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Urgent Request: 100fps 5KAna on epic.

Björn Benckert

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Hi Red,

This sunday and a week forward I have a DP client, that shoots a lot, he just did his first Hollywood feature etc. Now I talked him into shooting his next job of on epic instead of using a alexa studio with codec recorder (what he normally uses). He came by the office last week and I gave him the guided tour of the camera and as he shoots a lot of steady cam he very much see the benefits of the epic small size, etc.

Now all that is good and today he sent me an email, stating that the client, producer and all agree, that they want to do the epic thing. Great... Then his next question "So if we shoot 5kAna what compression rate should we use if we shoot it all in 100fps"....


Hmm, you can not shoot 100fps in that format, you need to go to 4k then you can shoot 120, 5kANA is only 96fps and then you really need to watch out for flicker as it's not dividable by 50hz....

The above reply to his question is not what I want to give him....

So please.... RED if possible, can we have 100fps on 5kAna?

I have the same little issue with another project shot with MP's down here in Thailand (german DP), they want to shoot high fps... but as the light will flicker at 96fps the biggest sensor option is 4k (works quite well as they use spherical lenses) or we could go down to 75fps at 5k (and hopefully get away from flicker. something I will need to test) But 100fps 5K would offcourse be ideal.

So (as you probably allready know) over here in pal/50hz land it's really hurting that the camera goes 4 fps slow from 100fps.


So please if you fix 100fps before the weekend I will have two quite major european DP's (both coming from alexa feature work) that will say "Whow, red really listen..." These 2 guys are all ready very happy with the camera, but if you would give them 100fps that would very much push them over the tipping point.

Thanx in advance :yesnod:
 
Thank you Brent for your quick reply. Just knowing that it's in the scope is very positive.
Now I will go to the nearest temple and ask Budda to make it so you can get it out before the weekend :)

Yupp, heart attack is definitely on the list then...
 
Why not just shoot at 96fps with a 1/200th shutter? Flicker wise it's the same thing.

Nick
 
Why not just shoot at 96fps with a 1/200th shutter? Flicker wise it's the same thing.

Nick

One thing they need t be able to deal down to 25p.

Secondly: 96 fps @ 1/200 gives the same shutter speed, that I understand. But is it not so that to make it "flicker free" we need to be at a frame rate that is is possible to divide evenly by the hz of the lights. So if we shoot 96fps in 230v 50hz light we run a great risk having a pulsating exposure, where as @ 100fps that risk is smaller, or no?
 
One thing they need t be able to deal down to 25p.

Secondly: 96 fps @ 1/200 gives the same shutter speed, that I understand. But is it not so that to make it "flicker free" we need to be at a frame rate that is is possible to divide evenly by the hz of the lights. So if we shoot 96fps in 230v 50hz light we run a great risk having a pulsating exposure, where as @ 100fps that risk is smaller, or no?


Yes & no, shooting using 1/200 @ 96fps will be flicker free with larger tungsten lights. Small domestic lights will flicker at 50fps let alone 100.

The shutter speeds will indeed make it flicker free, why do you think a 172.8 degree shutter ever existed!
 
On a similar note I really like the aspect ration of 1k WS. any chance red can make a WS setting for all the various resolutions instead of just 1k? Yes I know I can crop in post, but I just dig the aspect ratio and high frame rates
 
How did this job end up Björn?
 
Just received my dragon and am a bit dissapointed frame rates didn't go up to rounded numbers....

I really hoped red could make 6k HD or 6k FF 100 fps in 6K HD
or at least in 5.5K HD
or at least in 5K HD

Is this something that can still change through firmware? i really hoped the dragon upgrade would up the framerates to make them more workable, as the specs once promised full 5k @ 120fps. i can only see 95.69 in 5K...am i missing something?
 
Just received my dragon and am a bit dissapointed frame rates didn't go up to rounded numbers....

I really hoped red could make 6k HD or 6k FF 100 fps in 6K HD
or at least in 5.5K HD
or at least in 5K HD

Is this something that can still change through firmware? i really hoped the dragon upgrade would up the framerates to make them more workable, as the specs once promised full 5k @ 120fps. i can only see 95.69 in 5K...am i missing something?

Don't think so. European friendly frame rates are really not RED's bag i'm afraid. They actually don't seem to get it either. Go on RED, prove me wrong, I would love that.
 
Sorry to bump this old thread, but users can be mislead.

The sound to 25p is a non issue.

if you shoot at 1/200, there will be no bulb flicker at 96fps, and btw the sound will not be synced even at 100fps
If you were doing HFR 100p I would understand, but for slow motion ?
Your 96fps will be read at 25p in the editing software , just not for 4 times more but 3.84.

If it's because of a lip sync, just tell your sound guy to fasten the playback files by 3.84 instead of 4 times for a perfect sync
 
Sorry to bump this old thread, but users can be mislead.

The sound to 25p is a non issue.

if you shoot at 1/200, there will be no bulb flicker at 96fps, and btw the sound will not be synced even at 100fps
If you were doing HFR 100p I would understand, but for slow motion ?

Your 96fps will be read at 25p in the editing software , just not for 4 times more but 3.84.

If it's because of a lip sync, just tell your sound guy to fasten the playback files by 3.84 instead of 4 times for a perfect sync

Maybe they aren't thinking of slowmo. They could just mean a framerate conversion to 25p with audio in sync.
There's a bit of a trend lately here in europe for shooting at high speed and deciding if you want the slomo in post or not.
I've often wondered about it as I would assume this would mean this kind of footage would need to be shot with a non standard shutter angle?
I've not looked into it much yet however.
Normally this is done with 50fps however.

Freya
 
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