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  • Hey all, just changed over the backend after 15 years I figured time to give it a bit of an update, its probably gonna be a bit weird for most of you and i am sure there is a few bugs to work out but it should kinda work the same as before... hopefully :)

UNDERWORLD 4

Oh Jim! this is amazing news of the Film Industry! Congrats Red!!
 
I was going to say, at last a film with color, but a dark movie is not the best example. Getting really sick and tied of so many Red films with desatuation, I have not seen one example, but i forget what gamer looked like. I actually enjoy the look of many films shoot on panavision have (how do we emulate the process look on Red). Just watched super 8 and the greenlantern (I know seems more theemed for sub teens) on my screen (old but a gorgeous high contrast rosy color field) very nice color.

I noticed trailer two seems to have less color satuation, but what color is there seems to come out a bit in the trailers. It is a shame they did not try to bring out more detail in the fire scenes. Years ago we got lovely detail in flames from the extended high lattitude fillfactory ibis5a sensor based cameras.
 
I forgot, I really admire Kate's purposeful acting style, how she can hold a stance and flow through a performance,.. ok, yes, I admit she does also look great in her outfits, but it is the case of the actress making the outfit rather than the other way about. :)

Hey Jim, when are we getting 32mp cameras to do films like this justice on Imax 3d?
 
I Just got back from a digital projection. Wow, It looked beautiful.
 
Looked desatuated on my local digital screen. I noticed that the blacks were a little gray, so they probably had raised up the brightness because it was a dark movie, as they have done before and wrecked it, and they want people to pay over $20 for this, lucky I got in on a discount. This is probably worth noting when doing dark movies, don't make too much of the screen too dark, otherwise some novice is going to turn it up. They did not even put it on VMax.

Also the skin tones looked weird a bit, murky, flat, with strange movement etc, it could be the digital cinema encoding process, was this on the redcode master. If it is the cinema encoding work flow, I'd profer 250mb/s redray delivery. I noticed the color in the main characters eyes seem to over shoot, as I said about skin tones, muddying (murky) might be from lower color resolution across the colored areas. Just looks weired, cartoony.

All together, apart from the nice night time footage work and crispness conveyed on the main characters costume, I am dissapionted, typical Red look. Do these guys color correct on laser projection screens, oled, 2d led array backlit lcd, or something, because the brightness and extra color range would make it look in range. Something to keep in mind is that these screens will overshoot the capability of a normal projector.

I will have to rent it out on bluray and try it on my veiwsonic to confirm if it is like this. Now to wait for the Spiderman film before making a more finale decision.

The film itself was quality for that genre, loud and bolder than even the main character. That woman is commanding.
 
I saw it projected in 2D at the Regal 14 Union Square in NYC using the Sony 4K projector (probably from a 2K DCP)... it looked very good, certainly better than the last one shot in the Genesis. On shots of Kate Beckinsale I noticed some mild filtration like a #1/8 Black Frost or something, though perhaps it was a post effect, but you saw it around streetlamps and glints off of her gun and clothing. The movie was very clean and rich-looking, with great detail.
 
Ohh, yes, clean which was good. Thanks for the heads up, I was examining the color, though I saw the problem in the detectives face too. I have been thinking, and the skin effect I'm describing, common to just about all Red footage I have seen, might be caused by flattening in luminosity instead or as well as, but it looks funky. The film Cane Toads, the conquest, which was shot on Si altasens 3d based system, probably locally, also slightly have this effect, but color is much better.

I have to check it out on my TV when it is released on bluray, maybe there is something about the distribution workflow on this end. I would not put it past an Australian to down grade a dustribution to save bandwidth, drives, or reach some such acceptable level of performance, which would be really counter productive. But I must say, the image 100% stops me buying a Red camera.

The Spiderman movie is big budget, and they should give it the full standard, treatment, so I can get a good idea.
 
