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Scarlet / Canon / Sony frustration

Daniel Peters

Daniel Peters

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I love my Scarlet and RED cameras but..... but

The new Canon/Sony line is making me a little frustrated with the money I just spent on RED

If the Scarlet gets the 120fps firmware soon and at least in 3K not standard def...oh and be nice on the crop too
then money def well spent

Epic owners still have their 300fps and no crop issues so EPIC owners shouldn't get frustrated (hopefully)

but when Canon and Sony release cameras with frame rates up to 120fps and 240fps in 2K /4K and 1080p RAW-8bit 10bit
its easier and cheaper with battery life among media prices, its getting a little annoying
we all know Sony batteries last a lifetime

Don't get me wrong, Ive lost trust in Canon, as they have so many cameras popping out
its hard to trust them and invest heavy money in something, when next month
''hey, we told you about the new C500XL right''
well its better then the one you just bought

Its almost like canon have turned into apple
(i love apple but you get my point)

Red owners love RED and everyone on here loves RED or else we wouldn't be here
but when we pay nearly double for what these new cameras are going to put out...it hurts
 
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Does the announcement of any Sony/Canon/Etc camera make the Scarlet-X a less capable camera? No.

Am I frustrated that Sony/Canon/Etc are releasing cameras that compete with the Scarlet-X? No, I have a professional tool.

Will I wait until the new 4K camera companies ship their cameras before I pass judgement? Yes, because comparing a real product to an announced product is silly.
 
im not really annoyed with the 4k comparison but more so on the frame rates with no crops
i love RED thats why I chose to spend money on it

There is just something about the image, the only other image i love is film and Alexa

I just hope we get that 120fps soon and its not standard def ;)
 
exactly...or even the 5DMKIII owners
they could have put that money towards the 4K cams

even if you get the new 4K canon, 4 months down the line they'll have another, then another

people that have the dollars, its fine but i think they are hurting their company rather then helping it
trying to please to everywhere is also hurting people pockets
 
Joe Mannion said:
Ahh but just think how much worse you would feel if you had just forked out for a C300.
Click to expand...

[COLOR=#FFFFFF !important]exactly...or even the 5DMKIII owners
they could have put that money towards the 4K cams

even if you get the new 4K canon, 4 months down the line they'll have another, then another

people that have the dollars, its fine but i think they are hurting their company rather then helping it
trying to please to everywhere is also hurting people pockets[/COLOR]
 
I don't have frustration to share - RED led this chase and pretty much invented the 4K, RAW - other manufacturers are trying to compete - what did you expect?

use the tool you have - it will be good for many years - really, filmmakers need to devote more attention to craft and less to technology, at this point. we are living in a world of imaging abundance, like no other time in history. go make something.
 
Well, I'm sure this thread will get deleted, but I'll post anyway :)

The Sony camera need some type of RAW external recorder - at a price that is yet to be confirmed... and the Canon 500 is still in development...

The new Sony with the slowmo is in bursts only and records at 1080P (in 240) all the other frame rates are lower... and this is 8 bit. Sony have not confirmed what the external recorder is or how much it'll cost - bear in mind they won't want to be too cheap as they have their own high-end cinema offering.

Epic is a very different animal (as is the original RED) and the Scarlet. Whilst all these new cameras pretty much back up Jim's assertion of buying obsolete cameras (imagine how annoyed C300 users will be ATM), all these new 'hot' systems are touted to have 4K sensors - all of which downscale to 1080P as the delivery format. It'll be very interesting to see what the actual recording capabilities of the these cameras are when they're outputting 4K to external devices.

In a sense, it's a good thing.... there'll be a lot of people that'll gravitate to Sony's system rather than Scarlet (or the Canon crowd will stay with Canon) - and, if the features of it suit them, they'll be happy.

Until there's a 4K workflow for any of tehse new cameras low end or high end Sony and the Canon), comparing to RED isn't the same (IMO). 1080P output (processed) vs up to 5 RAW (with a proven transport and delivery pipeline).
 
