Underwater Bubble Blowin' Users Group

[Ed Sauer]

I am using one Red battery in the housing. It will last for 2 one hour dives, but the camera is not on the whole time. It usually runs down to about 30%.
Yes because of the slow start up time,80 sec. with Build 15, I missed a shot of a bottlenose dolphin with a turtle in the foreground. You could tie 2 batteries together with a Y cable but you add more length and weight to the housing. It just depends upon how long you want it to run. I never timed it but probably had 90 min run time per charge.

The most I recorded in one day was 100 gig. I am not sure of the run time of the video but it seemed that it was a lot of video. It was more video than I usually shoot.

 

[Clark Dunbar]

Hey Ed,

Look forward to seeing the footage!

 

[Ken Corben]

power management

power management

For those of you lucky enough to be using the red under water, how are you finding the battery life? I heard it only lasts an hour. Is it possible to piggy back the batteries?
One obvious way to improve battery life is to turn the camera off, but with a 35sec start up, its not that handy for wildlife.

How much 4k can you record to the hard drive? Or for that matter hi-speed 2k?

Cheers

I have found that with build 14 I am getting from the battery a 1% = 1 minute standby time with the fan set to HOT (runs continuously). This setting has worked great with out sensor overheating or the need for an interior cooling system. This means I count on an 80 min standby time. Recording obviously consumes more power using the RED drive and LCD. Two batteries on a y would be a bit to big. The quick change battery/drive plate in the Aquavideo pro housing is pretty slick - I pretty much switch to a fresh battery every dive and have great results.

I tried the power down conservation technique and missed some critical shots recently with the current boot up time. That 70-90 seconds is an eternity when the action is happening. The good comes with the bad.

RED drive record time is impressive. Formatted 320 GB drive records approx 3 hours of 4K. I have not shoot 2K or 3K underwater yet but te record times for the RED VBR compression is exponential. This means to me more record time than I would actually commit to a single drive.

 

[Michael Hastings]

I posted elsewere asking about the pre-roll which is a really useful function underwater. I didnt get a very clear response. I understand that it is a feature of the camera, its just not enabled yet. Is this true?

Prerecord or retroloop (as Ikegami calls it) is a great function. I have lost track of whether RED has ever officially said they would provide it. However, it is basically just a function of constantly writing to the drive like a TIVO or the Ikegami hard drives do and then pressing record is merely telling it to actually put a name and location specification to it. It is a lot easier to do with a hard drive than a tape based setup that needs a memory buffer and has to write it out to tape. So I think we will eventually see it once RED gets the announced features implemented and debugged and has a little breathing space to created some of the extra goodies.

 

[Michael Hastings]

Photos of AquaVideo Aluminum housing

Photos of AquaVideo Aluminum housing

We have begun shipping the aluminum version of the AquaVideo RED housing. Photos attached.

Items to note:

We had to do a lot of trimming of aluminum to get the weight down (Hence the eight flats) to where there is some positive bouyancy - approximately 2 lbs. positive. As you can see from the frontal photo the housing is about as compact as it can be to fit the camera and the connectors. The lens shown is the Canon 10-22mm. A cine lens like the Arri 8R takes up nearly the entire front of the housing. Going to a rectangular shape would actually increase the volume.

The top has two short u channels about two and half inches long with 8 threaded holes on the top and 2 threaded holes on each side for attaching a carrying handle, lights/light arms, external LCD monitor, meter, etc. These are sort of mini "cheeseplates" and the 2 u channels are welded on so the holes between them are exactly 12 inches to allow mounting handles, or we also have available a longer cheeseplate if necessary.

The bottom is not shown but is a 12" u channel with 18 threaded holes on the bottom and 7 on each side for tripod mounting or any other need. It also allows the use of a small sliding weight to adjust trim.

The side handle "wings" provide multiple holes for mounting the handles in your preferred position. The handles can be mounted upward or downward (or both) to your preference. The wings also have an oval machined in them to make a solid handgrip to allow easy grabbing for pulling out of the water, transport, etc. (and again it lightened the overall housing). There also multiple threaded holes for mounting lights, Lcd, etc. if you prefer that location. Larger plastic wings can be attached for even greater stability.

The camera mounts on a long slide in plate held in place by two 1/2-20 thumbscrews. The plate holds the camera, a RED battery plate, a slot for the REDDRIVE and a mount for mounting the LCD internally. Since it only adds about 3/4", all housings are setup to allow internal mounting of the LCD. So Everyhing goes in and out of the housing on a single tray. Even for those getting the external LCD case it is useful for certain types of shooting where you want to minimize drag.

