Broken Komodo

[Paul Cain]

Had my Komodo for just over 24 hours before it quit working. Same firmware it was shipped with - sn high 3,000’s

When it happened I was changing lenses - rf-ef adapter was in place - lens was being swapped.

Powered by two canon bp955 and no media was inserted.

Top LCD screen went black, power light became orange, fans turned on high. Turning the camera off did nothing - after several minutes I disconnected the batteries.

When the camera is powered and turned on the same things happens. Black LCD, orange power light, fans on high.

I’ll be calling support in the morning

 

[Christopher A. Bell]

Was the camera powered ON while you were swapping lenses? Is the adapter dumb(mechanical only) or have pins to pass power/comms? Although rare, there were some reports years ago, of people shorting out Canon C300's when swapping out EF lenses while the camera was powered.

A lot of people will argue that it's not necessary, and with the long boot times of RED's, it makes it very unappealing to, but the safest thing to do is always power down the cam when swapping lenses

 

[Paul Cain]

Maybe

Maybe

Camera was powered on when swapping lenses - adapter was the included one - it does have pins... maybe.

Careful kids!

 

[Robert Hart]

Any rapid intermittency such as from lens contacts brushing across conductive pads or camera batteries being jerked back and forth until they click home has to be hostile to delicate electronics. I would always power down before a lens swap. If using dumb lenses, a thin strip of adhesive tape across the contact pins to avoid any shorting between them and the dumb lens tail should do no harm. That was a lesson learned and passed on by some folks when using the older 35mm groundglass adaptors on some cameras.

 

[Alex Stolpakov]

Was the camera powered ON while you were swapping lenses? Is the adapter dumb(mechanical only) or have pins to pass power/comms? Although rare, there were some reports years ago, of people shorting out Canon C300's when swapping out EF lenses while the camera was powered.

A lot of people will argue that it's not necessary, and with the long boot times of RED's, it makes it very unappealing to, but the safest thing to do is always power down the cam when swapping lenses

What else? Maybe never take it out of the box it shipped or god forbid something will happen.
Fist I would check batteries and all what is connected with electricity in it.
How many photo cameras with EF or RF mounts died from changing lenses?
Would love to see a set and how everybody reacts when you will shut down the camera for every lens change.

 

[Christoffer Glans]

Any rapid intermittency such as from lens contacts brushing across conductive pads or camera batteries being jerked back and forth until they click home has to be hostile to delicate electronics. I would always power down before a lens swap. If using dumb lenses, a thin strip of adhesive tape across the contact pins to avoid any shorting between them and the dumb lens tail should do no harm. That was a lesson learned and passed on by some folks when using the older 35mm groundglass adaptors on some cameras.

Changing lenses when a camera is on is supposed to be normal. I don't think that is the issue since changing lenses on any other camera with EF or RF mount, be it DSLRs or other cameras working with lens electronics, while those cameras are on has never been an issue and they are designed to work with it. This sounds like something else.

 

[Scot Yount]

I never turn any of my cameras off to change lenses. I have never had a problem either, from EF, to RF, To Nikon and PL. You have an issue but that is not it. What you describe sounds like the camera going into firmware update...but with no card in the camera that of course is not possible. Support should be able to help you find a way to reinstall the firmware if that is what is up. Good Luck

 

[Björn Benckert]

Camera should not brick from a lens swap. It should not brick from short fusing the pins of the mount or adapter. Thats not according to my experience. Never turned camera of to swap a lens and used the dsmc1 and 2 with pretty much every mount available. Also swapped mount without turning off the camera... maybe thats not the best practice but never had any issues.

 

[Phil Holland]

Perhaps an actually useful question.

What lens was being removed and what was being put on?

 

[Jamil Stubbs]

Haven't powered down a camera for a lens swap in many many moons.

 

[Paul Cain]

update on broken komodo

update on broken komodo

Unfortunately RED is not able to receive any packages at this time and cannot fulfill a replacement order.

However once RED is able to receive your package they will be able to create a replacement case. Once my camera arrives at RED the replacement ships out within 1-2 business days....


it sucks so much to spend money on a "professional" tool only to have it crap out right away AND not be able to have it replaced in a timely fashion. :emote_headwall:

Feels like RED is dropping the ball. Major let down. Not happy. :mad5:

--

Update: they will be able to take the broken komodo sooner!

 

[Paul Cain]

Perhaps an actually useful question.

What lens was being removed and what was being put on?

The lens being removed was a Canon EF 70-200mm f/2.8 IS I

The lens being put on was a 80mm f/2.8 Zeiss biometar. Pentacon Six mount with dumb EF to pentacon-six tilt shift adapter.

Side note- I've used that 80mm with tilt shift adapter on other EF cameras without issue.

 

[Christoffer Glans]

The lens being removed was a Canon EF 70-200mm f/2.8 IS I

The lens being put on was a 80mm f/2.8 Zeiss biometar. Pentacon Six mount with dumb EF to pentacon-six tilt shift adapter.

Side note- I've used that 80mm with tilt shift adapter on other EF cameras without issue.

What was the exact situation in which you changed lenses? Environment, air quality, clothing, floor etc.?

This could be a case of extreme static electricity that went through the adapters and pins into the camera. It's just a wild guess, but just think of when you scroll your fingers across a Macbook that's charging, you can feel a vibration of sorts. You are a conduit as much as anything else and if the air quality, floor material and handling of the camera all came together in an exact way, it could trigger a static shock into the camera. Basically a clusterfuck of bad luck.

