Cheap third party Red MiniMag replacement - JinniMag?

[Nathan DuMoulin]

I commend you all for being such die hard RED fans but I wouldn't be so quick to judge a product before it even hits shelves.

Red has every right to protect their products and accessories. It's quite simple, if you don't like Red's prices, then don't buy their products in the first place. There are plenty of other cheaper camera manufacturers that you can choose to support instead.

I've never hesitated to speak up when I think Red has made a mistake (in fact, I just did a few hours ago regarding the Helium sale). Not all of us are fanboys, as there is a big difference between a fanboy and a Red supporter. Red innovates and although they aren't perfect, I support them both in gest, as well as with my wallet. I can't, nor will I, do the same for an unapproved and unprofessional company that is trying to profit by exploiting the hard work of others.

 

[Steve Sherrick]

Last time I checked, anyone ripping off a patent never really cared about the legal ramifications? NAB 2016 was the year of Chinese knockoffs. Your dealing with international patent litigation. That stuff takes forever!
Perfect example. Hoverboards. Every single hoverboard you have ever seen was a patent infringement. Segway owns the patent to that gyro tech but look how long it took them to actually get that enforced and get them off the market. They sold millions of hoverboards before the courts caught up. Just enough time to make a shit ton of $$$. If its popular, someone WILL rip it off. Not a matter of IF but WHEN.
RED makes great media but it is not bullet proof. Take a scroll through REDuser and find many instances of RED media failing. Arri's don't use RED media. They MUST lose footage all the time with that inferior media!
I commend you all for being such die hard RED fans but I wouldn't be so quick to judge a product before it even hits shelves. Let's go back to RED's early days when most people very well could call RED Vaporware. How long did some of you wait for your camera after putting down a deposit for a RED1? A little competition on RED's high priced media isn't such a bad thing.
RED opened its doors to indie filmmakers with their 2 low end cameras and the response was so overwhelming they can't keep up. Previous to the low end cameras there wasn't a market for 3rd party mags because the RED userbase was so small and dedicated to the RED brand. Things are much different now. Sure, some of you won't buy them because RED's name isn't on it, but there is a large group of people who will buy them, who will use them and who will capture great imagery on them.

In order to do so, they are going to have to bypass RED's firmware. I'm sure there are clever enough people out there that can and will find ways to get around these things, but believe me, Jim and Jarred have a decent size hammer and you don't want to be a nail that doesn't belong in the RED house. I'm sure no one loves paying the prices for authentic RED media, but it's part of the cost of entry and it's what RED feels they need to charge to make their bottom line. I think the people behind Jinnimag need to realize what the precedent has been when it comes to this stuff.

 

[konrad grant]

To me, it doesn't matter if the product is good or not. It's a rip-off. And it's a direct attack on RED and all the hard working people of that company. That's not about competition, it is about stealing a piece of the cake.

When you shot your movie, start to sell it and then see it pop up pirated copies on the market. Is that competition?

business is all about stealing a bit of the cake , yes, that's competition / capitalism at work

i don't like the sentence structures either .. perhaps they're good at ssd design, but just bad at grammar .. umm

 

[Cameron McKinlay]

if you don't like Red's prices, then don't buy their products in the first place.

Your right, I don't like RED's media prices, we all know they are incredibly over-inflated $/per/GB. But I still had to purchased a few... And if these come to market, I will pick up a few of these as well. Because while RED runs a business and needs to make money. So do I. So if I can find places to save money, I absolutely will. If they constantly crash and have problems...I sell them, no harm done.
Some of you are talking like these Jinnimags are going to bankrupt RED if they come to market. lol

 

[Matt Beardsley]

From a graphic design standpoint, that RED logo knock-off is a swing and a miss. Not going to win over the visually-trained artists around here like that!

 

[Cameron McKinlay]

It will be interesting to see how this all plays out though. Jarred's responses sounds like these caught him off guard like the rest of us. Now it will be a race to see if they can get them to market before RED sues them to the stone age for patent infringement which will most likely take them a year if not longer. Time will tell.

 

[Jarred Land]

Guys... I can't tell you how much this pisses me off. Not from a business perspective, but as a patent holder and a creator.

Like all of you, we spend a lot of time money and effort creating what we do.

For our media, we developed our own IP and Firmware and spent millions of dollars testing, certifying and QC every media card that we ship. Its why we have significantly less card errors than other companies using generic media... even reputable generic media.

Media is one of the most critical components of the entire system and the way we write to a card is very different than a normal SSD is programed for.

For some random company to hack and duplicate our IP and our firmware ( which is the only way they could do this ) is exactly like someone stealing your films and calling them their own and selling them to others. It goes against everything I stand for.