Well, to some extent, grain from shooting on film does add a false sense of detail and texture to faces, which can feel too "smooth" if grainless. And I'm sure there was a little (mild) digital cosmetic touch-up work on some of Beckinsale's close-ups, that's fairly common for female stars these days, even for actresses in their 20's! Most common work is to reduce any bags under the eyes and the occasional pimple, it's not like an actress can look the same for all 12-hours+ every day on a set, for month after month.

But given that, I did notice some occasional "smoothness" to even some of the male actors' close-ups, I'm not sure if that was due to camera filtration, any 3D rig, or a post decision for a slight "fantasy" look.

Truth is that sometimes people look at images shot with high-end digital cameras like the Epic and just feel that faces look too detailed on the big screen, so some sort of softening technique ends up being applied. The main challenge with that is to guess how much mediocre projection and film-outs are going to add in terms of softness so that you don't overdo the diffusion.
 
David Mullen ASC said:
Well, to some extent, grain from shooting on film does add a false sense of detail and texture to faces, which can feel too "smooth" if grainless. And I'm sure there was a little (mild) digital cosmetic touch-up work on some of Beckinsale's close-ups, that's fairly common for female stars these days, even for actresses in their 20's! Most common work is to reduce any bags under the eyes and the occasional pimple, it's not like an actress can look the same for all 12-hours+ every day on a set, for month after month.

But given that, I did notice some occasional "smoothness" to even some of the male actors' close-ups, I'm not sure if that was due to camera filtration, any 3D rig, or a post decision for a slight "fantasy" look.

Truth is that sometimes people look at images shot with high-end digital cameras like the Epic and just feel that faces look too detailed on the big screen, so some sort of softening technique ends up being applied. The main challenge with that is to guess how much mediocre projection and film-outs are going to add in terms of softness so that you don't overdo the diffusion.
Click to expand...
Some that I've always liked coming from your posts aside who you are for this business or to me ;-)

They are always balanced on the spot. That's exactly what movies are made. Balance.


Greetings from capital of Montenegro,

Emanuel :-)
 
Having just seen The Muppets I was fascinated with the amount of blemishes revealed in Jason Segel's skin. The way the cameras "enjoyed" the texture of the Muppets was fantastic but it felt weird at first to see the same in actors' skin. I must say, I soon forgot all about it and ceased to notice Segel's spots as I got into the story.
 
Makeup.

David Mullen ASC said:
Well, to some extent, grain from shooting on film does add a false sense of detail and texture to faces, which can feel too "smooth" if grainless. And I'm sure there was a little (mild) digital cosmetic touch-up work on some of Beckinsale's close-ups, that's fairly common for female stars these days, even for actresses in their 20's! Most common work is to reduce any bags under the eyes and the occasional pimple, it's not like an actress can look the same for all 12-hours+ every day on a set, for month after month.

But given that, I did notice some occasional "smoothness" to even some of the male actors' close-ups, I'm not sure if that was due to camera filtration, any 3D rig, or a post decision for a slight "fantasy" look.

Truth is that sometimes people look at images shot with high-end digital cameras like the Epic and just feel that faces look too detailed on the big screen, so some sort of softening technique ends up being applied. The main challenge with that is to guess how much mediocre projection and film-outs are going to add in terms of softness so that you don't overdo the diffusion.
Click to expand...

I had no problems with Kate's face, maybe due to enhancement as you said, but noticed elsewhere. The smoothed fantasy look just looked bad on my screening, if that was what it was, I suppose evenly filled might be a better word in lighting terms. As for people seeing extra detail on peoples faces, I looked forwards to that, but you get problems with extra contrast, that make the details stick out. Episodes of the Bill TV series used to have this in SD. The pores looked almost black. I would say, unless you are aiming for artistic smooth look, don't completely cut out texture, but be careful of contrast. What I saw however, was not artistic, which is usually evenly or graduently colored, but real color variations and patches that looked too big on their own. I suppose that is why I did not take notice of Kate's face, the eveness of it. But this metallic or mat look on faces I have seen in every Red film I have seen. Expressionless toning or color, like a monochromatic film upgraded to color a bit sometimes.

About the grain, its pseudo random positioning over frames also reveals hidden additional detail to the visual system.
 
