Dragon impressions

[Neil W. Smith]

Resolve 10 grades 6K .reds natively

Resolve 10 grades 6K .reds natively

Are Dragon R3D files not supported by Resolve yet?

Resolve 10 totally handles grading 6K DRAGON .r3ds no problem ... I think Robert's observation is more to do with the fact that there is no BMD DeckLink card in Rob's set up ... and at the moment HD SDI is not enabled on Red Rocket-X card (unless latest firmware upgrade takes care of that).

In our Mac Pro DRAGON grading systems, we utilize a PCIe expansion box with this configuration:

MaPro:
K50000 GPU
PCIe expansion card
4K Extreme Decklink Card
SAS HBA

In the expansion box we have:
2 x TITANs
RR-X
Kona 3 (optional but useful for 4K out of FCP X)
10GbE Ethernet

System totally handles DRAGON footage grading in realtime to HD SDI monitor.

Neil

 

[Rob Anderson]

Resolve 10 totally handles grading 6K DRAGON .r3ds no problem ... I think Robert's observation is more to do with the fact that there is no BMD DeckLink card in Rob's set up ... and at the moment HD SDI is not enabled on Red Rocket-X card (unless latest firmware upgrade takes care of that).

In our Mac Pro DRAGON grading systems, we utilize a PCIe expansion box with this configuration:

MaPro:
K50000 GPU
PCIe expansion card
4K Extreme Decklink Card
SAS HBA

In the expansion box we have:
2 x TITANs
RR-X
Kona 3 (optional but useful for 4K out of FCP X)
10GbE Ethernet

System totally handles DRAGON footage grading in realtime to HD SDI monitor.

Neil

RR-X shared with two Titans via a single 16x PCIe expansion card. That's a hefty bottleneck. We yanked our JMR PCIe expander from the MP configuration I shared here because it's a big restrictor on 3x full 16x lane cards.

 

[Neil W. Smith]

RR-X shared with two Titans via a single 16x PCIe expansion card. That's a hefty bottleneck. We yanked our JMR PCIe expander from the MP configuration I shared here because it's a big restrictor on 3x full 16x lane cards.

Interesting ... so how do you do your color correction?

Neil

 

[Rob Anderson]

Interesting ... so how do you do your color correction?

Neil

In this configuration, we use the Titan and the RR-X inside of the MP tower (dedicated 16x PCIe each).

 

[Neil W. Smith]

In this configuration, we use the Titan and the RR-X inside of the PC tower (dedicated 16x PCIe each).

And what calibrated monitor are you using? ... and how are you going out to it?

Also, what grading software?

 

[Rob Anderson]

And what calibrated monitor are you using? ... and how are you going out to it?

Also, what grading software?

DreamColor with Resolve and RC-X.

 

[Neil W. Smith]

DreamColor with Resolve and RC-X.

Very cool, Rob .... and presumably you're going out Display Port to the DreamColor? ... 10 bit pipeline all the way?

Did you look at any of the EIZO monitors at all?

Thanks,
Neil

 

[Jeff Brown]

Not sure it's an option for you but I've put a couple of Blustor expanders on the two different ports of the bridge card- GPUs in one and rocket (normal one)and raid in the other. Worked fine that way when I'd had trouble running it all from one box. Realtime 4K out from 5K R3Ds on a BM 4k extreme card in slot 3 of the tower as well as 4K Tiff/DPX of other formats.

But I can get away with one expander using Scratch with an AJA 3G in 4k mode....

 

[Charles Bergquist]

How are you powering the Titan inside the tower with the Red Rocket card? I'm looking to do the same but running out of power.

Thanks!

EDIT : Retracted, I see it's a PC tower, not a Mac Pro.

 

[Bob Gilles]

Motion Mount

Motion Mount

Do I need to buy the motion mount to get global shutter on the Dragon, or is it already baked in to this new sensor?

 

[Bob Gundu]

Need the mount.

