Underwater Bubble Blowers User Group Thread NEW

[Mauricio Handler]

Amphibico Rouge

Amphibico Rouge

Amphibico Rouge Housing Update

I just returned from the Blue Ocean Film Festival in Monterey where
I helped Amphibico launch ROUGE, the new housing for Epic/ Scarlet.

The housing is a real breakthrough for using Epic/ Scarlet underwater as it uses all of Red Protocols to allow complete control of camera functions though a
two-tier grip control set up giving us full access to White balance, focus, aperture, ISO, etc. as well as many customizable functions - just to name a few.
In addition to the grip controls, there are 4 customizable buttons on the side allowing you to create your own preferences for one button action.

The housing at the show (pictured) is a working prototype – Updates, changes and possible alterations to this model will be finished soon.
Housing will be ready for shipping by December.

Key features, photos, video link and price list are attached for all of you to analyze and review.

Important features that I would like to point out:

Amphibico is using the Glass 9.25” Megadome made from BK-7 grade mineral glass, which is finely grounded, to the highest standard of precision.
It’s coated at no extra cost with a superior Silicon Oxide coating (SiO2) on the convex surface and with a Broad Band Anti Reflective (BBAR) coating on the concave surface. The SiO2 coating is not only a more resistant type of coating than that used by most other manufacturers, but also has a 0.01% reflective index, providing unparallel light transmission among its competitor. Another important feature of SiO2 coating is that it’s a perfect match to the index of water, which naturally lowers reflections. Both the SiO2 and BBAR coatings not only prevent internal and external reflections but also protect the surface from scratches.

In addition to the Megadome there is also a macro port to fit non wide-angle lenses.
Extension rings come in three sizes and should accommodate most current wide-angle and macro lenses. These extension rings will be expanded to accommodate other popular lenses as they become available.


The housing has two LCD viewing windows allowing the placement of the 5.0 LCD facing upwards and or facing to the rear. This position choice will allow for some creative use of housing while keeping the housing streamlined.
Examples of this might be if you are working in tight quarters such as in a shark cage where you need to put the housing through the cage bars- keeping the finder in the rear makes perfect sense as using an external viewfinder will be much more cumbersome and in many cases impractical.
If you work inside wrecks, caves, etc either configuration- ie. top or rear will work great, especially at depth or in darkness.

An additional and external LCD housing will be available soon and will use a custom HDMI cable. As mentioned in earlier posts the aim is to accommodate a 7” or bigger finder as opposed to just the 5.0.

The real beauty in this housing (aside from above features) is that the camera, lens and battery mount + Servo Motors (up to three motors possible) are all mounted on one slide in tray which is removable and installed with just one move. No tools required!
The tray will eventually be fitted with a dovetail mount to be able to go straight unto a Tripod or shoulder mount in between dives if so required.
This was a very important feature of Rouge from the onset.


Any V mount battery will fit onto the onboard V mount battery holder – using a 240W battery will give you over 4 hrs of power.

The production version will be completely neural with minimal weights needed to compensate for lens/ port selection.

Attached are PDF info / price list and additional photos in following post.
Housing base price $12,995 plus ports and extension rings.

For more information or to place a deposit please contact me directly.
I am always available to discuss any aspects of this housing.

Best,

Mauricio Handler

PS- the 15mm rails are not part of the package- These were installed to carry to show- housing does have a to handle for transport (not pictured)

For a short video on the housing being tested underwater go to:

https://vimeo.com/user12707580

 

[Mauricio Handler]

Amphibico Rouge

Amphibico Rouge

Rouge Key Features, basic pricing and additional photos attached.

Housing Key Features:
 Designed for professional underwater use
 Practically no tools required to mount camera in housing makes for a quick topside ready camera in minutes.
 Full electronic control of the camera, with a state of the art control system, 14 Electronic push button controls on dual
Amphibi-grips® and a menu panel provides; -Direct access to operational camera functions such as Record, White Balance,
Shutter Speed, ISO & Aperture at finger tip access.
 Easy access to camera navigation functions such as Menu, Up, Down, Right, Left & Select to change camera's parameters.
 Access to various user define functions, to execute a number of the camera's user keys & function keys.
 "REDMOTE NOT REQUIRED" All controls are on the grips
 Servo driven proportional Manual Focus wheel
 Servo driven proportional Manual Zoom wheel
 Servo driven Manual Iris wheel
 Power On/Off
 Rear view & top view window to use with the RED TOUCH 5.0" LCD display
 Sensitive Hydrophone
 Water sensor alarm
 Stream lined positioned Tally light provided to inform your talent diver when camera is recording
 Bayonet Mounted Port System
 4 auxiliary ports, supporting bulkhead connectors such as HDMI & HD-SDI outputs
 Optional External monitor ready
 Accepts compatible V-Mount batteries (RED Brick, Switronix XP-L95RED etc)
 Accessory mounting holes of various standard sizes underneath housing.
 Housing will accept the most popular lenses from Nikon, Canon as well as cinema PL mount lenses
 Perfectly balanced
 Streamline design
 Dimensions: 14.75"(37.5cm) Long x 9.75"(24.8cm) High x 15"(38.1cm) Wide

