Varicam LT vs Red Weapon Dynamic Range testing

[Björn Benckert]

Again as in all these comparison between the alexa and weapon people tend to say that weapon clip before the alexa etc. Well I think that clipping point is more about color science, and color science is no science. Color science is more like taste and then you got different olpfs on the reds etc. So better to set the clip point for the two cameras to the same, instead of measuring them from an unknown middle, and then see who wins in the low end. When thats done I see that weapon has more than two stops to trump the alexa, weapon is simply more light sensitive and got more range. Or it holds up it´s blacks about two stops more than the alexa when the clipping points are lined up.


Look 1:1 at the blacks over to the left, the one with ugly noise is ofcourse the camera from Germany. Same result as seen in all alexa VS weapon tests.

writefile233.000001 by Björn Benckert, on Flickr

 

[Richard Gazzo]

Again as in all these comparison between the alexa and weapon people tend to say that weapon clip before the alexa etc. Well I think that clipping point is more about color science, and color science is no science. Color science is more like taste and then you got different olpfs on the reds etc. So better to set the clip point for the two cameras to the same, instead of measuring them from an unknown middle, and then see who wins in the low end. When thats done I see that weapon has more than two stops to trump the alexa, weapon is simply more light sensitive and got more range. Or it holds up it´s blacks about two stops more than the alexa when the clipping points are lined up.


Look 1:1 at the blacks over to the left, the one with ugly noise is ofcourse the camera from Germany. Same result as seen in all alexa VS weapon tests.

writefile233.000001 by Björn Benckert, on Flickr

This.
I think most people are using the "native iso" as that middle point and that seems to lead to this sort of variations in the comparisons.
At this level, it seems to be much related to the observer point of view. Very interesting indeed !

Talking about science, the dog has been caught in that quantum noise, looking for Schrödinger's cat ... eheh

 

[Kenneth C Merrill]

Again as in all these comparison between the alexa and weapon people tend to say that weapon clip before the alexa etc. Well I think that clipping point is more about color science, and color science is no science. Color science is more like taste and then you got different olpfs on the reds etc. So better to set the clip point for the two cameras to the same, instead of measuring them from an unknown middle, and then see who wins in the low end. When thats done I see that weapon has more than two stops to trump the alexa, weapon is simply more light sensitive and got more range. Or it holds up it´s blacks about two stops more than the alexa when the clipping points are lined up.


Look 1:1 at the blacks over to the left, the one with ugly noise is ofcourse the camera from Germany. Same result as seen in all alexa VS weapon tests.

writefile233.000001 by Björn Benckert, on Flickr

Hey man! This is super interesting. I like this comparison approach. Can I ask: what ISO did you rate the Weapon at to match the clipping point on Alexa?

 

[Noah Yuan-Vogel]

Again as in all these comparison between the alexa and weapon people tend to say that weapon clip before the alexa etc. Well I think that clipping point is more about color science, and color science is no science. Color science is more like taste and then you got different olpfs on the reds etc. So better to set the clip point for the two cameras to the same, instead of measuring them from an unknown middle, and then see who wins in the low end. When thats done I see that weapon has more than two stops to trump the alexa, weapon is simply more light sensitive and got more range. Or it holds up it´s blacks about two stops more than the alexa when the clipping points are lined up.


Look 1:1 at the blacks over to the left, the one with ugly noise is ofcourse the camera from Germany. Same result as seen in all alexa VS weapon tests.

writefile233.000001 by Björn Benckert, on Flickr

I'd also be curious how much you found you had to compensate to match white clip points. Also to my eye those don't look like matched clipping points as the Weapon seems to clip on the right side of most of the vertical bars where the alexa only begins to clip at the last one or two on the right... But it's a bit difficult to tell when you can't directly compare details in the image because different parts of the image are represented by different cameras, especially when comparing redlogfilm always clips much harder than LogC's soft clip. Seems odd to compare two images without ever showing the same part of the image from the different cameras. Why not just side-by-side images or side-by-side details?

 

[Björn Benckert]

Its luigivaltulini's footage I did not transcode it from raw only pulled up gain on the tiffs he uploaded. So I can not speak for the exposure of it. And my render above has little to show in the highlight end but it clearly shows the different noise levels in the lowlights.

 

[Daniel Reed]

To me, the Panasonic appears to have a low-con (somewhere near a 1/4) component in its optical path (similar to Alexa).

I base this on my own testing of low-con filters in both over-exposed and low(no)-light situations.

Also the log curve appears too flat on the panasonic.


Side note, the test should have set exposure for the face - not the grey card.
As is, the lighting was not good and the subject was over exposed by a stop from the get go.
(if I am to believe the exposure diagram, which frankly I find suspect).

Looks like according to this test the Panasonic has more range with softer highlight rollout.

http://www.thebriannguyen.com/2016/...varicam-lt-complete-dynamic-range-comparison/

 

[luigivaltulini]

Hey man! This is super interesting. I like this comparison approach. Can I ask: what ISO did you rate the Weapon at to match the clipping point on Alexa?

Björn has already said it all
Kenneth, after many years with ALexa and RED simply i can match them very well.
I close the normally 1/2 set - 1 stop aperture of Weapon, to match the highlights, or rather the dynamic range. For example t4 of ALexa and T5-5.6 of Weapon.
ISO !! but if you want something like the 1280-1600 monitors on Weapon and 800 ALexa, obviously with some correction to match the signal.
BUT then again, the trump card is my colorist in post production.
As I mentioned Weapon for me now it is the best camera, allow me to extract something more, but everyone is free to think what he wants.

sorry for TIFF... this is some frame DPX
https://www.dropbox.com/s/f63mynudam1nur9/New folder.rar?dl=0

so I can assume that this Brian test is roughly the same, but if I close 1/2 - 1 stop Scarlet-w I get almost the same result .. so say Varicam-LT has the most dynamic is perhaps a bit risky.
Otherwise discuss is very positive.

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[M.Halsell]

The last bit of uncharted territory is the noise floor. RED provides very correctable levels of signal to noise amplification across the exposure range.

 

[Ugo Del]

People interested in the Varicam LT in Europe should check CVP in UK. It's 15400€ VAT incl. with 2x256GB cards offered. Crazy price.