One thought though, you can buy an Epic or a Scarlet now... how long before this next wave hits... and how many times have people been excited and then really upset with the kit when it arrives (like the C300 colour aberration issues etc)?
 
I just went through a similar process. Even with NAB coming up I went with my gut and bought the Scarlet last week. After using it for a few hours yeah definitely the crop factor needs to go. Maybe I'm spoiled by the 5D2 FF but this will take some time getting used to. That and I now have to replace all my lenses!

In terms of the other cameras. I waited until the FS700 was announced and I saw the footage and I was not impressed. High FPS is just gimmicky to me. 60FPS is perfect for most of my stuff. There's always Twixtor! 8 second burst rate whoopy-do.

My only two concerns are 1) Is my Scarlet going to be upgraded and available for the same price next week? If it is I just lost a bunch of $$ 2) I bought the camera to not only push myself creatively, but I also wanted to try and get myself out there on jobs as an operator or DIT. Is the Scarlet going to be less attractive now to new productions? Are more and more productions going to use RED less over these other cameras? That I don't know. I hope not!

Saying that, I love this camera and nothing comes close in my eyes (apart from the other RED cameras of course).
 
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Well, all these new cameras seen reactionary to what RED is doing (and has been doing for a while)... I'm sure Jim is really happy that everyone is following his lead.
 
Daniel Peters said:
I love my Scarlet and RED cameras but..... but

The new Canon/Sony line is making me a little frustrated with the money I just spent on RED

If the Scarlet gets the 120fps firmware soon and at least in 3K not standard def...oh and be nice on the crop too
then money def well spent

Epic owners still have their 300fps and no crop issues so EPIC owners shouldn't get frustrated (hopefully)

but when Canon and Sony release cameras with frame rates up to 120fps and 240fps in 2K /4K and 1080p RAW-8bit 10bit
its easier and cheaper with battery life among media prices, its getting a little annoying
we all know Sony batteries last a lifetime

Don't get me wrong, Ive lost trust in Canon, as they have so many cameras popping out
its hard to trust them and invest heavy money in something, when next month
''hey, we told you about the new C500XL right''
well its better then the one you just bought

Its almost like canon have turned into apple
(i love apple but you get my point)

Red owners love RED and everyone on here loves RED or else we wouldn't be here
but when we pay nearly double for what these new cameras are going to put out...it hurts
Click to expand...


Not to be facetious, but you could have always bought a 4 year old Red One package for 15k easily and you've got your 120 fps ready to go!
 
Al Lougher said:
Hey Scott, not saying they're not working, just getting used to the crop factor. I don't have really wide glass (24mm is my lowest) so have to start thinking about even wider glass (11mm+ etc.).
Click to expand...

Oh, I understand that. I never liked shooting stills at events with anything smaller than FF35. The focal lengths of the zooms are definitely tailored to the larger sensor. OTOH, when shooting narrative, or in any controlled situation it isn't an issue; you can just adjust your camera position accordingly. I'm getting used to it.

As for wider than 24mm... Don't sweat it. I own a 16-35 and barely use it. It it a big landscape lens. Many s35 shooters are inclined to shoot people with those focal lengths. I am against it. It ain't pretty on a face.
 
trust me...i had a good 2 months of thinking of REDONE or Scarlet and nearly bought a second hand redone

but i was worried the redone might become obsolete compared to the Scarlet/Epic
will the dragon upgrade be for the redone etc (bare in mind I'm coming from a canon background, hence the negativity with obsolete)

I felt safer investing in the scarlet
frame rates are not super super important to me

all I'm saying is...if were waiting for the #120fps to be in the firmware upgrade for scarlet
with all this camera news going on
it'd be nice to get it in 3K/2K rather then standard def
 
So 120 FPS is the new holy grail, or is it the excuse folks will use to enable themselves to continue to blame their own failures on their gear? No offense, but you need to stop chasing the dragon, as it were. Chase Dragon if you want, but lay off the perverbial monkey on your back.

"You" in the general sense, not just Daniel. ;-)
 
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