2012 ROUGE PRICING

Retail Price ROVH0100 Amphibico ROUGE housing body 12,995 USD
OPGPR009 BK-7 9.25" Glass Dome port for ROUGE 2495 USD
OPFP0100 Flat port assembly for ROUGE 995 USD
OAEXSM01 Port Extension SMALL 479 USD
OAEXMD01 Port Extension MEDIUM 549 USD
OAEXLG01 Port Extension LARGE 619 USD
ACTC02975 Transport Case for ROUGE 499 USD

 

[Rudi Herbert]

Well, congrats to all the folks at Amphibico, that's how you make a comeback after teetering on the verge of uncertainty!

Housing looks nice and stable, but is it me or does it look about the same size as the Deep Epic? The one thing I'm most in love with is that 9.25" dome, it shows Aquatica's knowledge coming right through. I look forward to testing one of these soon to publish the review on UnderwaterCinema.com

 

[Pawel Achtel]

Story! beats rez & latest equipment any day

Just getting back to the "story" subject that Rudi, Johnny and I referred to earlier. Like most of us, I'm an avid believer in great story telling and totally agree that it is the story that makes the film.

My all time favourite would be probably March of the Penguins. Even a child can easily say what the story was all about: it had the beginning, middle and an end, it had continuity and kept the viewer engaged in anticipation of what happens next. When you see a random sequence from the film, you immediately know which part of the film you are watching. It's like a book. There are small things that help the story like, for example, the direction that the animals walk: from left to right (going to the breeding grounds), right to left: returning to the sea. It's really well done, well edited and a good story.

But, when I say "no story" I mean a "synopsis" like the one below. Can anyone tell what story is this one all about? You can substitute X, Y, Z's and A, B, C's with whatever your favourite diving destinations are.

Does anyone think there is a good story, or any story in this film?

XXX , the newest underwater adventure from the award-winning filmmakers behind YYY, will transport audiences to uniquely exotic locations in the ZZZ region, including the A, B, C and D, to experience face-to-face encounters with some of the ocean’s most mysterious and unusual creatures.

XXX will also offer an inspirational and entertaining way to explore the impact that global climate change has had on our ocean wilderness.

The filmmaking team has captured some of the most extraordinary marine life ever shot on film, including the Fish1 - the world's most venomous fish - and a new species of shark yet to be described by science. Audiences will also be treated to an up-close look at A's exquisite Fish2 and the endangered Mamal1 - animals that can be found nowhere else on Earth.

Filmed with the XXX camera, the highest resolution motion picture camera ever created, XXX will immerse audiences in this amazing underwater world as never before - bringing them face-to-face with these magical creatures.

For XXX we've travelled to some of the most exotic locations on this planet, allowing us to film many creatures for the first time," said the Producer. Audiences will be immersed fully into this amazing undersea world - a world which only a few of us lucky individuals really get to see up close.

The dazzling colours and amazing animals we see from A to the D are made for the grand scale and intensity said film's producer, editor and writer. "But these spectacular yet delicate ecosystems are threatened by climate change. It's vitally important to promote awareness of that, especially among the young people who will be the stewards of our planet's health and well-being."

 

[Michael Hastings]

Well, congrats to all the folks at Amphibico, that's how you make a comeback after teetering on the verge of uncertainty!

Housing looks nice and stable, but is it me or does it look about the same size as the Deep Epic? The one thing I'm most in love with is that 9.25" dome, it shows Aquatica's knowledge coming right through. I look forward to testing one of these soon to publish the review on UnderwaterCinema.com

Rudi:

I thought the same thing, as far as size. The way to determine is to specify the displacement of the housing.

There are two things that are kind of important, one is the frontal area and the other is displacement.

The frontal area is the total area that you have to push through the water and therefore the resistance to movement or how much it will be pushed in a current.

Displacement is simply the amount of water that would spill out if you dropped it into a trough that was filled absolutely to the brim.

The easier way to determine it if the unit is positively bouyant is to use fine weights to make it just neutral and then weigh it. That is the displacement and the weight of the complete package when it is ready to dive.


To compare, we made our Epic housing with the smallest frontal area we thought was feasible while still allowing use of the most important lenses, from small Canon and Nikon lenses to the much larger 10 and 12 millimeter Zeiss/Arri Ultraprime - some of the finest lenses available and a full stop faster (F2/T2.1) than any of the other candidates.

My philosophy is I don't mind adding a little displacement if there is some additional capability to be gained, which is why our epic housing is a couple inches longer than it absolutely has to be, but it allows use of multiple battery options, internal LCD, etc. What I prefer NOT to do if possible is to increase that frontal area because it makes it more difficult to get into tight places, more difficult to swim with and more subject to being pushed around in currents and dramatically increases displacement because the area is diameter squared times length so it increases exponentially with an increase in diameter .

