VAN DIEMEN FULL FRAME X2 ANAMORPHIC LENSES

[Stuart Graham]

Hi all,

I was lucky enough to get the first 3 Van Diemen x2 Anamorphic lenses to shoot a quick test for a half a day back in August...here's the results of a few hours hours in the afternoon & an hour that night in Soho, London.

These are the first three lenses Christopher Smith & his lens designer/engineer, Stephen Sisman made. I shot the two films below on their 50mm, 75mm & 100mm. I was so impressed with them I have since asked Christopher to make me a 32, 40, 50, 75, 100, 135, 180 & 317mm FULL FRAME X2 ANAMORPHIC lens set for me using his 'Wireform' internal mechanism.

There's lots more I could write but tbh watch the films, no test charts, no story, no fill, no lights & no 1st AC either! Just images shot on a sunny day in a park at around T4 & T2.8.
Soho was at night all wide open again no fill, no lights, no etc!

Thanks to all those involved & to Christopher Smith who trusted me with his already sold lenses that day.

You Tube:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yx9PhUAnA2U

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JmQ6b7HkkBU

Or
VIMEO: Personally this video platform seems to have compressed our encodes more
https://vimeo.com/245384321

https://vimeo.com/245394220

Stu

 

[Karim D. Ghantous]

I really liked the city footage. Beautiful imagery. I would love to see this setup used to shoot Christmas lights. That would be something!

Two nice things that I have noticed: no light fall-off, and less distortion than some other lenses I've seen. I'd still correct it in post, but thankfully it's not too pronounced. I don't know why the hell people think that distortion is a 'feature'.

I also like Van Diemen's Wireform mechanism. Very clever. Is that similar to what Leica did with the Summilux-Cs?

Quick question about the Monochrome: technically, the DR would be the same as the Bayer sensor, but if the shadows are a bit cleaner on the Monochrome sensor, that could mean an effective increase in DR - does your experience confirm that?

 

[Vladimir Cazacu]

The Youtube links don't seem to work.

 

[Stuart Graham]

The Youtube links don't seem to work.

Doh! A roockie mistake by me, thanks for pointing this error out Vladimir...all fixed now

 

[Stuart Graham]

I really liked the city footage. Beautiful imagery. I would love to see this setup used to shoot Christmas lights. That would be something!

Thanks Karim, The bokeh is really nice, kinda Ana' old school too...might be too much in some distant multi source shots maybe?

Two nice things that I have noticed: no light fall-off, and less distortion than some other lenses I've seen. I'd still correct it in post, but thankfully it's not too pronounced. I don't know why the hell people think that distortion is a 'feature'.

The 50mm had some distortion but no more than COOKE, HAWK, LOMO, PANAVISION's B's & C's. In the grade we didn't add any vignette to any scene. all 3 lenses do have a 'slight' vignette to them but as all of this set & the ones Van Diemen are making for me now weren't designed for full frame there will be more light & focus fall off than the original manufacturer had set the lenses up for.

I also like Van Diemen's Wireform mechanism. Very clever. Is that similar to what Leica did with the Summilux-Cs?

It is & very 'service free' too, their latest version of it is now far more accepting of the WCU-4's very harsh end stop hitting lens calibrations...something the COOKE S4's don't always survive from.

Quick question about the Monochrome: technically, the DR would be the same as the Bayer sensor, but if the shadows are a bit cleaner on the Monochrome sensor, that could mean an effective increase in DR - does your experience confirm that?

This was shot on the EPIC MONOCHROME so yes the first MONO' version & the DR is way short of the HELIUM so we generally exposed for the highlights & opened the shadows on set with the ISO & then again in the grade too. As RED continue to improve their camera's I find that since adopting the RED DRAGON back in the day then the WEAPON, then HELIUM & soon the MONSTRO I've always got amazing DR way way more than the claimed 15+, 16 & 16+ etc due to this 'expose for the highlights' style of shooting any noise I incurred I actually embraced as to me it makes your films less sharp n perfect, if post or the client felt the noise wasn't for them then most 'de-noise' tools takes it all out very efficiently.