I don't know where this company is from. I assume the UK cover is just bullshit. Someone said China but I really hope this is not the case as China has made such significant improvements over the last decade turning around their attitude towards Copyright infringement , Trademark violations , and IP theft ( which it appears this company has broken all three in one swoop )

I am shocked some of you are here are actually endorsing this.

I will shut RED completely down... I am not kidding... If stealing each others shit suddenly is deemed acceptable.

It's not a world I want to work or create or live in.


Jarred

 

[Matthew Quinn]

the only ones endorsing it here I don't think even own a red, or have much respect for it. I'll hang onto my redmags thx

 

[Bob Gundu]

Bite the bullet and get the real deal. I have never had any issue using RED media, but if shit hit the fan, and you call RED for support on a corrupted frame or clip, how are you going to rule out the third party media? I'm sure those log files will indicate non authentic cards, and if so, you may be screwed. Buy once, cry once.

 

[Steve Sherrick]

Guys... I can't tell you how much this pisses me off. Not from a business perspective, but as a patent holder and a creator.

Like all of you, we spend a lot of time money and effort creating what we do.

For our media, we developed our own IP and Firmware and spent millions of dollars testing, certifying and QC every media card that we ship. Its why we have significantly less card errors than other companies using generic media... even reputable generic media.

Media is one of the most critical components of the entire system and the way we write to a card is very different than a normal SSD is programed for.

For some random company to hack and duplicate our IP and our firmware ( which is the only way they could do this ) is exactly like someone stealing your films and calling them their own and selling them to others. It goes against everything I stand for.


I don't know where this company is from. I assume the UK cover is just bullshit. Someone said China but I really hope this is not the case as China has made such significant improvements over the last decade turning around their attitude towards Copyright infringement , Trademark violations , and IP theft ( which it appears this company has broken all three in one swoop )

I am shocked some of you are here actually endorsing this.

I will shut RED completely down... I am not kidding... If stealing each others shit suddenly is deemed acceptable.

It's not a world I want to work or create or live in.


Jarred

It's happening everywhere and it pisses me off too. Makes it tough for companies to want to innovate and create stuff. Someone will just rip them off. As I said, no one wants to pay thousands of dollars for media. But it is what it is and with that expense comes an expectation, that the media will perform at the highest level, on the most important shoots. So, regardless if this company has hacked the firmware and selling them for cheap, it's not good business for any of us who put our reputation on the line to use this media.

 

[Brendan H. Banks]

Guys... I can't tell you how much this pisses me off. Not from a business perspective, but as a patent holder and a creator.

Like all of you, we spend a lot of time money and effort creating what we do.

For our media, we developed our own IP and Firmware and spent millions of dollars testing, certifying and QC every media card that we ship. Its why we have significantly less card errors than other companies using generic media... even reputable generic media.

Media is one of the most critical components of the entire system and the way we write to a card is very different than a normal SSD is programed for.

For some random company to hack and duplicate our IP and our firmware ( which is the only way they could do this ) is exactly like someone stealing your films and calling them their own and selling them to others. It goes against everything I stand for.


I don't know where this company is from. I assume the UK cover is just bullshit. Someone said China but I really hope this is not the case as China has made such significant improvements over the last decade turning around their attitude towards Copyright infringement , Trademark violations , and IP theft ( which it appears this company has broken all three in one swoop )

I am shocked some of you are here are actually endorsing this.

I will shut RED completely down... I am not kidding... If stealing each others shit suddenly is deemed acceptable.

It's not a world I want to work or create or live in.


Jarred

Somehow people forget that innovation requires R&D with hefty budgets. That QC requires constant financial draw, almost solely for the customer. How many people here have spent tens, hundreds, thousands of hours researching gear to put together their perfect kit...only to have someone say "dude, just tell me what to buy, I don't really wanna look all this up"? Don't you feel overlooked and undervalued?

Those piracy ads in the 2000s may have been a bit wack, but they weren't wrong...

"You wouldn't steal a film...don't steal a RedMag"

 

[Nick Morrison]

These cheap knock off SSDs are clearly engaging in criminal behavior.

Not OK.

Stealing tech...yet wrapping themselves in the flag of "competition"...is NOT how capitalism works.

I have to imagine these knocks offs are a firmware update away...from obsolesence...

 

[Steve DiMaggio]

"I am shocked some of you are here are actually endorsing this.

I will shut RED completely down... I am not kidding... If stealing each others shit suddenly is deemed acceptable.

It's not a world I want to work or create or live in. "
hell yeah dude, I watched this shit happen on the NAMM floor for years

 

[Reuben Evans]

Disappointing and not cool.

 

[Kyle Dones]

...

I am shocked some of you are here are actually endorsing this.

I will shut RED completely down... I am not kidding... If stealing each others shit suddenly is deemed acceptable.

