Look Around Question

[steve green]

When using look around in 16x9 @6K do you have the ability to use the "real estate" outside of 16x9 for repositioning action that's outside of the 16x9 frame lines? On another note, I noticed the top end frame rates are lower but it seems as the recording time is not effected by enabling look around, correct? Any help is always appreciated!

 

[Phil Holland]

Look Around is using the larger format and as such it's frame rates will be limited by that. The other option, which is what most productions do as of 2022, is to create a frame guide for 6K and film in 8K. Data rates will be higher, but you can crop and reposition the frame as it's recording the whole image. This is a Frame Extraction Worklow.

 

[steve green]

Look Around is using the larger format and as such it's frame rates will be limited by that. The other option, which is what most productions do as of 2022, is to create a frame guide for 6K and film in 8K. Data rates will be higher, but you can crop and reposition the frame as it's recording the whole image. This is a Frame Extraction Worklow.

Kinda understand the second part of your instruction regarding shooting 8K and framing for 6K. The problem being in my commercial world agencies are adverse to the size of 8K files for much smaller deliverables. I was just looking to shoot in 6K but have a little more real estate for reframing and not sacrifice a lot of fps on the top end, as well as keeping data rates down.

 

[Phil Holland]

Kinda understand the second part of your instruction regarding shooting 8K and framing for 6K. The problem being in my commercial world agencies are adverse to the size of 8K files for much smaller deliverables. I was just looking to shoot in 6K but have a little more real estate for reframing and not sacrifice a lot of fps on the top end, as well as keeping data rates down.

There is no way to shoot 6K and have more resolution or format size. Perhaps shoot 7K instead.

What you can do if you're in a pinch is change your REDCODE RAW compression level to adapt to the desired data footprint.

 

[Patrick Tresch]

Don't forget when doing proxies in camera and using lookaround :

The proxies will have the frame size of the lookaround and not the R3D's (you'll get more FoV in the proxies than the R3D)... Don't ask me why ;-)

 

[steve green]

There is no way to shoot 6K and have more resolution or format size. Perhaps shoot 7K instead.

What you can do if you're in a pinch is change your REDCODE RAW compression level to adapt to the desired data footprint.

Ah, so there's my answer......No free lunch. So the look around is only a monitoring function, it serves no added benefit in post, correct?

 

[steve green]

Don't forget when doing proxies in camera and using lookaround :

The proxies will have the frame size of the lookaround and not the R3D's (you'll get more FoV in the proxies than the R3D)... Don't ask me why ;-)

Hmm, that seems like a deal breaker as well. If the proxies have different framing then the R3D's that defeats one of my reasons for using look around.

 

[M Harvey]

Ah, so there's my answer......No free lunch. So the look around is only a monitoring function, it serves no added benefit in post, correct?

Correct, monitoring only. All that look around does is tell the camera to DISPLAY additional pixels that you are NOT recording. (And if it were recording those extra pixels, what would be the point of look around?)

 

[Patrick Tresch]

Hmm, that seems like a deal breaker as well. If the proxies have different framing then the R3D's that defeats one of my reasons for using look around.

best solution as Phil told, shoot larger (7k) and frame smaller (6k) for example… I usually shoot 2:1 when framing for 2.40 or shoot 16/9 when framing for 1.90

 

[steve green]

best solution as Phil told, shoot larger (7k) and frame smaller (6k) for example… I usually shoot 2:1 when framing for 2.40 or shoot 16/9 when framing for 1.90

Patrick, what is this (for example&#8230)? Also, is there any way to make the proxies correspond to the 6K, 16x9 frame (when shooting 7K)?

 

[James Darren]

Related question, does the Raptor not have surround view like the Alexa Mini/Mini LF and Venice have?

 

[Patrick Tresch]

Patrick, what is this (for example&#8230)? Also, is there any way to make the proxies correspond to the 6K, 16x9 frame (when shooting 7K)?

not in camera but with RedcineX yes. You can create a framing output or use your frame guide preset as setting

 

[Zack Birlew]

When I first started using my RED One MX, I thought the look around would be recorded as well but no dice, thankfully the shots were centered and filmed a little wider for safety anyway, nothing was really lost, just slightly more punched in by default than we would have liked. If there were one feature I would like all future RED cameras to get it would be the ability to record the entire look around frame area and the R3D just has scaling metadata to match your desired aspect ratio like 16:9/2.35:1/etc. but with the option to undo that scaling and reposition afterwards in post with all the look around area available in case you got it wrong on set or needed to change the aspect ratio at the last minute. Until then, I just leave the look around visibility to zero, no need to confuse myself and I have yet to be in a situation where I needed to use it.

 

[Patrick Tresch]

When I first started using my RED One MX, I thought the look around would be recorded as well but no dice, thankfully the shots were centered and filmed a little wider for safety anyway, nothing was really lost, just slightly more punched in by default than we would have liked. If there were one feature I would like all future RED cameras to get it would be the ability to record the entire look around frame area and the R3D just has scaling metadata to match your desired aspect ratio like 16:9/2.35:1/etc. but with the option to undo that scaling and reposition afterwards in post with all the look around area available in case you got it wrong on set or needed to change the aspect ratio at the last minute. Until then, I just leave the look around visibility to zero, no need to confuse myself and I have yet to be in a situation where I needed to use it.

But you can do this. Say you want a 1.90 framing. You set your camera to 16/9 using letterbox to 1.90 in the frameguide and reapply those metadata setting for the offline work in RCX. You could even use a frameguide with the same aspect ratio as the recorded frame with X% of "look around" if you want.

 

[Zack Birlew]

But you can do this. Say you want a 1.90 framing. You set your camera to 16/9 using letterbox to 1.90 in the frameguide and reapply those metadata setting for the offline work in RCX. You could even use a frameguide with the same aspect ratio as the recorded frame with X% of "look around" if you want.

Isn't that just the crop workflow stated above? As far as I'm aware, if I record in 4K 16:9HD, I'm only getting that area of the sensor and any extra look around area isn't recorded. Now, if I had the option to just set guides to crop later, that would be a different filming workflow. That's why I turn my look around area off because, personally, it's distracting from what I'm actually recording.