As you can see the LCD is easily visible through the rear and you can even see the camera LCD if you angle it right.

The port system is a standard Aquatica, with the larger thread mount that allows use of everything from the Canon 10-22 on a birger mount to the Arri 8R (most cine lenses are much too big to be used with any of the bayonet style underwater SLR ports) as well as long telephoto/macro lenses.

BTW Erik was at the REDUSER NAB party with a working current version of the Birger mount and it worked extremely well, very smooth.

The standard controls are power, start/stop, focus assist, and white balance if you want it even though it doesn't do anything to the recording, and a front control that can either do zoom for the Canon 10-22 (and probably others) as well as provide simple iris/focus control of the PL mount Arri 12mm T2.1 which works well and is available virtually anywhere from rental houses. Focus and iris controls for the Birger mount will be included at no extra charge but you will have to purchase the encoders - price not set yet but probably $500 -$800 for the pair. We will also probably be switching to an electronic start stop as it makes it easier to get the camera in and out without snagging the connectors on the start/stop control. A manual control will also be available as a spare/backup which if necessary could be installed in a matter of minutes.

Control of other PL or manual lenses is available on a custom basis. Simple friction controls are relatively inexpensive. Geared controls will be quite expensive - probably several thousand dollars.

 

[Michael Hastings]

Additional photos

Additional photos

See previous post for main photos and description.

 

[Michael Hastings]

Additional photos of AquaVideo aluminum housing.

Additional photos of AquaVideo aluminum housing.

See previous posts for main photos and description.

That's my brother Tom with the housing at the beach. Nephew Sean is shooting his film school final with RED #206 this week and last.

 

[David Groundwater]

i spent 4 days shooting underwater with an aquavideo aluminium housing in the philippines a couple of weeks ago and it has a great feel to it - the centre of gravity is just about right in the middle and it handles well at any orientation.

it was still somewhat a prototype and is back with mike now being finished - he really had to rush to get it ready for me and i picked it up from his place in miami.

i can't wait to get it back.

thanks for all your efforts, mike.

cheers,

david groundwater

 

[conrad gaunt]

My sisters husband was told last year he has the only known footage of hammerhead sharks breeding (according to N.Geographic), could this be true? He`s gone with the XD cam (before Red),and he`ll build his own enclosure for it. I`ve seen some amazing stuff (70m, at night, BIG sharks!). Can`t wait to see some aqua Red.

 

[Pawel Achtel]

Good to see some new tupperware from Aquavideo.

Can 10-22 under Aquatica plastic-thingy resolve more than 1k underwater?

Aquatica dome is known to flare like kaleidospe, has massive CA and poor contrast. May as well put a VHS camera inside.

Can we see some charts shot underwater and topside to compare? 1:1 corner crops would be of particular interest.

 

[Michael Hastings]

Good to see some new tupperware from Aquavideo.

Can 10-22 under Aquatica plastic-thingy resolve more than 1k underwater?

Aquatica dome is known to flare like kaleidospe, has massive CA and poor contrast. May as well put a VHS camera inside.

Can we see some charts shot underwater and topside to compare? 1:1 corner crops would be of particular interest.

Are we starting this again, Pawel? (For those of you that haven't been around this thread since its early days you can go back a few hundred posts and search other threads to see a long winded, fairly obnoxious discussion of the world's greatest underwater optics - as well as other posts with some fairly insightful in depth discussions of u/w optics in general)

The AquaVideo RED housing can easily accommodate any underwater optic you like via the standard frontplate or relatively simple modification. The Aquatica ports were chosen for the stock setup because they in fact work quite well and have physical advantages that allow use of both the Canon lenses and cine lenses like the Arri 8R.

We have an 8" glass dome option coming in the next couple months - not aquatica although we have access to their 9" glass dome too. In fact at DEMA last fall I made arrangements with the other manufacturers like Aquatica, Seacam, Subal, etc. to buy their glass domes as an oem and accommodate them on our RED housing - including the large dome you raved about in your earlier posts. Pricing would be $1500 - $2500 for any of the versions out there with an additional $500 to $1500 to incorporate it into the frontplate. We also have direct access to the manufacturer that makes most of the raw glass domes which we can get in sizes up to about 18" diameter full dome. The 8" glass dome we are getting made in conjunction with another company is said to have even better coatings, but the truth is they all have a degree of flare, CA, etc,. Short of fairly complex multiple element, dedicated underwater corrective optics - which would likely cost more than the RED and a housing combined - that is the nature of the beast.