...

Jarred

Bring those that threaten RED to Chicago...

 

[Detlev Eller]

...

I will shut RED completely down... I am not kidding... If stealing each others shit suddenly is deemed acceptable.

It's not a world I want to work or create or live in.


Jarred

unfortunately and heartbreakingly ... that is the reality of software and content creators all over the planet since the very beginning of the public interwebs.
too many people, educated and not poor, i have witnessed having no issues whatsoever to search for and download "free" copies of books and films.

It´s disgusting. and it is deemed acceptable everywhere but in a few homes.

let us not be defeated by the dark side - may the force be with you, always.


Detlev

 

[Levi Arnold]

Saw this on FB and thought maybe it was a third-party licensing deal. Definitely won't be looking into it anymore since, according to Jarred, they just ripped the RED Mag off completely. Idiots.

 

[Spencer Weaver]

These cheap knock off SSDs are clearly engaging in criminal behavior.

Not OK.

Stealing tech...yet wrapping themselves in the flag of "competition"...is NOT how capitalism works.

I have to imagine these knocks offs are a firmware update away...from obsolesence...

Exactly!

I mean I still can't understand why are people getting behind this and saying it's "good"....

Morally it's wrong. Ethically it's wrong. And technically, why would you want to chance your shoot on media that is iffy at best.... and that presently doesn't even exist beyond some 3D renders!

Why would you leave RED and go with this company that literally shows up over night? And the way they made their entrance is just so awful... without consulting RED or evening seeking to be friends or play nice... they just show up and say... "We ripped RED off and are willing to sell it back to you for pennies on the dollar... if you join us"

It's nuts.

They have no product. They have no demo. And yet people are head over heals in love, saying it's a good thing.

I don't have all the money in the world. That's why I own a Scarlet-W and not a 6K WEAPON or Helium. That's why I only have two mini mags and have to transfer footage throughout the day on set.
I work hard and I am saving up for more trusted RED minimags. I know it will be a good investment.

This is ethics. This is morals. This is technology conscientiousness.

Be smart people.

 

[jordan levy]

Last time I checked, anyone ripping off a patent never really cared about the legal ramifications? NAB 2016 was the year of Chinese knockoffs. Your dealing with international patent litigation. That stuff takes forever!
Perfect example. Hoverboards. Every single hoverboard you have ever seen was a patent infringement. Segway owns the patent to that gyro tech but look how long it took them to actually get that enforced and get them off the market. They sold millions of hoverboards before the courts caught up. Just enough time to make a shit ton of $$$. If its popular, someone WILL rip it off. Not a matter of IF but WHEN.
RED makes great media but it is not bullet proof. Take a scroll through REDuser and find many instances of RED media failing. Arri's don't use RED media. They MUST lose footage all the time with that inferior media!
I commend you all for being such die hard RED fans but I wouldn't be so quick to judge a product before it even hits shelves. Let's go back to RED's early days when most people very well could call RED Vaporware. How long did some of you wait for your camera after putting down a deposit for a RED1? A little competition on RED's high priced media isn't such a bad thing.
RED opened its doors to indie filmmakers with their 2 low end cameras and the response was so overwhelming they can't keep up. Previous to the low end cameras there wasn't a market for 3rd party mags because the RED userbase was so small and dedicated to the RED brand. Things are much different now. Sure, some of you won't buy them because RED's name isn't on it, but there is a large group of people who will buy them, who will use them and who will capture great imagery on them.

dude you have to drop it, you been going on and on about this on facebook as well, they dont exist, they will never exist. now you've heard it form the horses mouth.
your quest has ended and its best to erase your mind from it and make it as it never happened.

 

[Jarred Land]

Your right, I don't like RED's media prices, we all know they are incredibly over-inflated $/per/GB. But I still had to purchased a few... And if these come to market, I will pick up a few of these as well. Because while RED runs a business and needs to make money. So do I. So if I can find places to save money, I absolutely will. If they constantly crash and have problems...I sell them, no harm done.
Some of you are talking like these Jinnimags are going to bankrupt RED if they come to market. lol

You don't get it. This isn't about the money or even about media.

We invented something. Someone is saying they have stole it. And you are sitting there telling everyone that is ok.

It is the same as if you saved up or borrowed $10,000,000 and went and wrote and directed and shot your film. you edit it together and finish it and put it up on Itunes for $9.99 to get your money back.

But someone from china looks at your film and likes it and says " Fuck that guy charging $9.99 for his film on Itunes. I don't think people should pay that much. Lets just download this guys film, steal it , change the opening credits with our logo and reupload it on Itunes and only charge $1.00.

That's not right..

Lawyers will deal with these guys doing this.... but it is you guys that think that this is OK that have me way way way more pissed off.