Thanks for your comments. Stu

 

[Nick Morrison]

Do we know how much they plan to sell each lens for?

 

[Stuart Graham]

Do we know how much they plan to sell each lens for?

You supply all the glass & it’s around £8000 + VAT per lens

 

[Florian Berutti]

Sorry, but i didn't understand it clearly, what's the ana glass and what is the sphérical glass?
LOMO+LEICA-R?
thanks

 

[Stuart Graham]

Sorry, but i didn't understand it clearly, what's the ana glass and what is the sphérical glass?
LOMO+LEICA-R?
thanks

This set of three (50mm, 75mm & 100mm) tested were:
LOMO round x2 Anamorphic fronts & a Cooke Speed Panchro taking lens.

Stu

 

[Vincent Larsson]

This set of three (50mm, 75mm & 100mm) tested were:
LOMO round x2 Anamorphic fronts & a Cooke Speed Panchro taking lens.

Stu

Interesting - so is it due to the anamorphic element that make this old Panchros cover full frame? And with which lenses would Christopher make the 32 and 40mm anamorphic versions?

 

[Ignacio Aguilar]

And with which lenses would Christopher make the 32 and 40mm anamorphic versions?

Most likely 32mm and 40mm Cooke Speed Panchros as well, though these two won't cover full-frame.
If I remember well, 50mm onwards the Speed Panchros all cover Full Frame. That's why Cooke created the 30mm and 40mm Double Speed Panchros (which are full frame) to complete their sets for the VistaVision format.

 

[Stuart Graham]

Sorry for the tardy reply...took a v long Christmas break

Interesting - so is it due to the anamorphic element that make this old Panchros cover full frame?

Correct, in this case where we want 'old artefacts' 'soft edges' & maybe vignetting too this 'over sampling' a s35mm lens technique works a treat.

And with which lenses would Christopher make the 32 and 40mm anamorphic versions?

Most likely 32mm and 40mm Cooke Speed Panchros as well, though these two won't cover full-frame.
If I remember well, 50mm onwards the Speed Panchros all cover Full Frame. That's why Cooke created the 30mm and 40mm Double Speed Panchros (which are full frame) to complete their sets for the VistaVision format.

Most 'pancake' lenses as the taking lens work, so the Cooke Speed Panchro's, Voigtlander or some Leica's work too. Up to 50mm it's a case of physically fitting the wider lenses in the lens housing, from 50mm & longer it gets easier.

S

 

[Eric Oliver]

stuart, i've been talking to VD a little about doing this with squarefronts as well. have you seen their squarefront rehoused lenses? they sound too good to be true!

 

[Eric Oliver]

ignacio, prolly dumb question, but there's no way the 30/40 double speeds could be taking lenses correct?

 

[Florian Berutti]

Eric, are you saying that Van diemen could rehouse LOMO Square Front with Leica taking lenses for exemple ?
That would be my dream.

 

[Marcel Zyskind]

I have had my 3 Lomo SF lenses with Van Diemen for more than a year now, still waiting for the work to be finished...

 

[Stuart Graham]

Sorry, been waiting from the answers from Van Diemen...

ignacio, prolly dumb question, but there's no way the 30/40 double speeds could be taking lenses correct?

Yes & No...75mm CSP DS & longer will work. Nothing wider will work at the moment (& probably never will)

Eric, are you saying that Van diemen could rehouse LOMO Square Front with Leica taking lenses for exemple ?
That would be my dream.

Exactly this, yes! ...I've order this very same combination plus other combinations too.

I have had my 3 Lomo SF lenses with Van Diemen for more than a year now, still waiting for the work to be finished...

Yes unfortunately it does take a long time. I had my LOMO's at TLS for just over two years & they were never even looked at after I left them there
I also left them with another engineer for 12 months & again, left in a box gathering dust.

