Ergonomics etc.

[J Davis]

We are purposefully withholding certain info... and one bombshell. We anticipate that the competition will be working on something, so we have to be ready for a checkmate move when that happens. Don't ask. We won't tell.

Jim

checkmate move ... you rock!

.

 

[Steven Caesare]

The PL lens in front is a cue... as is the mattebox, red handles, batts, etc.

But dimensions would be nice. Or a shot of a NC milled plastic model of the modules with a lens mounted... sitting on Brook's shoulder

M

The dimensions for the brains were on the original 11/13 announcment "flyer":

http://red.cachefly.net/DSMC/brochure_update_11-14-2008.jpg

In short-

Epic brain = 3.5"W x 5.2"H x 3.54"D
Scarlet brain = 2.76"W x 5.2"H x 2.76"D

I assume the updated 12/3 announcemnent hasn't significantly chnges the brain sizes, if at all.

-Steve

 

[James Brundige]

Balance

Balance

I'm excited about the possibilities for Epic weight and balance. I only use the R1 on sticks.

As rendered, the Epic set up could get very front heavy, depending of course on lensing. (that's why I haven't yet sprung for the 18-85 Red). I'm hoping the battery/hard drive can hang far enough back (on 24" rods) to balance out.
Otherwise, there might be a way to mount the camera above the rods (instead of the underslung set up we have seen in the renders). Jim has observed that might put the lens too far back, but if we can get some lens controls on the handles, that would be fine. For us EFP guys, the handle-mounted zoom and auto iris trigger are the difference between getting the shot or not. That and a good shoulder balance will open up the large EFP market to Red.

I think we'll find good solutions for balance. The trick is going to be locating the EVF. I can imagine some very unusual rigs, with the viewfinder in a very different relationship than we are used to seeing.

Brook, I've followed your ergonomics thread, and I've always thought that, if the camera is light enough, you won't need a big cut-out, just the right accessories. It will be interesting to see what develops in that regard.

 

[Jannard]

The dimensions for the brains were on the original 11/13 announcment "flyer":

http://red.cachefly.net/DSMC/brochure_update_11-14-2008.jpg

In short-

Epic brain = 3.5"W x 5.2"H x 3.54"D
Scarlet brain = 2.76"W x 5.2"H x 2.76"D

I assume the updated 12/3 announcemnent hasn't significantly chnges the brain sizes, if at all.

-Steve

There have been some dimension adjustments. No point in calling them out as they may continue to change a bit. Nothing major, but not exactly the same.

Jim

 

[Steven Caesare]

There have been some dimension adjustments. No point in calling them out as they may continue to change a bit. Nothing major, but not exactly the same.

Jim

Thanks Jim...but still in the ballaprk so that way folks here can engage in rampant speculation?

And incidentally, have a good weekend Jim. While not (yet) a cutomer, I'm here all the time as a geeky fan of things both technical and video related, as well as for the fascniating window in to one of the most uniqe development efforts and companies ever.

Love to buy you a drink some time.

 

[Mick van Rossum NSC]

Maybe I am wrong but I was under the impression that the modules are interchangeable between Epic and Scarlet. Now looking at the different sizes of the brains wondering if that was right.......

Cheers

Mick (Grading 60 days of red material on Scratch for 18 days and very happy)

 

[Steven Caesare]

Maybe I am wrong but I was under the impression that the modules are interchangeable between Epic and Scarlet. Now looking at the different sizes of the brains wondering if that was right.......

Cheers

Mick (Grading 60 days of red material on Scratch for 18 days and very happy)

If you look at some of the renders, there is a thin "adaper plate" that goes in between the Scarlet brain and the modules to adapt the sizes.

It appears that the modules are all Epic-width, and that the smaller Scarlet brain is adapted to them.

That's a SWAG tho.

-Steve

 

[James Brundige]

If you look at some of the renders, there is a thin "adaper plate" that goes in between the Scarlet brain and the modules to adapt the sizes.

It appears that the modules are all Epic-width, and that the smaller Scarlet brain is adapted to them.

That's a SWAG tho.

-Steve

I assume the modules will work with both brains. That's a key element in my (nascent) plans. Of course, everything will change. I'm counting on it. - which is quite cool because it keeps changing for the better (except for delivery dates!)

