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  • Hey all, just changed over the backend after 15 years I figured time to give it a bit of an update, its probably gonna be a bit weird for most of you and i am sure there is a few bugs to work out but it should kinda work the same as before... hopefully :)

Can 3D make you sick?

Just the massive presence of 3D on the NAB show floor this year made me sick.
 
the price of everything 3D can make you sick........
 
Steve Sherrick said:
I know, it's CNN so take this with a grain of salt, but nonetheless here is an article in case you missed it. I suppose the long term effects are the most interesting, because the reality is, no one knows yet.

http://www.cnn.com/2010/HEALTH/04/23/3d.vision.brain/index.html?hpt=C1
Click to expand...

Okay,

first of all thanks Steve for posting this, I wanted to do it my self but I didn't now you give me an excuse to comment on it, and you know from our last conversation in Vegas during your Red Day location scouting we talked about this for hours, so here it goes.



I have been called several times to talk about S3D and what and how etc. etc. and I have not done it exactly for this reason, news channels tend to just simply edit material were they have just no clue what they are saying and how they are saying it! ;~)

Some of what is written is true but taken out of context some is just simply wrong.

Any way let me try to explain very quickly here how much they got it wrong and so with it don't know which Eye doctor they went to, but if they let me know I can go teach them a thing or two about image processing of the Visual Cortex and how the Human Brain processes the Disparities which come by the fact that our eyes do to their placement and distance from each other cross process anything we see by a precise margin, which is what gets achieved when producing S3D.

Now the fact that S3D reproduces what we normally see in our world, (well not all of us as unfortunately there is an approximate 15 to 18% from the last reports ) that simply do to unique conditions can not see S3D not even with Polarized or Shutter glasses, as either their Visual cortex has lost the capability to report the needed information to the Brain, and or has lost the capacity to simply Identify the Disparities in the perfectly needed way in order to process the S3D effect and this individuals in real life see a Monoscopic version of what we see, not like some one with one eye, not at all, very differently in fact, but some what completely different from what we can process, yet they do not know the difference as they have been accustom to this since birth, so they simply just see Blurry images double time when watching S3D. Not aGood Filling at all I imagine.

Different is instead the experience form those individual that suffer from other know Eye anomalies, and some of which did during the course of their lives, making more difficult to adjust and creating some serious disfunction with in the Visual Cortex response, were they hit things either from one side or the other, or don't understand the speed in which an object is coming at them making it difficult to avoid, very sad situations, and some of them experience serious problems, getting Motion seek etc easier then any one else especially one in moving vehicles or watching fast paced movies.


Now back to the making of S3D, there is no such a thing that getting seek is because of S3D or just because of it, and that the more you watch the worst it is, quite the opposite is true in fact, because the Eye muscles need to get a good work out and learn how to process and visualized the projected images by sending all the information received to the Brain, but since here they are processed thru a FAKE 3D world achieved by processing Disparities in the Double images filtered via Polarizer and Shutter Glasses, the Brain works double time, Literally, and the Visual Cortex is in a work out class.

Now if you go to the Gym, and I don't care how strong you are, if you work out 2 hours strait lifting 200lb with never resting, you simply pass out get seek and drop on the floor, well S3D is not much different, as the Visual Cortex processes images and sends them to the Brain for translation the Visual Cortex Muscle are working out hard, and in ways that they do not do in regular life styles out of the S3D screen, for this when S3D or 3D animation is projected with continuos OUT of SCREEN action JUMPING at you, the Visual Cortex has no rest, the muscles get extremely tired and you get seek because the Brain can no longer receive the correct information form the Tired visual Cortex muscles.

But the more you watch S3D Material the more the Visual Cortex muscle work out, the stronger they get and the better the process of sending and receiving and processing Image Disparities gets,and the more you will enjoy S3D movies and the less chances to get seek even when extreme Disparities are presented, and or also when the velocity of the in Screen action happens as well as when Jump Depth Cuts take place, those which watched more S3D material will absorb and process many times better then some one watching for the first time.

Now a part form all the above, there is simply instances of BAD S3D material, which was not acquired correctly and was not Processed correctly in Post to correct the mistakes made on Set, either for luck of knowledge or simply because they just can't do miracles, screwing up on a Monoscopic set, we all have heard we fix that in Post, well in S3D this only works in extremely Marginal ways, and if the Director refuses to let go of the F^#@ UP scene then you get seek when you watch it.

If the S3D Material was captured perfectly, and in Post they did even a greater job, making it a better transitional Material, they can always screw this up on the Projection screen, by not giving in off Lumens to the Lens, just to save energy and make the Expensive Bulbs last longer, and or the system is simply not in perfect Focus, and or some screen don't even have the write Screen!!

Now if by chance every one did a perfect Job, from Writing the material correctly, acquisition was done perfectly acquiring the Images with well calculated Disparities, in Post they made miracles and created a final piece of Art as they did with Avatar, IMO, then lets also say that the Screening rooms have a perfectly calibrated Projector, with the needed added Lumens power, and perfectly in Focus, and that they do have the Perfect Silver screen..

well there is still people which will not enjoy the S3D Movie they went to see, simply because Movie Owners still do not understand that in order to have an optimal Experience, viewers can not seat on the outer Cone as their Visual Cortex will fail to enterprete the S3D disparities from such wide angle and distance form the center while being so close to the Screen, while others seating in the inside of the cone, will have different experience depending on the Distance form the screen it self, and their position in the Cone, were the Inside of the Screen and the Out side of the Screen images come to them at completely different levels. sizes, and speed, but at list no one will get seek inside the Cone.

