process and store module (about the size of a Red battery) that would crunch the data into R3D files on a CF module. That way you can wear the process module on your back.

Think about it! Red doesn't merely want to increment the field, they want to revolutionize it. The field really lacks high-quality small cameras. You can't get good theatrical-quality shots of helmet-cam stuff! Red could break that wide open and give us a whole range of shots never before possible!
 
I think what I want is a group of people who have no pre-conceived notion of how a small camera is made, to make one. When you start from an idea and not an established "look", you can be inventive. I can't say what it should be like because that would be creating a "oner"... a camera that was right for me. Just make it work exceptionally well and I will conform to it. I'm a walking adapter.
 
Shawn Nelson said:
It needs to be able to easily fit atop a helmet for 2k recordings of snowboarding, hang-gliding, skydiving, surfing, etc. The main unit should only output raw then have a separate process and store module (about the size of a Red battery) that would crunch the data into R3D files on a CF module. That way you can wear the process module on your back.

Think about it! Red doesn't merely want to increment the field, they want to revolutionize it. The field really lacks high-quality small cameras. You can't get good theatrical-quality shots of helmet-cam stuff! Red could break that wide open and give us a whole range of shots never before possible!
Click to expand...

What about the Silicon Image 2K Mini?
 
May get a lot of heat for this, but heres something I quickly put together..What if the form factor was a ball. Something you could hold from any side, and still maintain the ergonomic shape of your hand (in a cupping position). There would be a strap ofcourse. And with the swivelling strap, it would mean you could hold this thing whichever way you wanted. From the top, side, bottom back, whilst having it strapped. Maybe forget about holding the actual ball and hold the lens itself for addes stability. Oh and that glowing ring around it, thats your ring light. It just seems to me when you hold your hand in a grabbing position, its not in the shape of a square, its not in the shape of a cylinder, its in the shape of a ball..

ballidea.jpg
 
I definitely want the lens mount and sensor to detach for remote placement. Take modular to a whole new level.

Have a 'processor' block, sensor block, lcd block, battery block and storage block. And have them all snap together... or apart to combine into a convenient form factor or else break off as needed.
 
Nice design acehole. I would like it if scarlett looked something like that.
 
acehole said:
I thought Id start discussing in particular the ergonimic and hand held factors of this camera. This also includes weight distribution and add-ons for handheld steady work.
Click to expand...

RED is focussed on getting 4K/24p for now. Once they establish the new platform, may be the next generation might be more ergonomic. With built in LCD screen, EVF, Microphone, etc.

Now you can appreciate why Sony, Panasonic and others spend millions on designing ergonomic forms.
I heard Panasonic is using the HVX form for their 4K/24p 2/3" lens camcoder coming out in 2008.
Haven't heard what design Sony would adopt. Probably one of their existing forms.
 
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