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  • Hey all, just changed over the backend after 15 years I figured time to give it a bit of an update, its probably gonna be a bit weird for most of you and i am sure there is a few bugs to work out but it should kinda work the same as before... hopefully :)

FCPX vs CC/CS6 as of June 2013

[SUB]Im not gonna lie I love premiere and you know what i dont mind paying a monthly fee for all there products. I mean damn you get everything photoshop after effects etc and its up to date! People can cry about it I personally love adobe and will stick with it. You get what you pay for. [/SUB]:mad2:
 
Liam Hall said:
Sure, you get what you pay for, and then next month you can pay for it again...
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Yeah but 50 bucks a month is hardly that expensive for creative tools that help bring in income. If you were someone that typically updated to each new CS release, than this method saves quite a bit of money over that duration.
 
I have nothing against premier or adobe or anyone who uses this tool.

I just think that the interface and source/record GUI interface is antiquated and goes back 25 years in NLE design. With FCPX it was the first time I really felt some tackled and made better the actual experience of editing shots together in an NLE since I started editing on EDITDROID. That predates Avid.

Fcp X made me feel like things had been rethought in a good way. So many frustrations of many years of "editing" seemed solved. It's faster and easier and a more fluid experience for me.

Not everyone agrees and that is fine, but I'm really happy with what I have seen and where it is going.
Also with the new macpro coming later this year I am fairly certain it's going to scream through footage.


David



Maz Mawlawi said:
Not discrediting FCPX but why do you think Premiere Pro is going toward a dead end? (Not taking in consideration the whole subscription debacle) They have been adding tons of improvement and features to it at every release...
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Terry VerHaar said:
Amen.
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I learned the software. Spent money and time learning. Lots of people did and came to the same conclusion; love some things about it, but hate other things. That's why I moved to clunk, clunk, click Adobe.

Chris Lowe said:
Yeah but 50 bucks a month is hardly that expensive for creative tools that help bring in income.
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Not for me or you, but it doesn't suit everyone.
 
Gabor D. said:
The title says it all...
...at the beginning a lot turned away from the freshly released FCPX and chose Adobe Premiere CS6....
...Premiere CS6 became the fav...
...FCPX has been updated and became better...
...Adobe crucified itself with the CC....
...what happens now?
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I'm more or less very into the Adobe line. CS6 has been pretty much "ninja magic" for me and for my workflow nothing touched it. And I'm one of those yearly upgraders, so the general license and upgrade cost of the CC subscription aren't deal breakers for me. Cost-wise it's a pretty good deal, especially considering what you get access to. That's all my opinion though. So the real question is Adobe CC building on the success of CS6? For me, it looks like yes.

Adobe CC lands next week.
 
Liam Hall said:
I learned the software. Spent money and time learning. Lots of people did and came to the same conclusion; love some things about it, but hate other things. That's why I moved to clunk, clunk, click Adobe.



Not for me or you, but it doesn't suit everyone.
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Perhaps you did - but those claiming you can't do "fine adjustments" must have skipped class that day. lol
 
I've learned not to bash any experienced editors preferred package.....
If they like it that much.....there is obviously reasons why they appreciate it.

That being said....those features extolled in fcx in this thread....the keyer, and the waveform audio linking are both in PPro....as of June....

The waveform audio matching will be a new feature....but the ultra keyer has been in there for a few versions.

It came out of the serious magic keyer tech as far as I know, and does very acceptable results. My background is vfx and if I really need to pull a good key I fire up fusion.....but the ultra key effect is comparable to keylight in AE.....and it's GPU accelerated and will play back 1080p real time key.....

Now it is very quirky in its methodology, and you need to know how to operate it....I had a lot of experience years before with the serious magic product...so I know how to work it....but I understand if people try it once or twice and write if off.

Kinda in the learn your software category.....

For alot of my corporate jobs, I can pull the key right inside PPro.....

So comparing the 2 as of June.....as the writer quoted....there is no advantage on either app as far as these features are concerned.....the bonus with PPro is getting photoshop, audition, and after effects......which if you need them is a pretty big bonus.