Jim, if you are reading this, thanks for the Epic X.

 

[Jannard]

All modules work with all brains. There is one adaptor necessary for back modules to work with Scarlet brains. It is a very easy system...

Jim

 

[Paul Hazlett]

We are purposefully withholding certain info... and one bombshell. We anticipate that the competition will be working on something, so we have to be ready for a checkmate move when that happens. Don't ask. We won't tell.

Jim

Me thinks Mr. Jannard likes chess....no?

 

[Blair S. Paulsen]

Bridge

Bridge

My thing was just the idea of a "bridge" piece that would connect the front and rear module groups and would have a padded cutout on the bottom.

 

[Kyle Presley]

All modules work with all brains. There is one adaptor necessary for back modules to work with Scarlet brains. It is a very easy system...

Jim

What about the new FF35 Scarlet? Is the adapter needed for it. It looks physically bigger.

 

[J. Eric Camp]

I am not too interested in adding weight as my major way to get my COG where I want it. Thats what I thought was so great about ET's handheld rig. It had so much fore to aft play that you can just slide the camera till the COG hits where you want.

I feel that it is best to use a combination of weight versus sliding.

Just like on a steady cam.

 

[James Brundige]

My thing was just the idea of a "bridge" piece that would connect the front and rear module groups and would have a padded cutout on the bottom.

If it's light enough. Otherwise the I/O box stays forward with the brain, and the battery / hard drive is far enough back to balance.

The problem with a cut-out is it's fixed, and cant move depending on the lens weight.

Perhaps your idea could be a cable with plates on either end to allow the I/O box to mount with battery and drive to the rear. Everything slung under the rails, and the red shoulder pad between.

 

[Blair S. Paulsen]

Bridge & tunnel

Bridge & tunnel

Top rails with a pad/bridge piece that can be slid as needed could work, just not sure how the various power and signal connections would be managed. Perhaps a multi-pin spiral cable?

Perhaps the bridge piece could "telescope" with the cabling inside of it, nicely protected?

I understand that a bottom side rig like the ET handheld unit is a solid option, I just really like getting the lens center lower and letting the EVF ride up above so I can position it where I want without any interference with the mattebox.

Anyway, I trust the Red Team has built mock ups and tried a hundred options I've never even thought of. Just throwing some feedback in to help the cause. Peace.

 

[James Brundige]

stone age render

stone age render

just playin around - clearly it's easier to have the I/O forward, because the cabling (for batt and drive) already exists.

It would be nice to get the I/O module to the rear to keep cables out of the way. I like to velcro sound cables to my belt for those inevitable times when some one steps on them. Then it doesn't pull the camera off your shoulder.

 

[Brook Willard]

Here's a mockup I made when I started working on my "Epic" accessory. It's based on the specifications that RED posted with the original announcement. Obviously some sizes have changed, but they haven't said how much.

As you can see, under the modules is exactly where you want your shoulder to be. And the lens won't be in your ear.

Interestingly enough, as low profile as the new Epic body and modules are... it's still not as low profile as the 235. It's a negligible difference that I won't complain about [because RED really hit it out of the park with the potential in this design], but it's something to tip your hat to Arri for.

I'm very excited about what will be possible with these camera bodies... but let's not forget that there is still a ways to go before there's a balanced solution with parts that won't knock loose when the operator grabs them [like the battery].

If it shipped like this, I'd be pretty happy. Good times ahead.

 

[Joseph Ward]

Here's a mockup I made when I started working on my "Epic" accessory. It's based on the specifications that RED posted with the original announcement. Obviously some sizes have changed, but they haven't said how much.

As you can see, under the modules is exactly where you want your shoulder to be. And the lens won't be in your ear.

Interestingly enough, as low profile as the new Epic body and modules are... it's still not as low profile as the 235. It's a negligible difference that I won't complain about [because RED really hit it out of the park with the potential in this design], but it's something to tip your hat to Arri for

I'm very excited about what will be possible with these camera bodies... but let's not forget that there is still a ways to go before there's a balanced solution with parts that won't knock loose when the operator grabs them [like the battery].

If it shipped like this, I'd be pretty happy. Good times ahead.

I like these Shell Accessories for the modules! :weight_lift:

 

[Brook Willard]

Yeah, it doesn't take a real genius to imagine what my "accessory" is going to be like.