Do I need to buy the motion mount to get global shutter on the Dragon, or is it already baked in to this new sensor?

 

[AndreasOberg]

Resolve 10 totally handles grading 6K DRAGON .r3ds no problem ... I think Robert's observation is more to do with the fact that there is no BMD DeckLink card in Rob's set up ... and at the moment HD SDI is not enabled on Red Rocket-X card (unless latest firmware upgrade takes care of that).

In the expansion box we have:
2 x TITANs
RR-X
Kona 3 (optional but useful for 4K out of FCP X)
10GbE Ethernet

System totally handles DRAGON footage grading in realtime to HD SDI monitor.

Neil

I'm a bit surprised that the 2 titans and RRX can live int he same expansion box. I would not have thought that the bandwidth would be enough for these 3 cards.
HOWEVER I'm not sure you need THAT much bandwidth when it comes to cuda calculations. Normally graphics cards use an enormouth bandwith because they are moving 3D textures and the full display image back and forward between the cpu and the graphic card. However this should not be the case with mathematical calculations as much. The calculations can be heavy even though there is not so much transfer of data between the card and the computer. If you have the time it would be very enlightening to see some benchmarks in Resolve.
One possible test would be to to a heavy test with maybe 20 nodes so that you are getting10fps with all 3 cards, then you take out one card at a time and see how this changes the performance.

I would do it myself if I had my hands on the hardware, but its out of my reach for the moment
/Andreas

 

[Rob Anderson]

How are you powering the Titan inside the tower with the Red Rocket card? I'm looking to do the same but running out of power.

Thanks! EDIT : Retracted, I see it's a PC tower, not a Mac Pro.

No, it's not a PC tower. This is the exact configuration and the only computer I have been referencing here:

Mac Pro 2012 with 12-cores (2x 3.06 6-Core Intel Xeon), 128 GB RAM
RED Rocket-X
Nvidia Titan

I detailed the power setup earlier. mini-6 to 6-pin splitter (provided by RED within the RR-X package) plus mini-6 to 6-pin to 8-pin adapter. That combination powers both the Nvidia Titan and the RR-X within a Mac Pro chassis. We've been running this configuration for more than 215 consecutive hours with lots of burn-in and rendering. Works wonderfully.

Not sure it's an option for you but I've put a couple of Blustor expanders on the two different ports of the bridge card- GPUs in one and rocket (normal one)and raid in the other. Worked fine that way when I'd had trouble running it all from one box. Realtime 4K out from 5K R3Ds on a BM 4k extreme card in slot 3 of the tower as well as 4K Tiff/DPX of other formats.

We have Silverstor and Bluestor expanders from JMR. We do not use them with the RR-X cards because they will not work correctly and will not provide the bandwidth required. RR-X should live in a true, single 16x PCIe slot. Previously, we ran multiple RR's out of the Bluestor. Great configuration. But as the RR-X is 5x the power of a single RR... No point in swallowing a 16x lane with a 16x expander card.

And if someone else is combining multiple GPU's AND an RR-X in an expander, you'd be choking that single 16x lane. Expanders are better served with PCIe RAIDs, I/O cards, original RR's, etc.

 

[AndreasOberg]

I'm also a big fan of the Pro I/O. Thanks to the module system, you can easily toss the Pro I/O to save weight with just two quarter twists of a torx screw. Amazing.

Fantastic thread. I really like seeing how you are setting every new thing up. I'm wondering how you are using the Pro I/O. In my setup audio is one of my biggest challenges. Caused me plenty of pain in our current movie.

The key things I would like to achieve are:
1) Having a dependable scratch track. Using the front ports are ok-ish, but had problems with connectors. So its working pretty ok.
2) Having production quality audio in the Epic. Yes for serious stuff we would use 8 channel pro recorders etc but for documentaries with only 2 people I think it would be nice to get the sound into the camera
3) Making syncing easier. I had SO much pain with syncing, dailies etc. I could imagine having another external recorder as well, as long as the syncing is easy but I'm using FCPX and syncing has not been easy here.