I was quick to right off finalCutx as most were....but like I said, if people that have been editing for years really appreciate it...the it must have something going for it.
A lot of it comes down to style and personal preference.

I got attracted to PPro after leaving avid products....because of the render engine. While at the time a lot of apps topped out at 10bit PPro was a 32bit render engine....and I was editing 4k in CS3 using cineform....
So for me, it is not so much about the interface design or look as it is about what's under the hood....and even that is becoming a pretty level playing field nowadays.
 
Gordon Gekko: Ever wonder why fund managers can't beat the S&P 500? 'Cause they're sheep, and sheep get slaughtered. ~Wall Street
 
Liam Hall said:
Terry, what do you cut on FCPX? And how often? Sincere questions, not baiting.
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Fair question. I mostly shoot but am usually editing something at any given time. I like to edit my own stuff. Mostly narrative shorts, some doc stuff and the occasional corporate piece. Most stuff headed for the web but did some broadcast stuff prior to FCP-X (on FCP7). I am currently developing a couple much larger projects with a partner and plan on doing most of that post work as well.

My point in this regard has consistently been that FCP-X is powerful and forward thinking and, especially now, terrific for RED workflow. It doen't bother me that people don't like it - you won't find me bashing Premiere or Avid even though I don't use them. Legacy FCP was fine in its time but I think, as many have pointed out, FCP-X is just more intuitive IF YOU ARE WILLING TO LEARN HOW TO USE IT. It's perfectly fine if you don't want to, or don't prefer it when you do, but the condescension from folks who haven't even bothered to get past their first impressions is unbelievable.

As an aside, my respect for Mike Most went up logarithmically when I see that he has give FCP-X a fair shake and now allows that it is a viable tool for the right situation. And my absentee mentor in this arena is Sam Mestman - he rocks with FCP-X and RED. :thumbsup:
 
Scott Crawley said:
Gordon Gekko: Ever wonder why fund managers can't beat the S&P 500? 'Cause they're sheep, and sheep get slaughtered. ~Wall Street
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Haha - unless you are working off of inside information, investment returns overall closely follow the bell curve. Among smart and professional money managers, some do well accidentally just as some get screwed by bad luck. Everything trends toward the middle - that's the work of efficient markets.

Let us not forget, Gordon Gekko was a crook acting on inside information!

But, when it comes to using FCP-X, I like the sentiment! :smiley:
 
Who's the sheep in this case
Every non FC user ;)
 
You can hedge your bets and play it safe, running for cover when things begin to get shall we say... dynamic, or you can trust the folks you know and work with. History is all of the inside information I have.

Lou Mannheim: Stick to the fundamentals. That's how IBM and Hilton were built. Good things, sometimes, take time. ~Wall Street

Fundamentally, I like Apple.

Terry VerHaar said:
Fair question. I mostly shoot but am usually editing something at any given time. I like to edit my own stuff. Mostly narrative shorts, some doc stuff and the occasional corporate piece. Most stuff headed for the web but did some broadcast stuff prior to FCP-X (on FCP7). I am currently developing a couple much larger projects with a partner and plan on doing most of that post work as well.

My point in this regard has consistently been that FCP-X is powerful and forward thinking and, especially now, terrific for RED workflow. It doen't bother me that people don't like it - you won't find me bashing Premiere or Avid even though I don't use them. Legacy FCP was fine in its time but I think, as many have pointed out, FCP-X is just more intuitive IF YOU ARE WILLING TO LEARN HOW TO USE IT. It's perfectly fine if you don't want to, or don't prefer it when you do, but the condescension from folks who haven't even bothered to get past their first impressions is unbelievable.

