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  • Hey all, just changed over the backend after 15 years I figured time to give it a bit of an update, its probably gonna be a bit weird for most of you and i am sure there is a few bugs to work out but it should kinda work the same as before... hopefully :)

DaVinci Resolve 10 now grades DRAGON 6K natively ..... YES!

Neil W. Smith

Neil W. Smith

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So last night we were grading 6K ProRes4444 files from the DRAGON in Resolve 10 .... this morning we're grading 6K RAW DRAGON files natively in Resolve 10 ... amazing!

Kudos to Rohit and Peter for having their finger on the pulse and being able to move so fast .... DRAGON images look stunning and Resolve 10 with 6K RAW is easy peasy! .... kinda amazing to think you can grade the latest and greatest 6K camera files from RED on a $995 piece of software running on a Mac Pro.

As soon as Ketch and Jarred give us the all clear, we'll publish some screen grabs of Resolve 10 grading 6K Dragon .r3d files ... until then, you'll just have to take my word for it that they look bloody damn spiffing!!!

Also, just so RED Resolve users know - we'll be running a Resolve 10 workflow workshop with Peter Chamberlain at the end of October here on The Lot in West Hollywood and a 'Resolve 10 for non colorists' training day with Andrew Balis in early November. There'll be small charge for each event to help defray some of our costs but if you want to see Resolve 10 in action you might want to come along ... hopefully by then, we'll also be able to show you some of this hot steamy 6K stuff that's coming out of the Dragon's mouth.

Will publish details of upcoming Resolve 10 training events as soon as I can stop playing with all this amazing gear.

Cheers,
Neil
 
Awesome!


Any word on Resolve 10 getting the SDK for R3D GPU support? That would make my day all over again.
 
Resolve 10 and RED SDK ...

Resolve 10 and RED SDK ...

Zac C said:
Awesome!

Any word on Resolve 10 getting the SDK for R3D GPU support? That would make my day all over again.
Click to expand...

Awesome is the word .... that and WOW! ... we've used them quite a lot over the last few days :-)

Re the question on the SDK, that's a question for Jarred, Graeme, Peter and Rohit I'm afraid ... suspect they are all busy beavering away to make it happen as soon as possible ... the existing Color 2 color science works very well ... as soon as you dial in Red Gamma3 and RedFilm Log you have all the dynamic range you could possibly wish for - totally amazing and skin tones are gorgeous ... then let Resolve 10 work its magic and you and pretty soon you have a visual feast fit for a King ... Ketch really knew how to get the most out of the new sensor - the man is a genius.

As soon as we hear anything on the new Dragon color science and Resolve 10 we'll let you know ... if you live in LA come along to the end of October Resolve 10 workshop and you can ask Peter Chamberlain (DaVinci Resolve Product Manager) the question directly.

Cheers.
 
WOW ROCK`N`ROlla DAvinci ;) and RED DRAGON..

I can not wait to see and play with some pictures.
Rohit and Peter, a big thank you is not enough.

Neil thanks for the info;)


Luigi
 
New era of RED post

New era of RED post

When I started working with R3Ds 6 years ago the only programs that could handle native files were Red's tools and Scratch. Workflows typically started by creating DPX, ProRes or some other format that existing tools could handle. Gradually, more programs added R3D support in some form, RED became more adept at creating SDKs and Graeme kept improving the color science. These days RED post is evolved enough to support several solid workflow options. That said, anyone with a lot of footage and short turnaround times needed a $5,000 RedRocket accelerator card that could crunch R3Ds nicely, but had little effect on overall system performance. Tough sell unless you do a decent volume of RED work.

By 2013 every major NLE/grading/finishing vendor had made native R3D support a priority because of market share, but CPU dependence sans Rocket remained frustrating for people on older hardware. Once RCX-Pro and the SDK are able to leverage multi GPU configurations, it's a new ballgame. Modern graphics cards, largely developed for the gamers, have achieved levels of performance that will enable under $10,000 workstation builds to not only chew 6K R3Ds for breakfast, but also speed up other key programs (BlackMagic Resolve, AE, etc) and operations. To be clear, you don't have to buy a beefy workstation to work with R3Ds - thanks to RedCode's wavelet architecture, intense development of micro processors for mobile applications, fast I/O like USB 3 and Thunderbolt - higher end laptops are viable options. Moreover, I expect the new MacPro, particularly when configured with higher end GPUs, to rock R3Ds, but until they ship that's just speculation...

Kudos to the Madman, the Fire Cheif and the entire RedTeam for conceptualizing and manifesting a modern digital cinema ecosystem. I put down my deposit on #19 at NAB 2006 because where RED was headed made sense to me. By NAB 2014 I expect the hardware/software tools to have matured to the point where one can enjoy IQ worthy of the term "digital cinema" without requiring a heavy iron back end, or a one trick pony PCI-e card, or plenty of patience. Combine that with the capabilities of the Dragon sensor and Bob's Your Uncle.