This is my guess, since the only other conclusion would be faulty wiring inside or at the battery plate and when you changed the lens, you handled the camera in a way where that faulty wiring caused the shutdown, but because it was at the same time as changing the lens, you falsely conclude that to be the issue. Since the lens or adapter does not have any power in it, it makes little sens that the lens or adapter itself caused this.

 

[Brian Roberts]

I prefer to power down the camera when possible for lens swaps. That's to say, the camera doesn't have a ridiculously long boot time, or there's a sufficient break in the action for me to do so. If that's not feasible I'll hot swap, but cameras are getting much quicker to boot these days. Using mirrorless cams or something like a pocket 6K for instance it's a no brainer because they boot literally in a few seconds.

 

[Paul Cain]

What was the exact situation in which you changed lenses? Environment, air quality, clothing, floor etc.?

This could be a case of extreme static electricity that went through the adapters and pins into the camera. It's just a wild guess, but just think of when you scroll your fingers across a Macbook that's charging, you can feel a vibration of sorts. You are a conduit as much as anything else and if the air quality, floor material and handling of the camera all came together in an exact way, it could trigger a static shock into the camera. Basically a clusterfuck of bad luck.

This is my guess, since the only other conclusion would be faulty wiring inside or at the battery plate and when you changed the lens, you handled the camera in a way where that faulty wiring caused the shutdown, but because it was at the same time as changing the lens, you falsely conclude that to be the issue. Since the lens or adapter does not have any power in it, it makes little sens that the lens or adapter itself caused this.

camera was on a tripod, manfrotto 503 head, tilta cage, rails, lens support. bp955 powering camera- small HD indy 7 monitor with camera control connected.

environment and clothing where rather unremarkable. wooden (bamboo) flooring - moderate air circulation 69° (HVAC and large HEPPA air purifier in room).
seated in pu leather office chair. rubber sole shoes, denim pants, 80/20 cotton polly blend short sleeve shirt. bare hands.



The camera has been shipped back to RED - Ill let you all know if they have any information. :violin:

 

[Jacek Zakowicz]

camera was on a tripod, manfrotto 503 head, tilta cage, rails, lens support. bp955 powering camera- small HD indy 7 monitor with camera control connected.

environment and clothing where rather unremarkable. wooden (bamboo) flooring - moderate air circulation 69° (HVAC and large HEPPA air purifier in room).
seated in pu leather office chair. rubber sole shoes, denim pants, 80/20 cotton polly blend short sleeve shirt. bare hands.



The camera has been shipped back to RED - Ill let you all know if they have any information. :violin:

But here is the crucial bit: did you BLINK while changing the lens? ;-)

 

[Jamil Stubbs]

I prefer to power down the camera when possible for lens swaps. That's to say, the camera doesn't have a ridiculously long boot time, or there's a sufficient break in the action for me to do so. If that's not feasible I'll hot swap, but cameras are getting much quicker to boot these days. Using mirrorless cams or something like a pocket 6K for instance it's a no brainer because they boot literally in a few seconds.

I respect your protocol but its pretty much industry standard to switch lens while powered on with any cinema camera that has been used in my generation. Lets just all pray and hope this is some super specific issue that is a non issue on general lens swap. I just got my Komodo on Thursday and slated for use on a production Jan 9th. I will for sure be testing in the mean while.

 

[Russ Fill]

Id say something else other than the lens change caused this camera to black out. I don't know anyone who powers down their camera when changing lenses. Id probably wear out the power switch if I had to do that every time.
It might be some very obscure chance you static or created some current short but that would be pretty up there like a lottery win chance.
What kind of battery or power did you have running to the camera and did it happen all at once or did the camera drop and then the monitor or the other way. Did you notice any strange or unusual events leading up to the black out?? Like maybe the monitor powered down for a moment . Is it possible to check the battery mounting or power cable connections?
I know you have probably tried almost everything but did you try powering up with different batteries or even a different brand.. What kind of batteries..?? And how long have you had them? Were they fully charged or had they been running for a while.. Does the camera power up through a power cable??
And las but not least have you tried to reload firmware???

 

[Robert Hart]

Further to my comment about lenses shorting out the pins on a smart mount, I had a close look at an EF-Mount and a Nikon to Canon adaptor. The pin clearance fro the dumb tail of the adaptor is less than the thickness of a sheet of A4 paper.

If a lens is offered up to the camera by the bottle-opener technique instead of directly straight along the optical axis, the chances of a lug touching and shorting a critical pin to the case are there.

In the normal scheme of things there are taller pins which make connection first as the conductive pads brush past when the lens is rotated. Better brains than mine will be able to explain correclty.

As for the camera failing to start, as a long shot, have you tried turnng the camera on without a battery or power source connected and leaving the power switch on for a half-hour or so, then switching off, reconnecting a battery and trying again?

 

[Alex Lubensky]

Actually there's a problem with Zeiss lenses for Canon when used with adapters. It's known that you can't use Zeiss lenses through e>ef smart (i.e. with pins) adapter on Sony mirrorless (a7sII, a7III), because this can end up in a burned camera. I know one rental which had 3 Sony cameras buried this way (it was on a same set). They use only dumb adapters and a canon 5dII to change the lens aperture.

Never experienced this on my Scarlet MX with EF mount with older Zeiss series (ZE). Also I have a fellow company which shoots Red Epic MX and Zeiss Otus primes all the time, and they are totally fine. It does seem you need to be careful with smart connections on older Zeiss lens series.

But in your case it was a dumb adapter, and I suppose there was some kind of short-circuit - maybe the adapter wasn't clear from the contact pins