What will we do when it breaks?

[Brent J. Craig]

I had the interesting experience this week of testing with one of the Red One prototypes. I realize it was a pre-production version, but it may be an example of what a Red One with one year's of use looks like. The major challenge was that the little joystick on the back is mostly broken. You can go up, and right, but left or down is finickey. That means no Media Menu, no Format Card, etc.

That got me thinking, the joystick is a delicate sort of piece, and it does stick out from the camera body. In normal usage, it is going to get broken, probably frequently.

Don't believe me? Look at the bottom-rear edge of any Arri or Panavision mag, or the bottom BNC connector on a 435. Cameras frequently get balanced on their ends when perfoming certain changeovers. They whack into things when they are handheld, on a steadicam or in a car interior.

So, what are we going to do on set when that little stick finally breaks off? It's quite critical to the operation of the camera. Not many shoots can afford to carry backup camera bodies.

How about a software solution:

I was impressed to learn that the flash for my Nikon DSLR has a keystroke combination where you can tell it "The silly little plastic diffuser piece has broken off". You tell it the piece is broken, and it continues to work, taking into account that it's not compensating for the diffuser any more. That is good design.

My wife's Nissan recently had a recall because of a problem with engine seals. Part of the remedy was to reprogram the onboard computer with a 'limp-home' mode where it will detect the fault and let you keep driving, but limit your speed to something that doesn't blow up the engine.

In a similar way, I suggest that Red could code an emergency keystroke combination that tells the camera we have broken the joystick, and allows us to use the other buttons to emulate its functions. Maybe the playback buttons could become up, down, right, left and select in this mode.

Either that or a very solid cover over all that stuff on the back. (I prefer the elegant software-based solution!)

Whaddya think Red gods?

 

[Poi Boy]

I think I read somewhere that the back of the camera had been modified to offer more protection for the joy stick (great name). Regardless, your idea is brilliant, make it so number 1.
Aloha
-A

 

[Mike Prevette]

It would be great to see a rubbery sleeve for the rear end of the camera so that everything is recessed, but still accessible. Something made out of black Hight test silicone. A butt condom if you will. (Think rubbery ipod cover.)

I have set a fair share of cameras on their butts for rigging so I know this is a valid comment.

I heard RED has re-engineered the back plate casting to provide a raised guard around the joystick. I think in SN# 50 and higher.

 

[Eirik Tyrihjel]

Poi Boy said it, it´s been redesign with some kind of protection around the joystick.

However I love Crewpix´s suggestion, to have RED preprogramme certain emergency procedures, to get around broken buttons, there are a million things that can go wrong, most of them from abuse of the camera, some from unexpected failures.

It would be such a great asset to our investment in RED if there are a set of procedures to work around non-responding keys.

My response to the heading of the topic: What will you do when it breaks? I will pull out the sheet of paper I printed before the shoot, with every name and number of every RED in my area, so that if I can´t fix the problem, I will have a replacement in place within an hour.

 

[I Bloom]

Don't know what to say other than I also experienced problems with the stick. Seems kind of sad that we are already discussing a workaround.

IBloom

 

[Brent J. Craig]

It's a pretty unique control to be on something that is going to be (ab)used professionally.

I'm confident the folks at Red will make it bullet-proof.

Work-arounds that save your shoot day are a good thing

(although drillability continues to be an issue!

 

[dino g]

post #14 of this thread http://www.reduser.net/forum/showthread.php?t=6255

has pictures of new cameras, note that this problem was taken care of by a cover, which was discussed above, but if you look close it is pictured here.

 

[Eirik Tyrihjel]

The major challenge was that the little joystick on the back is mostly broken. You can go up, and right, but left or down is finickey. That means no Media Menu, no Format Card, etc.

I haven´t had a chance to touch RED beside a few touches here and there at IBC this year, but another simple workaround (at least temporarily) is to make it so that when you push the up button enough times, you end up at the bottom again, same with left/right. Like the simple navigation on a DVD menu.

Disclamer: Maybe this is already how it works, like I said, I haven´t had the chance to try yet.

 

[Blue]

What will we do when it breaks?

..Cry?

 

[Jannard]

The good news is we are fixing problems faster than you are hearing about them... this was fixed a month ago.

Jim

 

[David Wyatt]

How about a little plastic flip-cover, like you get with the shutter switch on Digi-Betas/HD Cams (as long as it's not patented ;-).....or slows down delivery ;-)!!!!!)

 

[Blue]

The good news is we are fixing problems faster than you are hearing about them... this was fixed a month ago.

Jim

I'd say that wraps this thread.

 

[Billy McCannon]

That's great to hear Jim. I have every faith in Red's commitment to solving the problems. My own concern as a European/Irish reservation holder is when there will be a service in Europe. I know that Prague has been mentioned - I don't know if that is official but I would love to know when there will be a service centre in Europe.

 

[SalaTar]

"What will we do when it breaks? "
wish it was a real cinema camera...and call RED

 

[Jarred Land]

How about a little plastic flip-cover, like you get with the shutter switch on Digi-Betas/HD Cams (as long as it's not patented ;-).....or slows down delivery ;-)!!!!!)

we also have made side buttons software disabled to avoid accidental presses (specially the record button)

Every button is now recessed, only the arc of the button sticks out, so you would have a hard time breaking off any of them.

and the comment of putting the camera down on its ass is very valid... In the first week I did just that and my joystick ball went rolling down the hill...

That was fixed pretty damn quick.

 

[Rick Darge]

Jarred, what cameras were these new upgrades applied to? 100 on?

 

[Shawn Nelson]

we also have made side buttons software disabled to avoid accidental presses (specially the record button)

Every button is now recessed, only the arc of the button sticks out, so you would have a hard time breaking off any of them.

and the comment of putting the camera down on its ass is very valid... In the first week I did just that and my joystick ball went rolling down the hill...

That was fixed pretty damn quick.

So given these fixes, and Jim saying other fixes have been made...does that mean you will be giving #27 a new body when I send it back in for the mount fix?

 

[Greg M]

Shawn,
#27 is a collectors item...I bet if you looked inside everyone autographed the boards.

 

[Shawn Nelson]

Shawn,
#27 is a collectors item...I bet if you looked inside everyone autographed the boards.

I have an autographed Red HQ badge with my name on it and Jim's signature on the back from when I was there...that's my collectors item Oh, and the picture of me and Jim together!

 

[Jarred Land]

Jarred, what cameras were these new upgrades applied to? 100 on?

The joystick and button fix has been out for some time.. 50+.

all the cameras 100 up you guys saw on the racks have that fix, if you look closely.