As an aside, my respect for Mike Most went up logarithmically when I see that he has give FCP-X a fair shake and now allows that it is a viable tool for the right situation. And my absentee mentor in this arena is Sam Mestman - he rocks with FCP-X and RED. :thumbsup:
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Terry VerHaar said:
Fair question. I mostly shoot but am usually editing something at any given time. I like to edit my own stuff. Mostly narrative shorts, some doc stuff and the occasional corporate piece. Most stuff headed for the web
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Thanks for the reply. I can see why FCPX works for you and that's cool, but I and many other people have different needs and no matter how long we spend learning FCPX it still won't cut it for us. You can't pass us off as luddites who are resistant to change or incapable of learning new software - that is far too simplistic. I've worked professionally on everything from Steenbecks and Moviolas, U-Matic, beta and 1" tape systems to early NLEs like Ediflex and Lightworks and all of the current NLEs. Most of my clients own Avids, I own FCP7, CS6 and FCPX. There's a lot I like in FCPX, but right now it doesn't tick all my boxes. Maybe the next version will, we'll see and if it does, I'll use it.
 
Liam Hall said:
Thanks for the reply. I can see why FCPX works for you and that's cool, but I and many other people have different needs and no matter how long we spend learning FCPX it still won't cut it for us. You can't pass us off as luddites who are resistant to change or incapable of learning new software - that is far too simplistic. I've worked professionally on everything from Steenbecks and Moviolas, U-Matic, beta and 1" tape systems to early NLEs like Ediflex and Lightworks and all of the current NLEs. Most of my clients own Avids, I own FCP7, CS6 and FCPX. There's a lot I like in FCPX, but right now it doesn't tick all my boxes. Maybe the next version will, we'll see and if it does, I'll use it.
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Again - I totally respect that; and your preferences. What bugs me is the many declaration of what FCP-X can't do - when it can do that, as long as you know how. It's been more than 10 years since I have used Premier. I probably wouldn't even know how to open it right now. :) But you'll notice I don't go around saying how bad it is and how the people using it must be idiots. I am quite sure it rocks big time. Of course we all have preferences based on our own situations. It's just a little tiresome when some people can't respect that. Again, if one doesn't want to use FCPX, great. But folks should understand what it can and can't do (in reality) before bashing it. Can it do everything? No. But I have seen so many claims about things it can't do that are just not true. :frown:
 
FCPX is a radical game changer. Its most noticeable advantage over PRemiere and AE is it's simplicity! That's been the core of Apple's success over the years. Simple and powerful! What more can you ask for!?

I can't begin to go through the simplicity of fcpx as non-users wouldn't even begin to understand. I'll also never bash Premiere. I'll simply attempt to describe a typical music video edit however:

FCPX has what's called a "compoud clip". On the timeline, it looks like a clip, that you can stretch, cut, paste as you please. Double clicking the "compound clip " will reveal multiple clips within it".
Now, when you apply that to music video edit, i literally have all 10 takes of my performance shots within my ONE compound clip, running simulatneously (thanks to proxy media feature of fcpx), and viewable through the multicam window. Watching all 10 clips (in real time) i simply select which takes i want to appear at which second by hitting the number pad corresponding (in real time), on the beat / off the beat like a broadcast switchboard. Did i mention, i am editing in 4k Red r3d!??

Once that's done, I simply add my COLOR GRADE, to the ONE compound clip ( not to the 10 different takes)... and any filters and adjustments are made to the ONE compound clip as well (pretty simple huh).

This applies to ChromaKeying. I apply my key to the compound clip, which contains all my takes. Im not doing 8 different keys, im doing ONLY 1 key. 1 Grade!! My timeline has 1 track!!
(BTW, fcpx can have Countless tracks if needed... but WHY!??)

In fcpx, apple thought about editors and began questioning the archaic, old way of doing things. I won't even go into the roles of assistant editor and how that position has been negated with the metadata functionality of fcpx. With each upgrade, more functions and features are added. With the new macpro's, fcpx will be optimized and tailor made for it and FLY. That's the advantage of controlling both the software and hardware. We won't even begin talking about the 4k Monitors support of the mac pro ;)

Learn the software, unleash the power!
 
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Well editing in PPro 10 years ago definitely would have sucked....

The industry is very fluid.....I have switched editing apps 4 times and finally settled at premiere, and every switch was either products end of line or workflow needs (when red came along)...

I haven't given FCX a fair shake....but a lot of people I respect speak very highly of it.....so ya people saying it can't do this or that is pretty shortsighted and frustrating for the users.
 
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