Dragon Update

[Justin Quinn]

I'm getting faster than realtime transcodes with my Red Rocket 1 with Sonnet... What am I missing here?

You're not missing anything. You're absolutely correct!

There seems to be a lot of confusion regarding TB 1.0, TB 2.0 and PCIe V2 and V3.

 

[Zeb B]

What's the latest on Dragon?

 

[BrendanLeahy]

Do Epic-M Dragons come with completely new serials, or just a continuation of the Epic-M line?

 

[Victor MOREIRA]

Theoretically it is possible. Both Jeff and I think that "someone" could be RED. Transform the RRX from a PCIe card to a compact external self-contained box that would connect via 2x TB2s and feature the slots for REDMAGs and REDMAG MINIs...

Howl if you need a help... :reddevil:

Peter

Yes !! Great idea !

 

[James Codeglia]

Wow, that would get my vote!

 

[Peter Majtan]

Let me talk to them. If they don't have any such a plans, I might jump on this by myself, just as I did with the original LAUNCHPAD - the first ever portable enclosure specifically designed and build for the RR. Even to this date it is the only one able to run out of its included batteries, removing the need to be connected to mains power...

:sifone: Peter

 

[Stephen Franchek]

Let me talk to them. If they don't have any such a plans, I might jump on this by myself, just as I did with the original LAUNCHPAD - the first ever portable enclosure specifically designed and build for the RR. Even to this date it is the only one able to run out of its included batteries, removing the need to be connected to mains power...

:sifone: Peter

That would be AMAZING! Since I'm always on the go, I'm thinking of switching from editing on a PC to a Macbook Pro Retina w/ Redrocket enclosure. A box that could give access to even close to the full transcoding power of the redrocket-x would definitely get my money (and my family would be happy cause they'd get to see me more! Well... they'd get to see me sitting on their couch editing footage =/ )

 

[Kyle Dones]

I'm asking the same question daily...hourly...every minute...

 

[Joost de jonge]

Wonder what video with 16,5+ DR range wil look like. Must be super amazing.

Just as 4K raw 13+ DR gets affortable for me, there comes an higher league of film.
Nice how company's (especially RED) take care we have always something to dream of.
Content is king, but I rather have it wrapped in the best quallity there is.

 

[Eric Z]

I sure hope that part of the Dragon upgrade consists of higher speed SSDs, with direct PCIe instead of SATA3 (like those featured in the upcoming Mac Pro).
That would require buying new PCIe RED mags.
Oh well, bleeding edge always does damage to your pocket.

 

[Brant Hadfield]

I recently had a dialogue with Roger Deakins which came around to the subject of some of his issues with the Red. I also asked in which scenes the 2nd unit used an Octo rig with an Epic. Here was his reply :
"There were probably just two shots of Bond on the rooftop in Istanbul which were made with the Red and used in 'Skyfall'. They are quick shots and you would never notice the difference. I have done side by side tests on a portrait, however, and that is where you really see the subtle differences in colour representation, differences that cannot be counteracted in a DI suite."
As someone who is on the wait list for the Dragon upgrade, and also happens to agree with Mr. Deakins on this point, I am curious if there is particular focus in the color science development for Dragon which addresses aesthetic which seems conjur words like "rich", "smooth", or "filmic". David Mullen, ASC, recently mentioned that he thought Arri's deep experience with film scanning gave them an edge in developing the Alexa's aesthetic.
Would Red ever consider teaming with Kodak in perhaps bringing their experience to bear in the Dragon's color science? Perhaps licensing LUTs which replicate some of their film stocks? Two great American companies teaming in such a way could be a pretty interesting way of combining that heritage and the future of filmmaking.

 

[Robert Berger]

I recently had a dialogue with Roger Deakins which came around to the subject of some of his issues with the Red. I also asked in which scenes the 2nd unit used an Octo rig with an Epic. Here was his reply :
"There were probably just two shots of Bond on the rooftop in Istanbul which were made with the Red and used in 'Skyfall'. They are quick shots and you would never notice the difference. I have done side by side tests on a portrait, however, and that is where you really see the subtle differences in colour representation, differences that cannot be counteracted in a DI suite."
As someone who is on the wait list for the Dragon upgrade, and also happens to agree with Mr. Deakins on this point, I am curious if there is particular focus in the color science development for Dragon which addresses aesthetic which seems conjur words like "rich", "smooth", or "filmic". David Mullen, ASC, recently mentioned that he thought Arri's deep experience with film scanning gave them an edge in developing the Alexa's aesthetic.
Would Red ever consider teaming with Kodak in perhaps bringing their experience to bear in the Dragon's color science? Perhaps licensing LUTs which replicate some of their film stocks? Two great American companies teaming in such a way could be a pretty interesting way of combining that heritage and the future of filmmaking.

I worked with Red from the start and waiting for my upgrade to Dragon and really love the Red image! They don't need Kodak, the Red image is more than great. Film is over! I shot a lot on film and when i have to choose i go for Red!!

Best Robert

 

[Björn Benckert]

Originally Posted by Brant Hadfield
I recently had a dialogue with Roger Deakins which came around to the subject of some of his issues with the Red. I also asked in which scenes the 2nd unit used an Octo rig with an Epic. Here was his reply :
"There were probably just two shots of Bond on the rooftop in Istanbul which were made with the Red and used in 'Skyfall'. They are quick shots and you would never notice the difference. I have done side by side tests on a portrait, however, and that is where you really see the subtle differences in colour representation, differences that cannot be counteracted in a DI suite."
As someone who is on the wait list for the Dragon upgrade, and also happens to agree with Mr. Deakins on this point, I am curious if there is particular focus in the color science development for Dragon which addresses aesthetic which seems conjur words like "rich", "smooth", or "filmic". David Mullen, ASC, recently mentioned that he thought Arri's deep experience with film scanning gave them an edge in developing the Alexa's aesthetic.
Would Red ever consider teaming with Kodak in perhaps bringing their experience to bear in the Dragon's color science? Perhaps licensing LUTs which replicate some of their film stocks? Two great American companies teaming in such a way could be a pretty interesting way of combining that heritage and the future of filmmaking.

