V-Raptor XL Preorder is now open, 8K S35 Announced

[Phil Holland]

The little dynamo that is V-Raptor XL 8K VV is now up for preorder here:
https://www.red.com/v-raptor-xl

Also, Jarred teased on his instagram that we are indeed getting an 8K S35 variant of V-Raptor and would like to know if you want it in the regular V-Raptor body or the XL:
https://www.instagram.com/p/CeEUhW4Fmo0/

Looks like V-Raptor XL is shipping August 2022. Within 2-3 months.

Listed on the site is a V-Raptor XL Production Pack at $44,995 with several accessories we haven't seen before including REDVOLT XL-V and/or G batteries, which likely means V-Lock or G-Lock options on the XL. Looks like 24V, maybe 12V too, too early to tell.

One thing that made me excited was seeing Wireless Timecode and Genlock. That's freaking huge.

 

[rand thompson]

Phil,

Thanks for the info! I wonder why this could've been put inside of a Komodo type body, maybe that's a good sign of its features and potential capabilities.

 

[Mike P.]

It’d be huge if it held timecode internally/after reboots!

Any word on s35 8k pricing (Raptor or XL)?

 

[rand thompson]

It’d be huge if it held timecode internally/after reboots!

Any word on s35 8k pricing (Raptor or XL)?

Mike,

I think if the V-Raptor 8K S35 has the same internal processing hardware and same frame rates as the V-Raptor 8KVV Full Frame, Maybe $19,500 - $21,995. If it has lower quality/ less processing intensive internal hardware and lower frame rates as the V-Raptor 8KVV Full Frame, Maybe $16,995 -$18,995.

 

[Karim D. Ghantous]

Red just doesn't stop. I love it.

 

[Phil Holland]

Phil,

Thanks for the info! I wonder why this could've been put inside of a Komodo type body, maybe that's a good sign of its features and potential capabilities.

Unknown. This sensor is news to me, but not unsurprisingly considering the amount of Heliums out there. Japan and that general region has a bunch. It being a V-Raptor makes me think it's also designed for speed. Don't exactly think this is going to be 8K 60p, but more likely 8K 120p. Not exactly a Komodo thing in terms of hardware. Time will tell.

If that's the general idea, unless there's some other funky tech in there I can't imagine, I would expect it to be less expensive than 8K VV due to the smaller sensor size, but only going on previous history here. Not always the entire story when it comes to that these days.

I dig Komodo a lot btw, but the integrated battery mount on V-Raptor and certainly the XL is a real nice feature to use production-style bricks, big or small. Komodo certainly gets away with it with it's low power draw, but V-Raptor is literally around 4X the consumption to get those horses running.

 

[rand thompson]

Phil,

Thanks as always for your insight! I was wondering if this would simply be dropping a smaller sensor into the current V-Raptor 8K VV body only or would the S35 V-Raptor body be updated in some way, additions(internal NDs) or subtractions(I/O ports ). Also, I was thinking that if the S35 body had the same internal processing capabilities as the VV model that we would get both a higher than 120fps frame rate at full resolution and a faster readout speed for a lower Rolling Shutter since it had a smaller sensor surface area to readout.

 

[Phil Holland]

rand thompson Certainly the sensor could draw less power slightly, but in terms of data, pixels are pixels and that will determine what this thing can do. V-Raptor is a pretty low rolling shutter/sensor readout as is. We'll have to see whatever this sensor is though. It's a surprise. Only thing I knew was coming was the XL because of the teases. Today Jarred dropped that it has a Titanium Mount once again, which was a staple for DSMC/DSMC2 for a bit before the Magnesium Mounts.

 

[James Darren]

Any details on the viewfinder?

 

[rand thompson]

rand thompson Certainly the sensor could draw less power slightly, but in terms of data, pixels are pixels and that will determine what this thing can do. V-Raptor is a pretty low rolling shutter/sensor readout as is. We'll have to see whatever this sensor is though. It's a surprise. Only thing I knew was coming was the XL because of the teases. Today Jarred dropped that it has a Titanium Mount once again, which was a staple for DSMC/DSMC2 for a bit before the Magnesium Mounts.

Yeah, I was thinking if this would be a S35 cut from the same Wafer as the 8KVV with the same Pixel size and Pixel pitch or would it be a completely redesigned sensor? Also on my mind was would this S35 sensor be based on one of the frame sizes from past RED S35 sensors like the Komodo S35, Gemini S35, Helium S35 or maybe the Dragon S35 sensors or would it be based on something other than a DCI image size.


