Welcome to our community

Be a part of something great, join today!

Log in
  • Hey all, just changed over the backend after 15 years I figured time to give it a bit of an update, its probably gonna be a bit weird for most of you and i am sure there is a few bugs to work out but it should kinda work the same as before... hopefully :)

BreakOut Box Prototype

Jay A. Kelley said:
I hear ya, but all I am doing at this point is to remake the Panel but with Normal Size connectors. I need to walk before I run
Jay
Click to expand...

Gotcha - but maybe there's a software engineer around here who could help out. I thought mini-XLR's were a weird choice and said so earlier but no one else seemed to care. Maybe they are tougher than I think... but slapping a big mini to regular XLR adapter in there would totally defeat the purpose of little jacks so I'm going to find or make some new cables. You sure can't walk down to the local Guitar Center and buy them.
 
I'm not able to tell if this connectors work or not, not able to judge, if this camera construction is good enough for professional use since my RED is not in my hands yet. But I clearly can't use a camera, where people think (for what reason ever) that they have to tinker things arround for to get this camera working. There are some rumours out there in the last days: problems with the 18-50, FFDproblems, I don't like them and I'm shure, RED will take care of them and deliver a professional camera, even if the price will be higher than expected. If everybody are building work arounds in form of breakoutboxes ASO, this can't be the philosophy of the REDteam.
So I'll be glad if somebody brings some light in this discussions and rumours. Thanks.
 
Hi Daniel,

I think it's like Clairmont's improved version of the Sony 900's! Sony had problems with back focus.

Stephen
 
Stephen Williams said:
Hi Daniel,

I think it's like Clairmont's improved version of the Sony 900's! Sony had problems with back focus.

Stephen
Click to expand...


Yes, good production facilities, who have the knowledge to work in the micromechanic area with similar results in a production chain are very rare.
 
I don' t think I am "Fixing" the camera per se, I am modifying it. I am unaware of the rumors, but I have no doubt whatsoever that Jim will do whatever is nessesary to make this camera everything everyone expects and wants it to be.

He himself set the high bar that must be reached, so he will give no quarter until it has been reached, and passed.

Jay
 
Jay A. Kelley said:
He himself set the high bar that must be reached, so he will give no quarter until it has been reached, and passed.

Jay
Click to expand...

Shure he will pass. It's a question of time. There are a lot of reservation holders waiting.
 
From what I understand RED uses Lemo connectors. DOnt know how much better than that you can get.
 
johnvon12 said:
From what I understand RED uses Lemo connectors. DOnt know how much better than that you can get.
Click to expand...

Hi,

I did not know Lemo made all those connectors on the side of the camera.

Stephen
 
Version 2

Version 2

I am focusing on the breakout box first. This is the core unit.. Will work out attachements next, as well as position of the cable connection point.

I also tries to represent the connectors a little better for the hyper-anal in the room :)

Will keep moving it along until there is a reason to stop.

Like the suggestions.

Jay
 
You won't make Jim proud with that, I'm shure he has to find another solution. Nothing against your boxwishes, it is just because I hate to carrie boxes arround the world if not necessary a must, there will be even more things that will possible break, thats why they are called "break out box", or I am wrong? :biggrin:
 
it seems pretty straightfoward, if you don't want to carry another box then don't. I see the breakout box for those willing to trade off another box for larger, more rugged, and standardized connectors. You can't get full-sized XLRs and BNCs built directly into the camera without making it bigger & heavier than it is now and some are already complaining about the weight.
 
artbeatsart said:
You won't make Jim proud with that, I'm shure he has to find another solution. Nothing against your boxwishes, it is just because I hate to carrie boxes arround the world if not necessary a must, there will be even more things that will possible break, thats why they are called "break out box", or I am wrong? :biggrin:
Click to expand...


With all due respect, I am not making this in order to make Jim proud, or you happy. I am making this because I have been shooting for 20 years and I am aware of the workflow on Set. Between the audio out for monitoring, the audio in for recording, the HDMI, the HD-SDIs, Timecode, and headphone jack, you are looking at over 8 cables coming off the side of the camera.

Put simply this is not acceptable. The camera will become too messy and managing that many cables which will go to different places is not something I want done that close to the camera body.

The break out box has two main functions for ME:

1: To move the cables away from the camera, allowing easier operation
2: To speed up connect / disconnect when moving the camera from place to place.