My goal would be to have cinemas find a way to Block out those Troublesome seats and so non one gets seek when everything is done the right way.


I take S3D and its future very seriously and my studies during the past 3 years, have taken me to a different appreciation of this Art Form and I wish to use it to express the Emotions of my Films, while hopping that uninformed articles such as the one Steve posted ruin it for all of us, which work hard on getting things right before Making something that simply will make people seek.
 
Similar bad publicity all accros our media over here. Seems like the only way to reach their public and earn money , mostly when you don't have subjects and good stories to tell, then why don't just take a new product and bash it.

They just needed a topic and made themselves look important to set something straight. The interviews were ridiculous as well with not one experienced and well educated expert in this field.

They did'nt even mention there were different approaches and ways to project this stereo.
 
Steve Sherrick said:
I know, it's CNN so take this with a grain of salt, but nonetheless here is an article in case you missed it. I suppose the long term effects are the most interesting, because the reality is, no one knows yet.

http://www.cnn.com/2010/HEALTH/04/23/3d.vision.brain/index.html?hpt=C1
Click to expand...

Short answer - Yes, 3D can make you sick.

I've been in several 3D grading sessions where the colorist was screwing with convergence over... and over... and over... and making everybody in the room nauseous.
 
Barry Gregg said:
I was born cross-eyed. Didn't receive surgery until I was 2 1/2 years old. No 3D vision here, and for up to 10% of the population. It makes me sick because I always see two images. Not a fan of 3D at all.
Click to expand...

Barry my wife has a depth perception issue with her vision as well so 3D movies just cause a brutal migraine for her and she sees two images the entire time.
 
Lucas Wilson said:
Short answer - Yes, 3D can make you sick.

I've been in several 3D grading sessions where the colorist was screwing with convergence over... and over... and over... and making everybody in the room nauseous.
Click to expand...

Yes extreme convergence will definitely cause the Visual Cortex Muscle to stress the eye in to unnatural ways yet the Brain continues to try and make senses of it all and this extreme fatigue causes Migraines and seekness Motion like from luck of resolving and making basically senses of it all , so Vomit as if strong motion seekness happens to those of a less strong stomach, and it is extremely unwise to to subject one self to this as it can literally create chronic issues with ones vision.
 
I just hated the 3D i have seen at NAB this year.

Very distracting from the story.

Looks like plastic layers.

I really hope it will drastically improve.

Antoine
 
Well, I got a splitting headache while watching Avatar in IMAX 3D. I enjoyed the movie, and thought it looked amazing, though.

However, I saw How To Train Your Dragon the other day and got zero headaches. Maybe because it's only 98 minutes, as opposed to Avatar's 162 minutes.
 
Last edited:
We will see plenty of BAD 3D for sure - but when it's good - it's a very cool, dynamic format.

In the not too distant future - you will start to see GOOD and even GREAT 3D.
 
Jaime Vallés said:
Well, I got a splitting headache while watching Avatar in IMAX 3D. I enjoyed the movie, and thought it looked amazing, though.

However, I saw How To Train Your Dragon the other day and got zero headaches. Maybe because it's only 98 minutes, as opposed to Avatar's 162 minutes.
Click to expand...

When I went to see the IMAX 3d version, they had four rows of seats blocked off as not suitable for 3D viewing. Either closer or further away was fine. Go figure.
 
David Rasberry said:
When I went to see the IMAX 3d version, they had four rows of seats blocked off as not suitable for 3D viewing. Either closer or further away was fine. Go figure.
Click to expand...

If you read my first reply above, you see that this is actually an Ideal move by the Tether Owners as there is a specific area which does not allow for ideal viewing of S3D and every one should block this seats off, in order to avoid Patrons seating out side the Cone ( ideal viewing area perimeter) and for this also avoid to give Patron a bad S3D viewing experience.

So Kudos to the Cinema Owners were you went, and I always stress this factor and try to teach Cinema Owners when I go to their Cinemas, some totally agree after a test and act upon others just say that by CODE they are not allow to block off seats, which off course is not true!!


They just want to maximize capacity at the expense of the Patrons!
 
Just hearing that Clash Of The Titans had been turned into 3D made me sick. Studio deals bumped How To Train Your Dragon off the high dollar screens after one week. Basically taking box office from a good 3D production (conceived that way from the beginning) to a bad last minute hack job.
 
I was never able to see 3D until Avatar. I don't know what they used that was different but I was able to see the effect the whole time. Every other movie the shots didn't hold long enough for my eyes to adjust. The only other time I saw 3D was with the Happy Feet teaser. It was a one long shot of him dancing. I'm totally psyched to learn whatever I can to shoot 3D but I wonder if I'm handicapped to the point where I won't be able to do it.
 
Spike said:
I was never able to see 3D until Avatar. I don't know what they used that was different but I was able to see the effect the whole time. Every other movie the shots didn't hold long enough for my eyes to adjust. The only other time I saw 3D was with the Happy Feet teaser. It was a one long shot of him dancing. I'm totally psyched to learn whatever I can to shoot 3D but I wonder if I'm handicapped to the point where I won't be able to do it.
Click to expand...

"House of Wax 3D" was directed by the great Andre De Toth who only had one eye! He appears after the intermission as a top-hatted dandy with a paddleball making the front rows duck as he hits the ball out at them. A nice little in-joke that was used in "Monsters Vs Aliens"...

"Stereo Sue" is worth googling, her story is an engaging read and sheds a lot of light on the mono/stereo debate. She could only see in 2D until much later in life.
 
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