Cheers - #19
 
That is fantastic news. Would be really cool to see just how much better you can grade the images.
/Andreas
 
I assume you're finishing in 4K...have you noticed a difference in image sharpness in Dragon over MX at 4K?
 
6K fnishing ....

6K fnishing ....

David Kudell said:
I assume you're finishing in 4K...have you noticed a difference in image sharpness in Dragon over MX at 4K?
Click to expand...

Interesting question, David .... in a way, we're actually finishing in 6K .... for the purposes of this project we took the DRAGON .r3ds into RCX-Pro and rendered out 6K ProRes files ... we then imported the 6K ProRes files into Apple FCP X and edited them .... then sent an XML into DaVinci Resolve 10 (big thanks to Rohit) and then conformed directly to the DRAGON .3rds and graded them using the RED RAW controls in Resolve 10.

Now this is where it gets a bit tricky ... our DI projector is a Barco 2K DLP and we were using Resolve to downscale the 6K image to 2K in order to see the whole frame up on the screen .... usually when grading RED we'll apply a little bit of sharpening as the last part of the finishing process before we render out final deliverables but with the DRAGON footage it didn't seem at all necessary ... everything was crisp and sharp with very natural looking skin tones ... so we left it as it is.

The other interesting thing I tried out was to turn off the video-out downrezzing in Resolve and look at a pixel for pixel image up on the screen .... we have a special non-perforated Stewart DI screen so there's no holes to cause problems .... obviously on a 2K projector you're only going to see a small proportion of a 6K image but in one scene, one of the actress's eyes just happened to be in the right place and totally filled the screen - Holy Crap Batman! .... talk about sharpness and detail .... amazing!

This is all very subjective but we've been grading RED imagery since day #1 and have tested all the different RED cameras and this DRAGON footage is in a different league to the MX sensor .... I guess we'll just have to wait for Graeme to publish one of his famous Sine Zone Charts to see the objective differences between the sensors but to my eye, the 6K resolution combined with Nyquist sampling theory is going to deliver a very sharp and well defined image at 4K.

In the meantime I suggest you start saving your pennies ... once you see this Dragon beast in action, you're going to want one for sure.

Cheers,
Neil
 
DRAGON plus Resolve 10 plus Apple FCP X

DRAGON plus Resolve 10 plus Apple FCP X

Phil Holland said:
Is this the beta released on 09.13.2013? Or is this a newer upcoming release?
Click to expand...

Probably a newer version, Phil ... it may not be public up on the BMD site yet ... but it definitely works very well .... we sent the XML out of FCP X to Resolve 10 and conformed the cut against the 6K .r3d files ... worked first time!

Never thought I'd be grading 6K RAW files on a $995 piece of software running on a bog standard Mac Pro Tower ... can't wait for the new Mac Pro cylinders to arrive ... combination of the new Apple hardware plus Mavericks and FCP X and DaVinci Resolve 10 for handling the DRAGON 6K pipeline is going to be a game changer.

Hope you can make it along to the Resolve 10 training session we're running with Peter Chamberlain (DaVinci Resolve Product Manager) at the end of October ... he's a very cool guy, and obviously knows a thing or two about Resolve 10 ... like, just about everything!

At our '4K Unplugged' session last Saturday we demoed Resolve LIVE for onset look management using the BMD camera connected through Thunderbolt to an iMac ... you press the Resolve LIVE button on the Color Page and lo and behold you see what he camera is seeing ... dial in the look, grab the still with the attached grading node and send it along to the colorist to use as a reference for the online grading ... very cool way for a DIT to make sure that the creative intent the DP is going for is communicated accurately and easily to the Dailies Editor as well as to the Final Colorist .... great functionality built into Resolve 10 and of course totally free with Resolve Lite and runs on a laptop - amazing!

Kinda hoping that Jarred will bring his DRAGON over and we can test out Resolve LIVE with the DRAGON connected through HD SDI to a laptop running Resolve 10 ;-) ... set the looks on-set and then send the node off to post ... now that will be a wicked combination! And then use the new Audio and Dailies functionality built into Resolve 10 and you can sync your RED dailies with a click of a button - apply the Log to Linear LUT you want and then render out your editorial version (ProRes or DNxHD) and any iPad H.264 dailies all with the click of a button ... no need for an expensive heavy iron solution .... as soon as RedRocket X gets here, plug that into a MAGMA 1T expansion box and Bob's Your Uncle!

What RED have done with the DRAGON sensor is nothing short of revolutionary ... combine that with what Apple and Blackmagic are doing and you have the 6K production and post pipeline of the future at a price that everyone can afford.

Really is an astonishing time to be a RED filmmaker (just ask David Fincher) ... the Tao of the Dragon is a path of great beauty and wonderment.