Your comment, particularly vis a vis VHS is just BS and basically amounts to trolling. I try to stay above that stuff, but to be honest in all of your posts I've yet to see you bring anything useful to the discussion (seems like I remember you making the same basic comment about Howard Hall's Imax footage). Weren't you supposed to have your super duper RED housing done and footage posted months ago? I suggest you post your phenomenal results so we can have a gold standard.

And by the way, could you make a list of say the top 25 underwater movies - IMAX, 35mm, HD, etc. from the last 30 years and then point out to me which were made with underwater optics other than PLASTIC domes, much less glass domes or any specialized optics?

I've seen most of the PACE, Hydroflex, Amphibico, etc. housings that are/were used and if memory serves they ALL had plastic domes but maybe some in the past couple years had glass domes and I was unaware.

BTW A probably more enjoyable exercise for the rest of this group would be to simply list what you think are the top 25 underwater movies.

 

[Frazier Nivens]

Comments why so negative

Comments why so negative

Good to see some new tupperware from Aquavideo.

Can 10-22 under Aquatica plastic-thingy resolve more than 1k underwater?

Aquatica dome is known to flare like kaleidospe, has massive CA and poor contrast. May as well put a VHS camera inside.

Can we see some charts shot underwater and topside to compare? 1:1 corner crops would be of particular interest.

Thank you AquavideoRed206!!

I'm so tired of such negative statements on this forum, Tupperware? How rude. VHS camera? Aquatica dome, is there not anything that's good enough for you??

It's great to see someone building a housing for this camera.

We've already heard this optics posting from you, why bring it up again.

I have to continually wade through crap posted on this site all the time to get to the relevant positive postings. Post positive constructive things that help, not degrade someone's products.

Sick of all of this negative postings. I hate even replying to this but enough is enough.

My last post:angry01:

 

[Anthony S. Lenzo]

Well said, AquaVideo. Respect!

 

[Michael Hastings]

Thanks, ASL

Thanks, ASL

Well said, AquaVideo. Respect!

Thanks, for the support ASL.

BTW I saw your RED accessories at the REDUSER party, very slick. I especially liked the idea of using the standard DVI cables as a snake.

For any of you that don't know, ASL does some very nice underwater work (as well as rentals and support) using HDCAM in a competitor's housing. They are now making some cool accessories for the RED. After seeing how slick their IOP4R-1 breakout box is I hope they don't make an underwater housing. LOL :biggrin:

But if they do that's OK too. I don't mind competition, or discussion, or constructive criticism - it's the arrogant BS that's annoying. You start to see why Jim had to take a hiatus, and guys like Frazier get turned off. One of the reasons this thread has almost 700 posts - ranging over all kinds of subjects - and is heavily viewed, is that it has been friendly, respectful, and interesting. It would be nice to keep it that way.

PS
BTW: Pawel, I love your tag line: "I don't suffer from insanity, I enjoy every minute of it". I revel in my insanity as well so let's all just enjoy the insanity and good humor that bubble blowers are known for, and leave the snide stuff for another forum/thread. Thanks.

 

[Russ Campbell]

Hey Mike. Good response to the self proclaimed 'Guru of underwater housings'. Great to see the housing finally coming together. Unfortunately I wont be in Durbs to see Sharky's housing, but Mark will keep me posted.

 

[Anthony S. Lenzo]

Thanks, for the support ASL.

BTW I saw your RED accessories at the REDUSER party, very slick. I especially liked the idea of using the standard DVI cables as a snake.

For any of you that don't know, ASL does some very nice underwater work (as well as rentals and support) using HDCAM in a competitor's housing. They are now making some cool accessories for the RED. After seeing how slick their IOP4R-1 breakout box is I hope they don't make an underwater housing. LOL :biggrin:

Mike,

We want to make everything for this product line!!! However, we are going to focus on the Panel/Break-out box and Splash-bag first.

Looking forward to seeing more frame grabs from your housings.

Best,

 

[Michael Hastings]

Mike,

We want to make everything for this product line!!! However, we are going to focus on the Panel/Break-out box and Splash-bag first.

Looking forward to seeing more frame grabs from your housings.

Best,

Let me know when you have something on the splash bag, I get requests all the time. Probably will buy (or trade?) for one.

