Zeiss Otus vs Ultra Prime

[chris ware]

Hey folks

I'm curious what people think of the Zeiss Otus vs the Ultra Prime. I'm mostly interested in how they compare regarding their look.

Obviously they are very different mechanically and the Otus line only has 3 lenses.

I have used the Otus on tests, but I'm super interested in the Ultra Primes.

Any thoughts?

thank you!

chris....

 

[Blair S. Paulsen]

The Otui look more like MPs than UPs if you ask me. That said, all three lines have the Zeiss personality in their DNA. Biggest difference to me is their performance at wide stops and bokeh, where the MPs and Otui clearly outperform the UPs.

Cheers - #19

 

[Steve Sherrick]

Actually there are 4 Otus lenses. 28-55-85-100. Great lenses!

 

[Phil Holland]

The Otus primes are special and not exactly something I would compare to Master Primes or Ultra Primes. Some of this is due to the coverage, some of this is due to the optics themselves being so different and even from a different era.

The 28, 55, 85, and 100 Otus Primes are stellar. I would say I perhaps influenced some of the ignition in using them for motion picture production with the Zeiss focus rings and all that after going through a lot of custom modifications via myself and Duclos Lenses getting the set up to snuff before the gears were out.

The devastating thing for me is Zeiss has confirmed that that focal range has become end of the line for the Otus series, at least how we know it. It does represent the best of what Zeiss can do and has to offer. There were two other focal lengths in the works prior to the pandemic, but the line has moved after some have retired as well as the current direction the company is going.

If I was Zeiss I'd reevaluate this or perhaps reinvent the series for mirrorless mounts. But that might be a mountain to climb.

There is a market of stills and motion people who are looking for this caliber of glass.

Supremes have some Otus in their DNA as well as other lenses they make, but I may go through the pain of rehousing the Otus into a PL form or similar.

 

[chris ware]

Thanks everyone! Yes, there are 4 lenses in the line. I realized that I made a mistake after I asked the question. :05.18-flustered:

I have been shooting on Zeiss Contax for a while now. These lenses are fantastic and have a lot of character. Unfortunately there is a ton of CA with high contrast scenes, and they bloom white excessively when shooting into bright light. In many situations, these lenses work really well. However, after shooting with them for over 5yrs I am challenged with the vintage characteristics and the lack of smooth focusing and iris pulls from an old photo lens.

I also find the Contax lenses to be unusably soft with distant objects until I stop down to 5.6 or 8. This can be a pain at times.

I'm shooting on Gemini and Komodo and don't plan on moving over to FF. I also don't plan to completely getting rid of my Contax lenses just yet.

I rented the Otus 28 and did some tests. Yes, it's sharp wide open corner to corner. It's very accurate as well. You get a ton for the money with these lenses.

Considering that I am filming on vintage lenses at times. Would it make more sense to invest in a few UP singles? The UPs seems to have more character and feel a bit more cinematic to me. This is only from viewing footage filmed on them. I have not yet had a chance to get my hands on them.

The beauty of my Contax lenses is that I can carry 6 focal lengths in a very small case. As a solo operator at times, this is huge. My guess is that I could find space for 1-3 single UPs in my case as well.

What do you folks think?

Huge thanks

 

[Scot Yount]

The devastating thing for me is Zeiss has confirmed that that focal range has become end of the line for the Otus series, at least how we know it. It does represent the best of what Zeiss can do and has to offer. There were two other focal lengths in the works prior to the pandemic, but the line has moved after some have retired as well as the current direction the company is going.

I have long suspected this and it is good (not good) to know they are not going to make any more of this stellar glass. I have been on the hunt for the 100 in Nikon mount and will keep after it until my set is complete. I don't have the expertise to measure things like Phil and others, so my impression is merely what my eyes tell me, but what I get out of my Monstro is pretty damn good. Stick a Kippertie Carbon 2 in there and there is real magic. And whilst the Supremes are proper cinema glass and a joy to shoot on, I still prefer my Otus glass.

 

[Michael Lindsay]

I also find the Contax lenses to be unusably soft with distant objects until I stop down to 5.6 or 8. This can be a pain at times.

Your Contax lenses shouldn't be unusably soft until stoped down to 5.6+ in most situations... Are you always shooting into the sun or with 3/4 backlight? Which focal lengths?
I would test his further! Nearly all of them 1 stop down are pretty good and Zeiss lenses are alway good at stuff that is far away!

I don't shoot with Contax glass very often but I occasionally chuck on a ancient scuffed 28mm f2 Contax and I only use it wide open.. and if I need it to render more detail I give it no more than 1 stop or it gets too sharp..

I agree the CA on some of the Contax lenses can be an issue but it is kind of a product of the Zeiss approach to the balance of prioities (I accept some Masters, Outs lenses and even Supremes are clean).. Leica takes another approach.. It is really all about priorities! I have old lenses form the 50s with less CA than many modern lenses..

Re 1st Q: with ref to your needs some of the Outs lenses are better than similar FL in the Supreme range (others are very similar)... So I don't feel they directly compare to UPs... Ultra primes are the most robust lenses I ever owned (I never needed mine serviced, even though I had them checked by Arri, and sold them as mint to a happy customer after 10 years) but in reality they where less good for me as they are neither vintage or modern and most are not FF... underrated maybe but kind of boring.

 

[chris ware]

Scot, would you mind sharing a link with a project filmed on Otus and Monstro using the Kippertie Carbon please?

thank you!

 

[Vicky Marie Marks]

Zeiss has confirmed that that focal range has become end of the line for the Otus series, at least how we know it. It does represent the best of what Zeiss can do and has to offer. There were two other focal lengths in the works prior to the pandemic, but the line has moved after some have retired as well as the current direction the company is going.

Have they said if Milvus is end of development as well?

The Milvus 135 matches great with Otus, but on the milvus wide end 21 is horrible, and 18 and 15 are just ok and not a great match with Otus, wish they had something great that was wider than 28 to round out the set.

 

[Phil Holland]

Have they said if Milvus is end of development as well?

Didn't ask about Milvus actually, but as far as I know once the wides were done that whole range was completed. And Milvus and Otus would never technically match well, though the newer glass is closer than not.

Pandemic and timeline stuff has impacted much and I'm curious what Zeiss has planned for anything other than E-Mount at this point. I'd pay decently for an mirrorless equivelent to the Otus Primes if they could do it, but at the moment premium products versus more mass market appeal is a tricky conversation these days. Otus was born out of a different era with a different mindset that led up to it's existence.

Right now for stills glass in this category it's really just Canon RF L Primes, Zeiss Otus, and Sigma Art. Only one of those is native mirrorless mount. The Otus 55 f/1.4 versus Canon RF 50mm f/1.2L is one of those spoiled for choice back and forth comparisons. With Sigma 50mm f/1.4 Art in there it's more this is different and cheaper, but damn near there.

Truly saddens me that we didn't get an Otus 21mm in particular as Zeiss for a very long time was the champion of that particular focal length. The 100mm being released prior to that I think was actually a fail due to 85mm being so close and the general Otus crowd was asking much for wider. Don't know what happened there. I thought the next was wider as well and the 100mm caught me by surprise.

Otus from what I recall was going to be a 5-6 lens series. I suspect the other two were 21 and a 35 to 40-ish focal length.

I know Zeiss has deals with Sony, so native iris functionality could be there, but for a new lens with native RF mounts I would just enjoy manual focus and manual iris personally. Would be nice if that communicated with the camera, but not necessary in my mind. Might be a deal breaker for other's though.