Cheers,
Neil
 
Neil W. Smith said:
This is all very subjective but we've been grading RED imagery since day #1 and have tested all the different RED cameras and this DRAGON footage is in a different league to the MX sensor .... I guess we'll just have to wait for Graeme to publish one of his famous Sine Zone Charts to see the objective differences between the sensors but to my eye, the 6K resolution combined with Nyquist sampling theory is going to deliver a very sharp and well defined image at 4K.

In the meantime I suggest you start saving your pennies ... once you see this Dragon beast in action, you're going to want one for sure.

Cheers,
Neil
Click to expand...

Thanks so much for the in-depth response. I am excited to work with Dragon footage and upgrade our camera. We are shooting scenic footage to play in 4K on the Sony 84" UHD displays and this is the first time I have worked in 4k in Resolve. While the Epic footage looks great, I was expecting it to be a bit sharper when viewed at 100%, until I read that Red doesn't do any in-camera sharpening. We are using Optimo DP and Ultra Prime lenses which are really sharp.

I'm still not planning to add any sharpening until we get both our Red Ray and our 84" display to see how it looks naturally. I was hoping that shooting at 6K will add an additional level of clarity when viewing at 4K, and I totally understand now why Red increased the resolution with Dragon.

I also have a Mac Pro and Am looking forward to upgrading to the new one for working at these higher resolutions. I get GPU memory full messages in Resolve when trying to export my timeline at UHD, even with 2 Quadro 4000's. I need a GTX card, but I'm holding out to see if the new Mac Pros make it out first.
 
Perfect fit for DRAGON ...

Perfect fit for DRAGON ...

David Kudell said:
Thanks so much for the in-depth response. I am excited to work with Dragon footage and upgrade our camera. We are shooting scenic footage to play in 4K on the Sony 84" UHD displays and this is the first time I have worked in 4k in Resolve. While the Epic footage looks great, I was expecting it to be a bit sharper when viewed at 100%, until I read that Red doesn't do any in-camera sharpening. We are using Optimo DP and Ultra Prime lenses which are really sharp.

I'm still not planning to add any sharpening until we get both our Red Ray and our 84" display to see how it looks naturally. I was hoping that shooting at 6K will add an additional level of clarity when viewing at 4K, and I totally understand now why Red increased the resolution with Dragon.

I also have a Mac Pro and Am looking forward to upgrading to the new one for working at these higher resolutions. I get GPU memory full messages in Resolve when trying to export my timeline at UHD, even with 2 Quadro 4000's. I need a GTX card, but I'm holding out to see if the new Mac Pros make it out first.
Click to expand...

The requirements you describe above, David, are a perfect fit for the DRAGON ... high detailed scenic footage shot at 6K and down sampled to UHDTV is definitely going to be one of the applications that will benefit tremendously from the superior resolution and image fidelity of the new DRAGON sensor.

And funnily enough, I just change my RU Avatar to say 6K and UHDTV :-)

I'd be very interested in seeing what you guys are up to - have you got to access to the 84" Sony UHDTV yet? ... great lens choice for the EPIC but you still might want to apply a touch of sharpening at the end of your grading.

For improved .r3d rendering speeds you should stick a RedRocket and a couple of TITANS or GTX 690s into an expansion chassis ... but you right to wait until the new Mac Pro Cylinder starts to ship ... that beast is a game changer along with FCP X and Resolve 10.

The new RedCine-X PRO with GPU accelerations also benefits greatly from a beefy GPU ... the Q4000s are a bit long in the tooth now.

Next time you're up in West Hollywood area stop by and I'll buy you lunch - there maybe an area of collaboration we can work on together.

The DRAGON is not just a bigger sensor, it's a better sensor - perfect fit for the kind of work you're doing.

Cheers,
Neil
 
Ha ha, Neil, I love your new AVATAR!!

Besides that you continue to be too kind with words in my regard...

Most of the credit goes to the Dragon, and the lights, the crew the cast and of course the lenses... I just played as the Master of the scene... But all credits are equally shared amongst people and tools, and very importantly, that includes you guys and your facilities as well as your own set of particular tools... ;)

Btw, if I wasn't already hooked on to FCPX & DaVinci Resolve 10, I would definitely be after our experience working on "The RED dress" Dragon material, and I seriously intend to NOW put my foot down and properly LEARN both FCPX & Resolve...


So if I am still in town or back in town, I hope you can have a SEAT reserved for me on your sessions... Cause I would not want to miss any of them!!
 
Thanks Neil - haven't received our 84" displays yet, but they've been ordered. I am waiting now to see when the Mac Pros might come out, before I know whether I need to buy another GPU or will have the new Mac in time.

Thanks for the offer to visit next time I'm in LA - I would love to see your setup. Pechanga is not too far from LA.

I do have one more Resolve question. When grading, I had set my timeline to 1080p and then output in UHD. But the renders were soft. Then I set my timeline to UHD and output in UHD and it was much sharper. So it does matter what your timeline is when you output it appears. Have you found that to be the case?
 
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