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  • Hey all, just changed over the backend after 15 years I figured time to give it a bit of an update, its probably gonna be a bit weird for most of you and i am sure there is a few bugs to work out but it should kinda work the same as before... hopefully :)

4K Cameras Approved by Netflix

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Marc Wielage

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Elsewhere, there was a discussion of what production cameras that Netflix would accept for their "Netflix Originals" productions. I said as an aside to Mike Most that I think it would be a slippery slope if Netflix were to specify what cameras they would accept, partly because there are always grab shots (action stunts and drones) where they use low-cost 4K cameras for a few moments of screen time, and there's also issues with current 4K cameras that are maybe not quite up to snuff.

I was just informed tonight by Will Elias Tejada that there is a more recent Netflix spec than the one I had, and it does in fact absolutely specify what cameras they want producers to use for Netflix shows:

cameras.png


Note that the original Red One and the Red Epic are not on the list. I also question the Sony FS7 on that list, because my experience with the camera is that it's noisy and prone to highlight clipping, but that's just my opinion. The Blackmagic Ursa Mini and the Ursa 4.6K (both under $8000) are on the list.

Their camera rules are interesting:

4K Resolution:
• Camera must have a true 4K sensor (equal to or greater than 4096 photosites wide).


Recording Format:
• Minimum of 16-bit Linear or 10-bit Log processing

• Bitrate of at least 240 Mbps (at 23.98/24 fps) recording

• Recording format must be set to either:


RAW (uncompressed or lightly compressed sensor data)

Log color space (i.e. S-Log3, V-Log, CanonLog3, REDLogFilm, BMDLog, LogC)
• No looks or color corrections should be baked into the original camera files.

• Files must maintain all metadata (i.e. Tape Name, Timecode, Frame Rate, ISO, WB, etc.)


Aspect Ratio / Framing:
• Aspect ratios greater than 2.00:1 must be evaluated and discussed with Netflix for approval.

• Framing chart must be shot before principal photography begins, and processed through the dailies pipeline which will be shared with editorial, post-production, and VFX.


Secondary Cameras:
• Any cameras other than the primary camera (crash, POV, drone, underwater, etc.) must be approved by Netflix.

• Test footage should be shot and provided to dailies and post-production to ensure compatibility with primary camera.


The downloads for Netflix' full specs are at this link:

https://backlothelp.netflix.com/hc/...duction-and-Post-Production-Requirements-v2-1

They have some very interesting thoughts about workflow as it applies to modern 4K shows, particularly for both SDR and HDR delivery, and I think there's a lot of merit in what they have to say.
 
The list is a nice starting point. Netflix is creating a base line for shooting future proof content. Netflix and Amazon have taken different approaches. e.g. If you want to shoot Arri Alexa on Amazon, not a problem.

Both are raising the bar for original content. It is their service and therefor they can dictate these types of things. I can only imagine that they constantly get asked which camera can be used, so they assembled a list.

In some cases, the full resolution of the camera is not being utilized. You lose out on oversampling and the reduction in noise. I don't know who makes the decision to shoot at the lower resolution. I have read complaints about the level of noise in the HDR images from AVSForum.

I the end, I applaud them for taking the time to put together the chart.
 
No EPIC? Weird. That's way over the spec, and it has terrific performance. You could do almost anything with that camera. No Raven either. I suspect that the rules are more important than the list of approved cameras, and that under the rules, the EPIC and Raven would be accepted.
 
Well, there are no MX-sensors. Simple as that.

A lot of people outside of the RED circle agree that it was with Dragon where things really started to shape up. The EBU MX-tests also weren't super convincing for 4k.

I'm sure Netflix has tested the MX-sensors and for one reason or another (and I don't think it's out of spite) they decided to not include them. If you make a bullet point list of all the specs they still hold up nicely, but it isn't the whole story.
 
They probably used the EBU Tier list from this year to do that list, and the Epic X doesn't resolve enough (they didn't use 5k on the test, because of the lens used, an Optimo with "4k coverage" only).
 
A few things to note: the RAW delivery is exquisite in it's detail, but the audio delivery is literally one line,"2 channel audio is fine thanks" (also they request your ProTools sessions). Then they require a DCP master for a product that will never be shown in a cinema. It kind of reads like the archival guy at Sony somehow managed to take over the entire studio.

It's also kind of funny that they only describe half of the camera they want you to use. They don't have any requirements regarding lenses. Helium with a set of Rokinon primes? Sure! Just don't shoot your 8K master at 7:1, our customers would not be able to handle the massive drop in quality from 6:1.

It's arbitrarily specific, and requires some pointless (yet time consuming) delivery artifacts. And then when it comes to audio it's ridiculously lenient (a +15db mix that would blow out cinema speakers? Sure why not). I am trying to imagine what problem they had, that they thought this would solve.
 
4K Resolution:
• Camera must have a true 4K sensor (equal to or greater than 4096 photosites wide).


Recording Format:
• Minimum of 16-bit Linear or 10-bit Log processing

• Bitrate of at least 240 Mbps (at 23.98/24 fps) recording

• Recording format must be set to either:


RAW (uncompressed or lightly compressed sensor data)

Log color space (i.e. S-Log3, V-Log, CanonLog3, REDLogFilm, BMDLog, LogC)
• No looks or color corrections should be baked into the original camera files.

