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  • Hey all, just changed over the backend after 15 years I figured time to give it a bit of an update, its probably gonna be a bit weird for most of you and i am sure there is a few bugs to work out but it should kinda work the same as before... hopefully :)

Why Did Canon...?

What I really could expect within couple years from Canon - some kind of "improvements" to lenses they made, to deny 3-rd party compatibility with other cameras and equipment. Like they did to EF-S lenses. I personally expect some sort of EF-M or something like that.
 
Christian Jadot said:
Take a long look in the mirror.
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Are you saying RED killed their EPIC and Scarlet already? :confused:

Personally Canon did what they did in order to ease everyones minds that they were working on a 4K solution just it wasn't ready...

Also because I guess they shoved that camera in the photo...god only knows why though, seemed like they WANTED everyone to be asking about it

In the end though I'm still curious if what I heard was true, that Canon said '1080p is good enough' because that would kind of contradict them working on a 4K camera...
 
My guess... They hoped the C300 would hold up against the Scarlet, but had that cocked and ready just in case they got blown away (though the new DLSR sounds like it still won't hold up to the Scarlet... so... ?).

High ISO performance is something else. Gotta hand that to them. Wonder what Dragon will bring in that regard.
 
no one is bashing canon here, just being realistic. At 2k,3k, and 4k the Scarlet is appealing. When an upgrade comes around then you would have to buy the new canon c____ (insert new model here).
A dragon/brain upgrade and proofing one's footage at those high resolutions has more potential than a 1080P master, correct me if im wrong
 
Timur Civan said:
The C300 was obsolete last march when the F3 started shipping, 10bit 444 out, then later sLog. I mean who the hell is going to use 8bit Long GOP LOG images in todays market place???? That's crazy, what is this 2005?. Goes against the whole point of log workflow.
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You need to compare apple to apples. Sony 10bit 444 out with s-log is only usable, if it's recorded on the external recorder- HDCam SR or Gemini. Either one is not an inexpensive recorder. Canon 8bit Long GOP LOG is only recorded on the internal recorder. But you too can record C300 output on the external recorder as well, though only at 422 resolution. But the difference is not as dramatic, as you make it to be.
 
Jannard said:
The Canon 4K DSLR just obsoleted both the 1Dx and C300. Not sure why they would announce that camera now.

Jim
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What do you mean? I'm sure the CEO of Canon is reaching out to thousands upon thousands of customers on Canonuser and letting everyone know (on a near daily basis) what they are delivering and why, along with providing a road map of the future..... hehehehe suckers! ;)
 
Imran Farouk said:
Are you saying RED killed their EPIC and Scarlet already? :confused:

Personally Canon did what they did in order to ease everyones minds that they were working on a 4K solution just it wasn't ready...

Also because I guess they shoved that camera in the photo...god only knows why though, seemed like they WANTED everyone to be asking about it

In the end though I'm still curious if what I heard was true, that Canon said '1080p is good enough' because that would kind of contradict them working on a 4K camera...
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No, not at all!!! (I did not mean for the post to be insulting.) I am saying RED and Jim was the reason why Can(n)on did what it did. All over the internet RED over shadowed Can(n)on that day. So they needed to say something. I appologize if anyone took this wrong.
 
Why you guys think Canon really need to "respond" ? If they are, it will be something better than we have. I think EOS 300C release could probably be last "revolutionary" product in the area of PRO market. Seriously, just think about it - after all this years of expectation, R&D, they release DSLR based camera with exactly the same features as any creepy Rebel (!!!in creepy plastic case!!!OMG!!!) and put 20K price tag on it! This is insane. I'm not buying "improvements" like MPEG-2 it is actually huge leap back.

This is like saying: "Our new 2012 VW Golf is better and faster than any new Ferrari. And actually... more expensive!"

As a person who use to buy Canon cameras and lenses for years, I can't say how much I disappointed.
 
jake blackstone said:
You need to compare apple to apples. Sony 10bit 444 out with s-log is only usable, if it's recorded on the external recorder- HDCam SR or Gemini. Either one is not an inexpensive recorder. Canon 8bit Long GOP LOG is only recorded on the internal recorder. But you too can record C300 output on the external recorder as well, though only at 422 resolution. But the difference is not as dramatic, as you make it to be.
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The difference becomes dramatic when you squeeze log into an 8bit space. it does not grade well. I see it with my eyes. It looks bad.
 
Timur Civan said:
The difference becomes dramatic when you squeeze log into an 8bit space. it does not grade well. I see it with my eyes. It looks bad.
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Timur.
Did you even bothered to read my post?
If both cameras record to an external device, then there is no 8 bit issue whatsoever. Both output 10 bit- F3 dual SDI 444 10 bit and C300 single SDI 422 10 bit. The 8 bit signal only present, if C300 recorded internally.
And what does "squeeze log into an 8bit space" means? 8 bit is a sample rate and not a space. And Log is just a curve, just like a video curve. So, I don't understand your point. Grading 8 bit with any encoded curve is a bad idea, period.
So, don't use 8 bit recording:-)
 
The Canon C300 does not have 10 bit SDI out. It's limited to 8 bit. Confirmed.
 
