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  • Hey all, just changed over the backend after 15 years I figured time to give it a bit of an update, its probably gonna be a bit weird for most of you and i am sure there is a few bugs to work out but it should kinda work the same as before... hopefully :)

DSMC3 Wish list

Dane Pidgeon

Dane Pidgeon

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Not sure if this has been on here before but was curious what you would like to see incorporated into the next phase of Red? Whether it be firmware or hardware?
 
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Faster Boot Times would be the main thing for me. If they can faster framerates are great to have as well. Keep the same body and keep Mini Mags and that would be great.
 
In no particular order.

1. Faster boot time.

2. internal ND, mount with ND options, or improved version of motion mount.

3. Compact professional audio module with analogue limiters and timecode generator with wireless TC transmission. (Or internal temp compensated crystal oscillator TC generator built into camera body.)

4. Larger Redvolt-Vs

5. HDR high color gamut displays and EVFs

6. Even faster NVMe based mini-mags.

7. Even wider dynamic range

8. Even better lowlight performance

9. Highspeed USB-C port on body or module for all sorts of nonsense. Connect directly to a display, power other things on camera, and so on and so forth.

I would gladly sacrifice greater resolution for 7 & 8
 
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Peter Lyons Collister said:
internal ND
Click to expand...

You are right and I would love this BUT only if it is a best (or equal to best) in market solution .... I haven't tried the Venice system but the lower end solutions are not OK for me.

I suspect a great internal 8 stop ND system would add a significant cost to the camera (maybe 10k ish) and that is cool if it is invisible from a PQ POV...
 
1. .R3D mark II (without encryption or a less taxing encryption) so it can be decompressed on a laptop CPU
2. MiniMag with PCIe-4 4 lanes NVMe protocol (upto 3 GB/s write or more and 7.5 GB/s read) for less compression, fast off-load and with more TB of space
3. Internal ND
4. 6k S35 and a 6k FF
5. Professional audio module
6. 12G-SDI output
 
Not in any particular order:
1. Built-in ND
2. Less Power (better for batteries to last longer)
3. Less Heat (would be nice to be Fan-less one day) and super quiet
4. No black shading needed (done internally for you if still required)
5. Software - Faster boot-up times
6. Software - Menus that are smooth, quick, more responsive, and animated (like Apple - i.e. pull down menus)
7. Software - Image stabilization using the gyroscope metadata (perhaps done in post) or internal sensor gimbal
8. Improved Audio - phantom power, limiters, improved pre-amp, auto levels
9. Improved auto-focus (see Sony)
10. More wireless integration (for iPads, audio, timecode, follow-focus, video)...all built-in
11. High Bright Monitors with higher resolutions
12. Does not need to warm up and cool off. No temperature to worry about.
13. Use CFast or standard media not RED media (cheaper price media)
14. Have 2 media ports module for redundancy recording OR for hot-swap during live recordings
15. 4K FF camera with recode raw 1:1 ratio (yeah, probably asking too much on this one)
 
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DSMC3 Suggestions

1) Firmware : Stable wifi that does not drop out / does not require the camera to be periodically rebooted.
Replacement the existing 802.11b with Wifi-6 (802.11ax).

2) Option to Sync clips being recorded onto R3D with external device (if 802.11ax recording device is paired).
Option to purge local camera clip when save stored to paired recording devices.
When out of range - and back in range - media offloading would continue (at up to 14Gb/s)
If R3D not fully in sync with paired device - the unsynced footage would remain on the mini-mag.

3) Firmware : After a successful boot on a new firmware - create and persist data that is calculated on startup. If firmware has not changed, bootup should (more like an 'wake' in MacOs) - use previous boot state for more rapid starting. GUI should come up almost instantly. Where comms bus requires stability of underlying hardware (eg SSD), or Sensor warming - lock that functionality out (this is what Magic Lantern did during startup while creating lookup tables to be used for real time image magnification during recording).

4) Menu structure : Consider an option for Icons to replace words in menu where the meaning is universal (eg Audio / power / media menu in INKontrol). Panavision - reduced their menus down to 5 for fewer buttons to push & less up and down navigation. Experimental menu solution in INKontrol allows two levels concurrently on screen using Icons where possible for minimum clutter - not sure if this would be of interest?

5) 4K external monitor when recording. Touch screen - even when recording - for 1-1 mapping to magnify area overlaid in a square or circle at that point for rapid focus checking, and then disengage after a few seconds (or the next screen press)

6) Introduce Internal electric ND that has option to remove itself from the optic path - so that DoF can be set with optimal SNR for the current scene.
UPDATE : Looks like Tilta will sort this on DSMC2 in 2019


7) 60GHz dedicated real time wireless video transmission for display - eg in augmented reality goggles. (so that if the camera was lifted from the ground to above your head - the operator could see what the camera is seeing displayed). This interface option could reduce the weight of the camera setup (no on camera screen required).