• Files must maintain all metadata (i.e. Tape Name, Timecode, Frame Rate, ISO, WB, etc.)


Aspect Ratio / Framing:
• Aspect ratios greater than 2.00:1 must be evaluated and discussed with Netflix for approval.

• Framing chart must be shot before principal photography begins, and processed through the dailies pipeline which will be shared with editorial, post-production, and VFX.


Secondary Cameras:
• Any cameras other than the primary camera (crash, POV, drone, underwater, etc.) must be approved by Netflix.

• Test footage should be shot and provided to dailies and post-production to ensure compatibility with primary camera.
Click to expand...

Is this Netflix thing some kind of "stock footage" re-seller?
 
Bérenger Brillante said:
They probably used the EBU Tier list from this year to do that list, and the Epic X doesn't resolve enough (they didn't use 5k on the test, because of the lens used, an Optimo with "4k coverage" only).
Click to expand...

People here read into things far too often. The current full featured Red cameras are Dragon, Weapon, and Helium. Everything else is either EOL or not a current model. That's all there is to it.

And that said, like all sensible companies, Netflix will do one-off approvals routinely depending on the project, the budget, the production circumstances, and the creative desires. Yes, the spec is written for a reason, but it is not the be-all and end-all of what the company will accept because no spec is. Exceptions can be made when warranted. Anyone here who has actually worked on a Netflix original production, supported one, or dealt with the folks at Netflix post production knows that. They want what they want, for some good reasons. But they are very reasonable when the situation calls for it.
 
Marc Wielage said:
Note that the original Red One and the Red Epic are not on the list. I also question the Sony FS7 on that list, because my experience with the camera is that it's noisy and prone to highlight clipping, but that's just my opinion.
Click to expand...

FS7 is neither noisy nor has issues with highlights. Likely a case of misuse.
XAVC-H leaves a lot to be desired though.

Ursa Mini's are capable of serious imagery. If one would choose to use them for a larger production.

Not including 35mm Alexas on the list is ridiculous.


Marc Wielage said:
Log color space (i.e. S-Log3, V-Log, CanonLog3, REDLogFilm, BMDLog, LogC)
Click to expand...

Log colour space ?

:)
 
Hrvoje Simic said:
FS7 is neither noisy nor has issues with highlights. Likely a case of misuse.
XAVC-H leaves a lot to be desired though.

Ursa Mini's are capable of serious imagery. If one would choose to use them for a larger production.

Not including 35mm Alexas on the list is ridiculous.
Click to expand...

Well it doesn't have the required pixels. Probably a good thing since it may push Arri to up their resolution - after so many years seems like they ought to have developed a higher resolution sensor that maintains the Alexa look.
 
Michael Hastings said:
Well it doesn't have the required pixels. Probably a good thing since it may push Arri to up their resolution - after so many years seems like they ought to have developed a higher resolution sensor that maintains the Alexa look.
Click to expand...

The technical part is understandable, I'm referring to the sense in it being a project qualifying factor.
Which leads to dismissing excellent cameras, which are good enough for top DoPs and Oscar winning films.

Resolution affects acuity, acuity defines the texture, texture defines the image aesthetic. "Alexa look" is greatly affected by this very resolution choice as well. It is harder to explain the philosophy of cinematography and matters outside of quantifiable realm to left brain dominant decision makers as they valorize reality through numbers, where higher number equals "better". In storytelling less is often more. Many DoPs do not want more resolution. Alexa's current level of scene acuity is closer to 35mm film.

We have come a long way in the last 10 years and reached the times which offer so many aesthetic choices for high quality motion imaging. And now some want to limit those choices due to fixation on numbers. To me that is ridiculous.
 
Having worked at Netflix, I am just suggesting that this doesn't really meet the cultural goal of "You keep us nimble by minimizing complexity". Particularly odd is the DCP master.
 
Hrvoje Simic said:
The technical part is understandable, I'm referring to the sense in it being a project qualifying factor.
Click to expand...

They're selling 4k video to customers. It's a question of honesty in not upsampling.

Graeme
 
This is all pretty straightforward looking over the spec sheets. It gives them full control over future proofing, repurposing, etc. Although, I do feel the Alexa is probably worthy to be on that list. But, this is probably the only way to draw the line. I like DPs to have a choice in what tool they are using, that's my only gripe with this spec. In the case of the Red One, at that level there would be no need to shoot on the R1 unless someone really liked the look over the Dragon or Helium. So they just left it off the list. and it's much older technology.

One thing to note is that Netflix owns everything. They want the projects (resolve, Pro Tools, etc) and everything associated with the show or movie. Something to be aware of if contracted to work on one of these projects.

One take away is that this approach certainly forces a standard, something that's not always easy to pull off. :-)
 
4k bayersensor.
For 4k RGB you will need at least around 6k
 
Requiring RC 6:1 or lower is a surprise, considering how much the data is compressed when streamed to the customer. Maybe they plan to up their 4K bitrates.
 
Akin A said:
Requiring RC 6:1 or lower is a surprise, considering how much the data is compressed when streamed to the customer. Maybe they plan to up their 4K bitrates.
Click to expand...

They are pretty much based on the typical "feature workflow" of 5:1-8:1. 6:1 is a happy middle ground.

If you are of course shooting a slow motion sequence or whatever you can drop down to 12:1 @ 8K.
 
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