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  • Hey all, just changed over the backend after 15 years I figured time to give it a bit of an update, its probably gonna be a bit weird for most of you and i am sure there is a few bugs to work out but it should kinda work the same as before... hopefully :)

Bug...

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Jannard said:
BTW... I own this island. But I choose to be here working on EPIC and delivering the industry what it needs. No line-skipping, 5K, RAW, modular, REDCODE, record to CF or SSD, hold it with one hand... best in the universe... just need to kill one bug... EPIC.

Jim
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Dude! make me your caretaker please!
 
In my perspective tt's beyond words that somebody pushes the limits of technology to the ultimate state-of-the-art AND simultaneously is going to sell the product with a reasonable cost without saying anything of the offered full financial compensation of R1 in stage 3.

And now, it sounds like such a mission impossible (in the view of contemporary economical and business reasoning) is more or less up to a bug in software blocking currently from the dream to come true. But that's, in fact, not bad news at all. For, software systems are logical systems and therefore by a systematic approach bugs become eventually chased to a corner. It's just that the 'distance' of a bug and the symptoms is often very long and it takes some time before the software analysis team figure out the right street including the corner where the bug is hiding from the dogs.

So, bug fixing is not at all the same as seeking for other living objects from space. There's no reason to doubt that the team will not find the bug (with an exponential pace towards the end of the process).
 
jim, what´s your estimated time-range when you have killed the bug to final delivery of epic?
 
Jan Reiff said:
jim, what´s your estimated time-range when you have killed the bug to final delivery of epic?
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Jannard said:
Our bug is doomed. Just a matter of time. We could kill it tomorrow. Or it may take some time. I have no idea. Neither does engineering. But it will happen.

Jim
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Si. i got this. but my question is: is this bug the last issue to solve or will the testprogramm start again after the bug?
i never had any issues with my red one and yes, red should take the time to ship a 100% solid epic.
 
Danny Murray said:
is Mel using RED one or did you throw him a bone and let him use the freshly baked cookie?
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It was shot with M-X Bodies that performed extremely well in the hot humid conditions. The movie will be a great testament to how well the M-X does in low light with a wide range of color temperatures. Finished shooting last week.
 
So, what is this bug exactly?
Does the camera do something like my Nokia Phone's music player, resetting at random, or is it more subtle?
 
Joofa said:
Moreover, I looked at Red's specs (major ones) and thought could my colleagues and I would have done it in 5 years and the answer was probably yes. So I don't think that I am going over the top and way out of line.

Joofa
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So, what exactly have you and your colleagues achieved in the last four years while RED has been pissing their time away? The "I could have done that" attitude generally comes from those who sit on the sidelines while the people who really can do it actually make history. Prove me wrong.

Plus, I think you are contradicting yourself when you say "RED doesn't listen when people tell them their timelines are too aggressive" in one post, then say "but I could have done it" in another. Which is it? Is RED facing challenges because they were too aggressive, or because they don't have geniuses like you?
 
Stephen Gentle said:
The idea was that it would be so cheap that soccer mums would be able to buy it.

It is a totally professional camera though.
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Not entirely accurate. If you watched the video of the Ted Schilowitz interview at NAB 2008, he as much stated that Red was working on a simplified Scarlet 3K workflow. If Red wanted to appeal to "soccer moms" (i.e., well-heeled hobbyists), it really wouldn't matter how cheap Scarlet was if the workflow were too arcane for them.
 
David M said:
So, what is this bug exactly?
Does the camera do something like my Nokia Phone's music player, resetting at random, or is it more subtle?
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Since they don't make pills to cure my particular mental defect, I am spinning overtime on this one ;). So, in a complete vacuum of information I'm inclined to lean toward the following...

1. The bug surfaces when a narrowly defined specific setting is selected.

2. In all other configurations the camera performs flawlessly.

So...