Mr Deakins is a DP that shoots great films. However I would not trust him in the field of color science. He's much to much of an artist. If you ask him at what bit dept he did his comparison or what resolution I can pretty much assure you that he did not know. just as most great DP's they do know a lot about light, lenses etc, but their knowledge around computer stuff is usually a bit more limited. Not so strange if you think of that they been out shooting the better part of their life.

 

[Joseph Coleman]

Any update on Dragon?? its been awhile! any idea on dates?

 

[Brian Merlen]

Can I please have a Polaroid module to print frame grabs off the back of the camera :willy_nilly:

 

[Brant Hadfield]

Mr Deakins is a DP that shoots great films. However I would not trust him in the field of color science. He's much to much of an artist. If you ask him at what bit dept he did his comparison or what resolution I can pretty much assure you that he did not know. just as most great DP's they do know a lot about light, lenses etc, but their knowledge around computer stuff is usually a bit more limited. Not so strange if you think of that they been out shooting the better part of their life.

I think that sums up the gulf between the culture of these two camera manufatcturers. One is a culture which places a high value on aesthetic, while the other embraces, primarily, the culture of technology. I think the work of Mr. Deakins speaks for itself, and I fail to understand what difference his knowing the bit depth of his codec (which he probably does know) has to do with the images he creates with the camera and the lens. In fact, I would submit that there are a few DPs who could benefit from a bit more focus on lighting and aesthetic, and less concern about bit depth and Ks!

I am sure Red is aware of what the industry, DPs, producers, see as their strong points and weak points. I am hoping the image of the new Dragon impresses as much in mathematical superiority as it does aesthetically judged against its primary competitor.

 

[Robert Ruffo New]

I think that sums up the gulf between the culture of these two camera manufatcturers. One is a culture which places a high value on aesthetic, while the other embraces, primarily, the culture of technology. I think the work of Mr. Deakins speaks for itself, and I fail to understand what difference his knowing the bit depth of his codec (which he probably does know) has to do with the images he creates with the camera and the lens. In fact, I would submit that there are a few DPs who could benefit from a bit more focus on lighting and aesthetic, and less concern about bit depth and Ks!

I am sure Red is aware of what the industry, DPs, producers, see as their strong points and weak points. I am hoping the image of the new Dragon impresses as much in mathematical superiority as it does aesthetically judged against its primary competitor.

Fashion people love Red since MX - it's a different aesthetic - It's not just a tech issue. The technology only has relevance in its ability to deliver aesthetic products (i.e. images). I love the Epic look - the MX I liked, but not as much as Alexa - the Epic I prefer top any other camera except the F65 - but shooting with an F65 is just not practical (cost, weight, complication, huge data).

 

[Matt Ryan]

Fashion people love Red since MX - it's a different aesthetic - It's not just a tech issue. The technology only has relevance in its ability to deliver aesthetic products (i.e. images). I love the Epic look - the MX I liked, but not as much as Alexa - the Epic I prefer top any other camera except the F65 - but shooting with an F65 is just not practical (cost, weight, complication, huge data).

F5 & 55 look great as well.

I do hope Dragon like many have stated not only increases resolution and DR, but manages highlight rolloff and low end noise better. As well as more accurate color rendition out of the box (yes I know it's RAW, but lets not pretend we'd not like the colors spot on right out of camera). The F5 & F55 are extremely clean on the low end, have a great rolloff, and have a stop more DR over mx. Not to mention their colors are near perfect. As much as I dislike the games and tactics other companies play with upgrades and multiple models, Sony is nailing it right now. If Dragon doesn't come soon I fear these two cameras will take up an even larger part of the market. This is bad for RED owners and users because when a job comes up, now your not just competing with Alexa, it's the F5/55 as well. If Dragon keeps getting pushed back I'm worries Arri will release a new sensor with improved DR. I don't doubt for a second RED won't disappoint, but this sensor has to nail it right away, oh, and have at least 16 stops DR (Skeptic rated so no one can claim it's all marketing) since most camera's now can achieve 14 noiseless. I want to see RED regain the top spot and put the haters to shame!

 

[Harcharan Singh]

Dragon ..come soon

Dragon ..come soon

Hi,

I think Arri has given a great option to upgrade current Alexa cameras with Arri Raw recorder module(ie XT). So there wont be too much noise from current Alexa owners
if they come up with a new sensor camera with higher resolution which I assume will be somewhere in September at IBC.
,,,,and I also assume that DRAGON will be launched after Arri has launched their new camera to match or better their specs....and it wont be before December 2013...

But life is full of surprises......

Thanks

Harcharan

 

[Paul Harb]

Bingo

I think that sums up the gulf between the culture of these two camera manufatcturers. One is a culture which places a high value on aesthetic, while the other embraces, primarily, the culture of technology. I think the work of Mr. Deakins speaks for itself, and I fail to understand what difference his knowing the bit depth of his codec (which he probably does know) has to do with the images he creates with the camera and the lens. In fact, I would submit that there are a few DPs who could benefit from a bit more focus on lighting and aesthetic, and less concern about bit depth and Ks!

I am sure Red is aware of what the industry, DPs, producers, see as their strong points and weak points. I am hoping the image of the new Dragon impresses as much in mathematical superiority as it does aesthetically judged against its primary competitor.