Of course canon is confused, they are settling into a new kind of market where they weren't in yet!
They just started a Cinema line so they are still looking for the right spot.
A lot of people are complaining about the c300 that it's a horrible camera, well guess again, there is no perfect camera!
The c300 is a great camera that can produce nice video's for the right shoot.
If your on a hurry with a tight budget than the c300 is your thing, if you want to go more advanced and puzzle out a lot more then go ahead with the scarlet.
Some jobs just don't have the money/time to record in 4K just to be outputted later in 1080p, sometimes you can't always save your video files when your on a remote location so the c300 is your call there.
Again, both camera's have their advantages and disadvantages, but never, and i mean, NEVER say that one camera is better than the other.
There are no professional camera's, there are only profesional camera operators...
 
Jannard said:
The Canon 4K DSLR just obsoleted both the 1Dx and C300. Not sure why they would announce that camera now.

Jim
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3th November I talked at a meeting to a Canon Rep. He: " We will show a cam tonight at Hollywood. I can´t tell you details now. But I can tell you, we will make a lot of noise (Yes, he said noise). Our competitors are already very nervous about our presentation. That´s why Red unveils Scarlet the same day". Me :" Did you build a cam around a Raw workflow?" Canon Rep.: "As I said, I can´t tell you details... We could build a Raw camera, but we don´t want, because with a Raw camera we would blow away the small companies like Red and Arri"...
:driving::emote_head_explode:

I love Life !

Marc
 
Agreed!
Jay Birch said:
Please remember the 1DX is a still camera, their flagship still camera. A videocentric DSLR will have little effect on 1DX sales and will certainly not make it obsolete. Love or Hate Canon.... the 1DX is a killer still image camera.
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Timur Civan said:
The C300 was obsolete last march when the F3 started shipping, 10bit 444 out, then later sLog. 8bit Long GOP LOG images in todays market place???? That's crazy, what is this 2005?.
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True that. I have been pretty hard on Canon on other lists and forums. The C300 does make nice pictures. For certain jobs it *might* be the right choice. That said, let's talk about why someone chooses one camera over another. No. 1 VALUE for PRICE. If I had millions in the bank, I would already own a couple of Epics, Alexas and would soon purchase a F65 or two. I will be lucky to pony $20K for my next purchase. Sure, there is talk that Canon has 'floated' $20K to see what the reaction will be. Mine? It's not shock, it's anger. That price is totally outrageous and absurd. SO here's a hypothetical - let's say Canon, after reading the initial market reaction, drops its price to $16K list with a street of $14K so that the C300 is about the same as Scarlet and the F3.

What's next on the "why we buy" list? To me, the camera's features which equal capability.
It appears that the F3 and Scarlet have more features that matter (to me).
8 bit is, after all communication provided to Canon over the YEARS, it just unacceptable, - for me.
I own a Canon XL-H1. It still makes nice images too - and outputs 8 bit. $14K for better low light? That doesn't open my wallet.

In my opinion, if Scarlet, given all its other capabilities, can output high quality 8 or 10 bit 1080P HDSDI, game over.
Anyone know for sure?
 
Luuk de Kok said:
If your on a hurry with a tight budget than the c300 is your thing, if you want to go more advanced and puzzle out a lot more then go ahead with the scarlet.
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If you are hurry you better have a red scarlet plus hd-sdi recorder !

C300 is only good for brodcast !

The only complain i have over the scarlet it is that is not a full frame , and i don t like crop factor very much ! But it s still win over the C300 .

www.madjidelayari.com
 
Madjid El ayari said:
If you are hurry you better have a red scarlet plus hd-sdi recorder !

C300 is only good for brodcast !

The only complain i have over the scarlet it is that is not a full frame , and i don t like crop factor very much ! But it s still win over the C300 .

www.madjidelayari.com
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Madjid, the Scarlet is a Professional Cinema Super 35mm Sensor size at 4k. This is exactly what the industry needs to use PL mount cinema lenses. The C300 is NOT full frame either. It is Super 35mm. The only full frame FF35 sensors at the moment for this range are DSLR NON cinema cameras. Keep in mind a bigger sensor means much more shallow DOF, but sometimes that is unusable. FF sensors seem to have their own issues too and the most negative is most PL mount lenses Image Circle do not cover the full frame.

SO to sum it up, Scarlet at 4K is a true Cinema Full Size sensor in the sense it is Super 35mm. FF35, such as in the Canon 5D is actually not the professional standard for cinema
 
I think Canon missed the mark for what the C300 market will be. With this said it will be a great one man band broadcast camera. The problem is it will be obsolete in almost no time. This is the problem with Af-100s, F3s, and the C300. The 1080 world is always changing at an incredible rate and whats the the best now is total shit next week.

There is a camera out there for a similar price as the C300 that shoots 4K RAW to CF cards. What was it? It's on the tip of my tongue. It was a pretty big deal and still is. It shot a bunch of features. Oh yeah the RED One. With the MX sensor that camera turns out beautiful images and will continue to for years because Obsolescence wasn't part of the design.
 
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