Christopher & Stephen at Van Diemen have stripped all our lenses right down to the glass, removed all the rusting steel shims & all the other steel corroding parts & designed a stunning set of barrels with the iris & focus gears in the same place from the 32mm to 317mm...they will be worth the wait.

Stu

 

[David Mullen ASC]

When you say "full-frame" 2X anamorphic, do you mean they cover the 24mm height of traditional full-frame or also the 36mm width of full-frame? Because with a 2X squeeze, you only need to cover a 1.20 : 1 area to get a 2.40 : 1 image, so there would be little need for a 2X anamorphic lens to cover all of a full-frame sensor (which are traditionally 1.50 : 1, so a 3.00 : 1 unsqueezed image if the whole sensor area is used -- and the Red full-frame sensors are even more widescreen in shape.)

Also, the Red VistaVision sensor is "only" 21.60mm tall, not 24mm, and traditional standard 35mm 2X anamorphics are designed to cover nearly an 18mm height (17.5mm projected height) so you'd think a number of them would cover the height of a Red VistaVision sensor.

 

[Stuart Graham]

When you say "full-frame" 2X anamorphic, do you mean they cover the 24mm height of traditional full-frame or also the 36mm width of full-frame? Because with a 2X squeeze, you only need to cover a 1.20 : 1 area to get a 2.40 : 1 image, so there would be little need for a 2X anamorphic lens to cover all of a full-frame sensor (which are traditionally 1.50 : 1, so a 3.00 : 1 unsqueezed image if the whole sensor area is used -- and the Red full-frame sensors are even more widescreen in shape.)

Hi,
Yes, 'FF' to me is 36mm x 24mm only. One of the many parts of our lives where a standard is 'greying' out & will mean something different to others.
Having witnessed the Van Diemen rehoused lenses on a projector they all covered / showed the 36x24 graticule markings, some with ease & one or two only just. As I stated earlier they're not all pin sharp corner to corner at wide open T stop but it was very close.
When they're in their final housing it'll be one of the first things I'll re-visit again. They're making the housing better than the original, uniform across the set & as minimal an intrusion (onto the glass) as possible to maximise the coverage possibilities.

Also, the Red VistaVision sensor is "only" 21.60mm tall, not 24mm, and traditional standard 35mm 2X anamorphics are designed to cover nearly an 18mm height (17.5mm projected height) so you'd think a number of them would cover the height of a Red VistaVision sensor.

All of the Van Diemen ones will for sure as the MONSTRO is my "35mm" camera of choice so I've pushed for this.

Perhaps some older Panavision Anamorphic's may too hopefully? I've yet to have a MONSTRO or DXL at Panavision.
Looking at spec sheets, the Service Vision 'Scorpio' (first generation) X2 Anamorphic's had a good image circle of 31.14mm (bigger than the Master Anamorphoic's & Cooke's Anamorphic's) which meant the Scorpio's would cover the traditional 18mm height with some room to spare.
Service Vison have redesigned these new lenses already & are making them all cover (here comes a "greying out of a standard") "FFA with an image diagonal of 37.4mm" & their 20mm & 25mm has a 35mm diagonal coverage, so good for our MONSTRO's & DXL's...I'm looking at a set on Wednesday with a MONSTRO & looking forward to it
I was really impressed with the first generation Scorpio Anamorphic's, great for car shoots or Architectural type shoots as they're so straight even the 25mm with the Aspheron was straighter than the Cooke 40mm Anamorphic! Apparently my set of "FFA" Scorpio's will arrive with me in March hopefully just as some of the Van Diemen lenses do too.
http://servicevision.es/sites/defau...phic-2x/brochurescorpiolensanamorphic2x_1.pdf

 

[David Mullen ASC]

But why would you need it to cover the full width of the 36 x 24mm sensor unless you need a 3:1 aspect ratio?