No hurry on the hard housing! HaHa.:biggrin:

 

[Steven-Marc C.]

Mike,

We want to make everything for this product line!!! However, we are going to focus on the Panel/Break-out box and Splash-bag first.

Looking forward to seeing more frame grabs from your housings.

Best,

Anthony, just went on your website to look at your splash-bag prototype. Looks like it could correspond to what I am looking for for shooting sailing action. How far along are you?

And BTW, maybe this has been adressed before but how are all you case designers dealing with the heating and fans questions with the Red One?

 

[Anthony S. Lenzo]

Anthony, just went on your website to look at your splash-bag prototype. Looks like it could correspond to what I am looking for for shooting sailing action. How far along are you?

And BTW, maybe this has been adressed before but how are all you case designers dealing with the heating and fans questions with the Red One?

Steven,

We will have a prototype splash-bag ready for CineGear in June. Aiming to ship them by mid-summer.
As for heating issues. On aluminum housings, the housing acts like a heat sink for the camera (on most designs). On our splash-bag, we have an inflater valve and a purge valve. With this, you can cycle air thru the system should over-heating become an issue. A bicycle tube inflater adapter on a SCUBA tank will be a nice assist. Cold packs will only introduce moisture into the bag (or any sealed enclosure ) when the outside temperature is different then what's inside. Nitrogen (when available) is your best bet for getting rid of moisture compensation.

 

[Pawel Achtel]

Are we starting this again, Pawel? (For those of you that haven't been around this thread since its early days you can go back a few hundred posts and search other threads to see a long winded, fairly obnoxious discussion of the world's greatest underwater optics - as well as other posts with some fairly insightful in depth discussions of u/w optics in general)

The AquaVideo RED housing can easily accommodate any underwater optic you like via the standard frontplate or relatively simple modification. The Aquatica ports were chosen for the stock setup because they in fact work quite well and have physical advantages that allow use of both the Canon lenses and cine lenses like the Arri 8R.

We have an 8" glass dome option coming in the next couple months - not aquatica although we have access to their 9" glass dome too. In fact at DEMA last fall I made arrangements with the other manufacturers like Aquatica, Seacam, Subal, etc. to buy their glass domes as an oem and accommodate them on our RED housing - including the large dome you raved about in your earlier posts. Pricing would be $1500 - $2500 for any of the versions out there with an additional $500 to $1500 to incorporate it into the frontplate. We also have direct access to the manufacturer that makes most of the raw glass domes which we can get in sizes up to about 18" diameter full dome. The 8" glass dome we are getting made in conjunction with another company is said to have even better coatings, but the truth is they all have a degree of flare, CA, etc,. Short of fairly complex multiple element, dedicated underwater corrective optics - which would likely cost more than the RED and a housing combined - that is the nature of the beast.

Your comment, particularly vis a vis VHS is just BS and basically amounts to trolling. I try to stay above that stuff, but to be honest in all of your posts I've yet to see you bring anything useful to the discussion (seems like I remember you making the same basic comment about Howard Hall's Imax footage). Weren't you supposed to have your super duper RED housing done and footage posted months ago? I suggest you post your phenomenal results so we can have a gold standard.

And by the way, could you make a list of say the top 25 underwater movies - IMAX, 35mm, HD, etc. from the last 30 years and then point out to me which were made with underwater optics other than PLASTIC domes, much less glass domes or any specialized optics?

I've seen most of the PACE, Hydroflex, Amphibico, etc. housings that are/were used and if memory serves they ALL had plastic domes but maybe some in the past couple years had glass domes and I was unaware.

BTW A probably more enjoyable exercise for the rest of this group would be to simply list what you think are the top 25 underwater movies.

I sense some difficulty in answering a simple question and providing a frame grab. I was expecting a yes/no and an attachment instead of a slur of personal remarks and paragraphs of completely unrelated issues. I am not the subject here, the equipment is. I commented on the equipment and your personal and unrelated comments are simply unacceptable by professional standards.

For the record, your previous offensive postings that you referred to were removed by the Moderator. They weren't posted in this thread, they were posted in a separate thread, which I created and you discourteously hijacked. Seems like someone has short memory.

My comment about VHS-like quality (or lack therof) is well founded. It was also evident from the frame grabs that Mark posted and clearly showed that your optics may not resolve more than 1k underwater. I am yet to see any evidence to the contrary. Your response, apart from being abusive and personal, does not indicate otherwise.