A heads up for those tracking this thread.

Tomorrow night we are hosting the first of what is planned to be a semi-regular event here at RED Studios Hollywood. Since the EPIC cameras are working on so many notable projects, we've decided to do some in depth viewing, learning and discussion on some key projects, covering some of the working processes on these projects, with those that worked on them. Here are the details for the first event, that happens to be focused on Underworld Awakening 3D that is out in theaters worldwide now.

Seating for these events are limited, so if you are interested in attending tomorrow night, RSVP today as soon as you can - details are below to RSVP via email.

Looking forward to an interesting evening.

+ Ted

Blood Flow and Work Flow: An In-Depth Look at the DI Process for the 3D hit Underworld: Awakening shot in 5K resolution on RED EPIC cameras

Company 3's Siggy Ferstl offers a look at What Happened After the Shooting Wrapped

RED Digital Cinema and Company 3 invite you to view 3D clips of Underworld: Awakening followed by a lively discussion with Company 3 Senior Colorist, Siggy Ferstl, who graded the Epic footage for the 3D, 3D IMAX and 2D releases and Ted Schilowitz from RED. Find out how the master colorist worked with cinematographer Scott Kevan's brilliant camerawork with the new 5K sensor and see how the team was able to help create the film's contrasty environment in a way that overcame the limitations of today's 3D projection systems.

The date: Wednesday, February 1
The place: Red Digital Studios, 846 N Cahuenga Blvd. in Hollywood
Reception begins at 6:30. Clips and discussion at 7
Seating is limited, please RSVP to Breanne Botticella -*bre at red.com*-*
Parking map will be sent to RSVP list 24 hours before the event
 
Excellent Ted. Is there any way to link this to REDUSER for the rest of the world? For those who follow but can't attend?
 
Bill,

We are shooting Siggy and Ted's discussion and will be sharing it with the RED community sometime soon.

Brian
 
TedRed said:
A heads up for those tracking this thread.

Tomorrow night we are hosting the first of what is planned to be a semi-regular event here at RED Studios Hollywood. Since the EPIC cameras are working on so many notable projects, we've decided to do some in depth viewing, learning and discussion on some key projects, covering some of the working processes on these projects, with those that worked on them. Here are the details for the first event, that happens to be focused on Underworld Awakening 3D that is out in theaters worldwide now.

Seating for these events are limited, so if you are interested in attending tomorrow night, RSVP today as soon as you can - details are below to RSVP via email.

Looking forward to an interesting evening.

+ Ted

Blood Flow and Work Flow: An In-Depth Look at the DI Process for the 3D hit Underworld: Awakening shot in 5K resolution on RED EPIC cameras

Company 3's Siggy Ferstl offers a look at What Happened After the Shooting Wrapped

RED Digital Cinema and Company 3 invite you to view 3D clips of Underworld: Awakening followed by a lively discussion with Company 3 Senior Colorist, Siggy Ferstl, who graded the Epic footage for the 3D, 3D IMAX and 2D releases and Ted Schilowitz from RED. Find out how the master colorist worked with cinematographer Scott Kevan's brilliant camerawork with the new 5K sensor and see how the team was able to help create the film's contrasty environment in a way that overcame the limitations of today's 3D projection systems.

The date: Wednesday, February 1
The place: Red Digital Studios, 846 N Cahuenga Blvd. in Hollywood
Reception begins at 6:30. Clips and discussion at 7
Seating is limited, please RSVP to Breanne Botticella -*bre at red.com*-*
Parking map will be sent to RSVP list 24 hours before the event
Click to expand...

Yep, most people will not be able to come, but youtube with inserted diagrams would be cool.

Thanks.
 
Thanks again for a fun and educational event. The footage of Underworld: Awakening 3D looked fantastic. Most impressive was the clarity and brightness... something that has often been challenging and disappointing in many 3D releases. EPIC's low light capabilities and Dynamic range (no HDRx was used) was incredible. For 3D, with the EPIC's form factor, it seems like the obvious choice for 3D. For any project, for that matter.
 
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