How is the timecode btw? Is it stable, I know Epic timecode is not stable, but would be great to not have to use a Lockit box.

Downsides with PRO I/O is that:
- its not exactly cheap at $3700
- Makes the camera more heavy. I often use the camera hand held, but maybe it will make it more balanced on the shoulder. How do you feel about handheld?
- only 2 channels right? Maybe you can get 4 with the front of the epic but they are not very good
- is the quality good enough compared to Sound Devices etc?

Once again. Please keep posting!
/Andreas

 

[Robert Ruffo New]

Need the mount.

For 100% global you need the mount, but read-out is vastly accelerated to the point where most shutter issues other than flashes/strobes are gone.

Tried Mount and it seems to have a variety of disturbing artifacts. I for one would rent it only when planning on shooting strobes.

 

[Jon Carr]

For 100% global you need the mount, but read-out is vastly accelerated to the point where most shutter issues other than flashes/strobes are gone.

Tried Mount and it seems to have a variety of disturbing artifacts. I for one would rent it only when planning on shooting strobes.

Can you post a still or video of the artifacts? I'm planning on pulling the trigger on a motion mount.

 

[Robert Ruffo New]

Resolve 10 totally handles grading 6K DRAGON .r3ds no problem ... I think Robert's observation is more to do with the fact that there is no BMD DeckLink card in Rob's set up ... and at the moment HD SDI is not enabled on Red Rocket-X card (unless latest firmware upgrade takes care of that).

In our Mac Pro DRAGON grading systems, we utilize a PCIe expansion box with this configuration:

MaPro:
K50000 GPU
PCIe expansion card
4K Extreme Decklink Card
SAS HBA

In the expansion box we have:
2 x TITANs
RR-X
Kona 3 (optional but useful for 4K out of FCP X)
10GbE Ethernet

System totally handles DRAGON footage grading in realtime to HD SDI monitor.

Neil

yes and No. The BM cards are sort of like dongles that you must buy in order to get a proper full screen output from Resolve. No other cards can be used for 2nd monitor output in Resolve

 

[Rob Anderson]

Screen grabs from another personal project I shot the other night. Dragon 6K FF. 3 light cans. 58mm and 85mm. Adjusted curves, otherwise ungraded.

Edit coming soon.

 

[Rob Anderson]

Fantastic thread. I really like seeing how you are setting every new thing up. I'm wondering how you are using the Pro I/O. In my setup audio is one of my biggest challenges. Caused me plenty of pain in our current movie.

(SNIP!) Pro I/O questions and thoughts.

Once again. Please keep posting!
/Andreas

Thank you Andreas. Sound quality with the Pro I/O is top-notch. Outstanding. Wouldn't use the front inputs because of flaky connector options. Prefer a locking XLR any day. Plus there's AES. I consider the Pro I/O vital and we bought one for every DSMC Epic/Dragon body we have because of that. While it may be heavy, it's just two quarter twists with a torx you're back to run and gun mode. Can't beat it. RED just doesn't get enough credit for the design of their modules.

We've run wireless lav receivers directly into the Pro I/O and it worked wonderfully. More typical however is to run sound to a digital recorder then output back to the Pro I/O for synchronization and a pristine scratch track.

I also use Rode microphones on shoe mounts for on camera (rare) and little sony snap-ins for the front inputs if I'm really desperate (or forgot the Rode and there's no loopback available for getting audio into the DSMC).

I have not worked with jamming timecode on the Dragon yet. I'll update when that happens.

 

[Robert Ruffo New]

Can you post a still or video of the artifacts? I'm planning on pulling the trigger on a motion mount.

I can't post anything from the shoot, least of all camera errors, but there were strange effects in the bokeh, which appeared during racks close to the near end of the lens. FXPHD noticed the same issues. You can Google the problem with those key words. Interaction with polarization filters also yielded some funky effects. I must say I am not a fan. I wish the thing existed in a filter version.