FORMAT COMPARE TOOL
https://phfx.com/tools/formatCompare/

RED- V-Raptor 8KVV FULL FRAME SENSOR AREA

GREEN- Listed RED S35 SENSOR AREA



KOMODO S35-Format Aspect 1.90:1

GEMINI S35-Format Aspect 1.71:1

HELIUM S35-Format Aspect 1.90:1

DRAGON S35- Format Aspect 1.94:1

 

[Phil Holland]

Any details on the viewfinder?

Haven't seen anything anywhere yet.

What I find most interesting is V-Raptor XL clearly has an SDI and power connector for an EVF. Regular V-Raptor doesn't have that feature. Both have the RMI connector. This leaves room for wild thoughts. I don't know if RMI can be daisy chained or of the EXP ports on the RMI adapter can output signal even, but I am hoping for some sort of compatibly as some choose to only use an EVF and it would be nice to have some sort of camera control through it.

If it's an SDI only affair the smaller V-Raptor bodies will be stringing line to handle that, which isn't exactly fun. But SDI keeps the thing very cross platform compatible.

Pros and cons to all directions here and it's even possible to use both connectors I imagine. Curious if ultra compact or flip out LCD w/ EVF might be the way.

There's actually a massive void for a decent SDI Viewfinder right now whatever the case.

 

[James Darren]

If the Raptor XL market is higher end productions, then this camera will have very limited use without a high quality viewfinder. In the world I work in very few people will want to use it until the viewfinder situation is sorted out.

 

[Michael Lindsay]

Xl is very exciting but we won’t be able to order until...

a LPL mount option appears (we would really like a smart one)! ...
we have 3 different sets of LPL lenses so this a real need.
Arri Signatures
Mamiya TLS
Canon Rangfinder set TLS

we can have a look at the optical and mechanical implications of the variable ND?

a good 3rd party or Red viewfinder appears and doesn’t have a multi frame lag

Ps love the ambient TC integration!

 

[Mario Gonsalves]

Do you just fill in your email to reserve? I don't see a preorder button.

 

[Michael Lindsay]

Is there a picture of the XL with 15mm bars and other red accessories?

 

[Patrick Tresch]

Electronic ND is a big question mark for me... How does it perform optically.
I'm thinking 8k S35 could make potential problems bigger?

 

[James Darren]

Electronic ND is a big question mark for me...

And probably everyone else too. Regardless what RED says about the electronic ND, many people won't want to use it until it is proven and even then they'll be reluctant.
Why not have a regular internal ND filter wheel like the Venice or Alexa Mini? The Ranger is meant to be the larger production friendly camera, who cares if it makes it slightly bigger?

 

[Phil Holland]

And probably everyone else too. Regardless what RED says about the electronic ND, many people won't want to use it until it is proven and even then they'll be reluctant.
Why not have a regular internal ND filter wheel like the Venice or Alexa Mini? The Ranger is meant to be the larger production friendly camera, who cares if it makes it slightly bigger?

Semi agree that mechanical NDs at this point might be ideal. But I have heard from the horses mouth as well as seen first hand that the mechanical ND mechanisms are a very frequent repair and stoppage of filming. Camera gives you an error and that's that.

Not saying that should be a deal breaker, but I can see why other "ways" might be ideal outside the desire to have more precision between stops.

Either way it will be something I'll be testing.

 

[James Darren]

Semi agree that mechanical NDs at this point might be ideal. But I have heard from the horses mouth as well as seen first hand that the mechanical ND mechanisms are a very frequent repair and stoppage of filming. Camera gives you an error and that's that.

Not saying that should be a deal breaker, but I can see why other "ways" might be ideal outside the desire to have more precision between stops.

Either way it will be something I'll be testing.

That's not true in terms of it happening frequently. It happens occasionally and no where near as often as you state.

The Mini/Mini LF and Venice are more reliable than any Red body out there according to any rental house you ask.

Perhaps Red felt they couldn't make a filter wheel reliable enough. Whatever the reason, I don't think an electronic ND is a smart move.

 

[Phil Holland]

James - You'll discover the rather appropriate pathway is to be respectful of all manufacturers here, even when being critical of them.

The rather frightening aspect is I have all sorts of information regarding various cameras reliability, repair, product recalls, and other fascinating tidbits. But the difference is I am being respectful of other people's investments. People, production companies, rental houses, etc. Ground yourself there first if possible. I have literally zero issue saying that every camera out there, especially in decent numbers and well used tools can have issues. It's part of the whole thing.

No offense, but a mechanical carousel isn't exactly the hardest thing to make. But moving parts break, every manufacturer deals with this who makes this solution, which is why I stated it's not exactly a bad thing. I've seen them broken in shipping and even shooting handheld.

I'll reiterate, I wouldn't mind either method at this point because people want it very, very badly. KipperTie has already made the mount w/ mechanism for V-Raptor even with the very same common densities you're used to.