8) Up the maximum frame rate to 8k @ 240Hz / 4k @ 1000fps. Probably enough for the vast majorities needs? Could also be used as a work around for 2 stops of ND (if HDRX not desired).

AJ
 
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No DSMC3 at all. Give it a rest allready ;-) We have the best cameras in the history of man right now. Lets settle down and let them mature for a minute. If Red kept working to improve, and upgrade one camera design, for more than a new york minute, you would end up with something magnificent like the Arri bl4, or the Panavision Genesis.

I think they have done so much good work moving towards an amazing camera with the DSMC2 system, it could really turn into something lovely.

But hey, I'm old and grumpy.

Nick
 
Nick Gardner said:
No DSMC3 at all. Give it a rest allready ;-) We have the best cameras in the history of man right now. Lets settle down and let them mature for a minute. If Red kept working to improve, and upgrade one camera design, for more than a new york minute, you would end up with something magnificent like the Arri bl4, or the Panavision Genesis.

I think they have done so much good work moving towards an amazing camera with the DSMC2 system, it could really turn into something lovely.

But hey, I'm old and grumpy.

Nick
Click to expand...

This is I suppose what I really feel... I really do feel the next product has to be a big step forward on all fronts (not the usual 2steps forward 1step back).... but I suspect most would disagree
 
Look at the Blackmagic Pocket 4K, having recording options over USB-C is a BIG deal! I don’t expect they’ll allow for REDCODE but Prores and maybe Prores RAW would be a great starting point for new owners rather than having to shell out thousands of dollars more for expensive proprietary media like we’ve had to do up until now for practical reasons. Ever since the RED One there’s been people trying to do long form recording with external recorders and the like just to avoid having to purchase dozens of RED Mags or having to deal with the extra post processing for REDCODE, even though there has always been limited output resolution by SDI or HDMI. Giving the option for Prores was a big step forward in usability for the RED cameras but now expanding storage and workflow options with USB-C recording would be a game changer.
 
I would love to see...

20 stops of Dynamic Range even when at ISO 50 or ISO 5000.

Internal NDs,

and any internal batteries should be user removable.

:)
 
My top ones:
- 8K @ 120fps. 240fps if miracles happen on the sensor side of things.
- Wouldn't mind a 12K or higher resolution camera, but I know I'm not everybody.
- We'll need new media for sure. Just stating the fact here.
- Support for 4K LCD/EVFs
- 4K and 8K output
- I personally would like to see some backwards compatibility with DSMC2 stuff, but I know that could limiting in a lot of ways.
- REDCODE RAW enhancements and the ability to shoot 2:1 or 3:1 at 8K would be neato.
- Faster Boot is a good one.
- Sensor Calibration either faster, which I think is possible with more processing power. Probably could get that down to 4 minutes, maybe less.
- Waveform might be a nice addition internally.
- Internal fan design with heatsink coils exposed to air maybe. There's some other cooling things to explore. I'm not somebody who has a big issue with the fans, but there's a lot out there who... erm... aren't fans.

If there's no shutter speed limitation on the newest LCND tech that PV, Lee, and Tilta are deploying, that might be a more interesting option internally.

Everybody will want some sort of internal ND thing at this point I guess.

Might be interesting to see the direction new sensors go with Dual ISO or not.

Curious if there's any OLPF related enhancements that can be made. Specifically either making that part of the cover glass to eliminate deep aperture orbs or something else. Don't know if we should have a mechanical OLPF switcheroo, but that might be a thing. But yet another thing to break for sure.

Sensor-wise, there's some fancy stuff not yet used in motion picture cameras. I don't know if that's a possibility, but might be fun to explore.

Wireless 4K video is coming along, but 2020-2023 that will be something we'll need to tackle.

I have thoughts on 3rd party modules and related development. Some have been empowering, some have been points of frustration due to unofficial deployment or just shotty engineering concepts. Specifically we'll need a couple ones done with a bit more foresight, but I'll keep that off the air for now.

*might be neat to integrate a 15mm rod slots into the body. Totally not necessary, but something to consider.

If I was a guessing man, I'd expect a whole different spin on the general operating system in camera.

S35, VV, and yeah maybe a bigger baby, but again, that's really not the bulk of the market right now.
 
Those DSMC2 W sensors will probably become much more affordable once DSMC3 comes to play. It will be the bright side of having the older tech.
 
Jon Dishler said:
Those DSMC2 W sensors will probably become much more affordable once DSMC3 comes to play. It will be the bright side of having the older tech.
Click to expand...

Initially, if it follows the trend of how DSMC2 went down, all current gen DSMC2 sensor tech might find their way into DSMC3 bodies.

That is, unless RED has some bigger plans that are outside of that projected map.
 
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