Other benefits will include:
Compatibilitiy with other crew and equipment with the use of standard connections
Will not need to carry around a number of adaptors and such (Although I expect I will have a few anyway)
Less wear and tear on the connectors themselves


Jim does not need to find another solution because I am quite sure all his connectors work, and I doubt they are so fragile they will break in a week. What I am looking for is a better system for ME. I am sharing here because all of you are family in RED and this is how we will become stronger, and it's how the camera will rise to the next level.

This is what Jim envisioned. Perhaps not my box, but a camera that would allow others to build and add to the design, thereby improving it.

I will continue, but I would ask, if you don't like what I am doing, then there are plenty of other threads to read on here, don't feel compelled to write me and tell my what's wrong with my idea unless you have a suggestion that will help me move closer to my goal.

The short version: If you can't say anything nice.....

Jay
 
Jay A. Kelley said:
This is what Jim envisioned. Perhaps not my box, but a camera that would allow others to build and add to the design, thereby improving it.
Click to expand...

You go, Jay. It's exactly the sense of community and devotion that both you and Off Hollywood exhibit that make this such a unique camera.

We all benefit.
 
Jay, I absolutely understand, why you want build this box, there are very much reason for that, agree. But I can't accept, that you have to built it because you are worry, that the connectors will break in about a week. Thats frustrating. I like your style, your engagement, don't get me wrong. But this box is a symbol for me, that the developement of REDone is not at the point, where it should be. We all believe in RED, but I'm worry, that with all this problems my beloved RED 222 won't be delivered on november 30th. And that would become, carefully said, slowly a problem to me. Because I have business to do with this cam, I guess I'm not allone. And by the way: my opinion is suspect to change :blink:
 
artbeatsart said:
Jay, I absolutely understand, why you want build this box, there are very much reason for that, agree. But I can't accept, that you have to built it because you are worry, that the connectors will break in about a week. Thats frustrating. I like your style, your engagement, don't get me wrong. But this box is a symbol for me, that the developement of REDone is not at the point, where it should be. We all believe in RED, but I'm worry, that with all this problems my beloved RED 222 won't be delivered on november 30th. And that would become, carefully said, slowly a problem to me. Because I have business to do with this cam, I guess I'm not allone. And by the way: my opinion is suspect to change :blink:
Click to expand...


Daniel, you may have misunderstood what I was trying to say. I said that I was NOT worried that Jim's connections would break in a week.. In fact I am sure they will last a long time or Jim would replace them. Even if the camera had full sized connectors I woudl still be building this thing, just too many cables too close to the system.

Nevertheless, thank you for your support

Jay
 
totally agree jay, either way some kind of breakout box is needed to make it more on set friendly. Your needs will be different to what someone shooting plates would be versus someone doing TVC's etc. one trip on a cable attached to those little bncs and its history
 
Well there's good news.. Someone else with experience dealing with RED has stepped up and so hopefully well be able to get this moving a little better now. Don't want to name names since that's not cool at this stage.

There is no doubt the box needs to be as small as possible. And I also believe it needs to be rear facing or you are stuck with Right Angle Connectors AGAIN.

I will have some more stuff in a bit
Jay
 
Stephen Williams said:
I did not know Lemo made all those connectors on the side of the camera.
Click to expand...

I think this is ironic Stephen, but I am pretty sure Lemo doesn't even manufacture whether "mini"-XLR nor the nifty BNC replacements.

I am especially concerned about the video-DIN connectors. They were not made for external use, neither are HDMI or USB. And I don't really worry about breaking the connectors or sockets (well, maybe USB..), but more what hangs with them. Adapters, cables (much thinner) etc.. May they be right angeled or not. First thing I thought when I saw the solution was: get a couple of those adapters for spare.

artbeatsart said:
...but I'm worry, that with all this problems my beloved RED 222 won't be delivered on november 30th. And that would become, carefully said, slowly a problem to me...
Click to expand...

I can understand your worries Daniel, but I am sure the product design is absolutely finished. We won't see a modified version of the cam at least until somewhere 2008 if ever or not even RED TWO.
This design took a big amount of work and everything around it is planned to deliver, fit and perform accoring to it. I doubt we see the changes some here feel the need of.
Also, I can understand the way it is designed and honestly I believe its a matter of industrial design in the meaning of economics. The first designs may have been more revolutional (the actual design is not anymore, with all due respect to the master himself), but were not reflecting the needs of a mass production.
We still get a lot what we pay for. But don't expect everything to be perfect. Expectations or not, we all want the cam delivered and therefore there can't be an endless planning and designing phase. We get the best, what could be achieved in this time and much more.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top