3. The bug either prevents frames from being written to the media, or fails to stop frames from being written to the media, requiring a hard reset and resulting in blank media (no shot).

Or...

4. Once record button is hit, the camera accepts no other control inputs and freezes until power is removed-- a hard reset.

Or...

5. In this particular setting, which could be a rarely used combination of ISO, frame rate and resolution, once record is pushed, all monitoring in the viewfinder and the external monitor outputs go dark-- As if the IO controller turns all the traffic lights green and you get a kind of data gridlock.

In order for it to stymie the engineers, the bug must fundamentally change or appear to change the operational logic of the command and control chain. It must provide false feedback in a given parameter or group of parameters to the point that the appearance of phantom code seems like a logical solution. If the normal function of the firmware requires integer calculation, could the values concatenate beyond the specified error correction? Would limiting or extending the range of decimal places or inserting a specific algorithm remedy the error correction?

Whew, there! Now I can sleep...
 
Folks tend to lose sight of the fact that the Red leader is a person with a passion for taking great pictures. He has an amazing camera collection and saw the need for a single device that could do everything he wanted. Rather than going to a forum to whine he started another company and began building what he wanted as a user. He is doing our industry a huge favor and pushing technology forward much faster and further than the massive corporations that tend to dangle little carrots one at a time just to make money ever would have. I hope he triples his fortunes with this company. And I hope he paints his masterpiece with these efforts and he can enjoy using his creation on his island someday soon. I'm thankful there are people in this life who inspire and invent out of the need to push the edge instead of just trying to see who can die with the most cash.
 
I was thinking to myself when Jim was away that I'd better have Epic bugged than Mr J. himself !!! Things could be worse, if tough...
 
Jannard said:
Life is short. People are measured by what they do... and not what they say they are going to do. So trust me when I tell you I will not rest until we do what I said we will do.

Jim
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Thank you for this powerful and inspirational statement. Those who follow through on what they say they will do, despite the huge cost, are a noble few. Thank you for being a man, and a company, of keeping your word despite the huge cost.
 
Jannard said:
Time for my blood pressure meds... ugh.

I have to wonder if you really realize how difficult this project is.

Jim
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Most of us realize that, which is why I've got about $30K of Red products and a deposit on a camera that's not even made yet. That's a real vote of confidence.

Please take care of yourself along the way.
 
Joofa said:
In my humble opinion
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Really... humble? Jim's reply to your comments is humble. Not sure which dictionary you're reading.

Joofa said:
Moreover, I looked at Red's specs (major ones) and thought could my colleagues and I would have done it in 5 years and the answer was probably yes. So I don't think that I am going over the top and way out of line.
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Of course, that's why you did it. Oh, wait... you didn't. :out:
 
Jannard said:
The only difference between us and the rest of the industry is that we are talking along the way. If we kept silent about the process and our targets, we would be just like the others. I now can understand why they do it like they do. But I still prefer to keep an open dialog.

Jim
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As I prefer the open method as well, I thank you for continuing to do this, despite the heartburn it undoubtedly causes you.

I urge everybody here to recognize how rare this is, and be appropriate in your responses. Other companies have the very same sorts of problems, devlopmental issues, challanges, etc... but give you practically nothing in the interim.

Next time you have the urge to fire off an inconsiderate and critical response regarding Red's current developmental situation, please ask yourself what yo know about Arri Alexa's firmware development, or what it's manufacturing delays have been (and any complex product has them).

Thanks Jim.

-sc
 
Collectively as group, we clamoured for an update on the Epic/Sarlet. We got it! Directly from the top. The update was --that during the Tattoo testing period, a detrimental performance flaw was found. According to Jim, the flaw is being aggressively attacked.

The Tattoo program worked exactly as it was intended to which is - in the hands a small and qualified group of individuals, stress testing would be performed to flush out significant issues and problems.

Seems, pretty much as this juncture, we leave it be and patiently wait for the next significant update.
 
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