It turns out that the smallest diameter that allows use of important lenses on an epic is 8" internal so our housing is 8" diameter internal and 9" external diameter. (Yes, pawel you can get even smaller diameter with Nikonos lenses, but you are then limited to just the small range of Nikonos lenses - I can pretty easily make our epic housing work with Nikonos lenses, but a DeepX can't work with a 10mm Arri or an Angenieux zoom or whatever)

By comparison, the Amphibico has to be at least 9.75" diameter just to handle the port and then even larger as you go back - plus the large bulge on the top.

We can use an 8" glass dome pretty easily but larger would require a more complex mounting and I'm not sure there is that much to be gained by going to 9.25". Larger domes do reduce some of the image curvature but it is diminishing returns as you get larger. One of the driving forces of getting larger domes was that the virtual image on the traditional "standard" 6" domes was too close for many lenses to focus on and REQUIRED using a diopter while the 8" ports pushed the virtual image out a few inches so most lenses could focus without needing a diopter. These days, I'm not aware of any of the usual wide angles that can't focus on the 8" virtual image.

As far as the description of that 9.25" dome - it sounds nice but the glass dome we use (and really all of the glass domes I know of) are BK7 with antireflection coating on the internal (concave) surface which is the most important.
I'm honestly not sure if we have the Scratch resistant coating on the outside of our dome, but I can tell you it is EXTREMELY scratch resistant as Frazier can attest: when we went to shoot in the Dry tortugas we rode back on the ferry and we made the mistake of letting the ferry people stow the housing and it got what we thought was a big scratch. ON closer examination we realized it was actually the metal that had rubbed off when it struck the metal side of the locker they put it in (somehow they knocked of the port cover we had on it). I tried all the normal things to try to remove it and was pretty pessimistic as I thought it probably scratched it also. After a few weeks sitting on the shelf I tried one of the Magic Eraser (which is melamine foam - sort of a nano tech sponge) and was able to remove the metal and the glass was fine.

As far as the outer antireflection, I'm skeptical as to whether it is very significant for the actual image as reflecting external light isn't all that big of a deal, it is the internal reflections that mix with the incoming light that reduce contrast and softens the image which is why the inside is done. I suspect all that the external reflections do is change the F-stop needed by maybe a thirtieth of a stop (but I actually have no idea - I just don't think it's much and I'd be interested to know the facts - i.e. comparison of their dome with the internal AR only versus with both internal AR and external AR)

 

[Mauricio Handler]

Hi Rudy
Indeed- Amphibico has always been known as an innovative company.. This is indeed a clear way to re-position itself as a leader at the top
of this field.
In terms of overall size, Rouge is smaller than Gates if put side by side, but in terms of volume as it is being suggested- that is something to be tested and or analyzed.
We are considering a second rear door version which is substantially smaller (without the rear port) for those that prefer to use an external monitor exclusively.
This will shorten the LOA of the housing and streamline it even more.
The two rear door option is a way to make this system even more versatile- two hinges make for easy door replacement.
We welcome of course a full review in due course. Production housing will be ready soon.

Thank you for your input.

Mauricio-

 

[Pawel Achtel]

...To compare, we made our Epic housing with the smallest frontal area we thought was feasible while still allowing use of the most important lenses, from small Canon and Nikon lenses to the much larger 10 and 12 millimeter Zeiss/Arri Ultraprime - some of the finest lenses available and a full stop faster (F2/T2.1) than any of the other candidates...

How are these lenses finest for underwater use and, have you seen the results these lenses produce at F/2?
VHS tape never looked so clear in comparison! I can't believe you are recommending these lenses for underwater.

...It turns out that the smallest diameter that allows use of important lenses on an epic is 8" internal so our housing is 8" diameter internal and 9" external diameter. (Yes, pawel you can get even smaller diameter with Nikonos lenses, but you are then limited to just the small range of Nikonos lenses - I can pretty easily make our epic housing work with Nikonos lenses, but a DeepX can't work with a 10mm Arri or an Angenieux zoom or whatever)...

For the record: the external diameter of DeepX is 180mm (7.2"), length 350mm (14"), just in case Mauricio would like to make some last minute fine tuning to the production model in order deliver on his claim to have the most compact housing in the industry

Indeed, DeepX can not take 10mm Arri or Angenieux zoom, which I find just as limiting as tits on a bull. It is not the number of different poorly performing in the water lenses that you can fit in the housing, it is the quality of the picture that matters most to me.

 

[Michael Hastings]

How are these lenses finest for underwater use and, have you seen the results these lenses produce at F/2?

Pawel:

I didn't make any recommendations for underwater. As someone that has been renting these housings for over four years I can tell you that a great many of the actual serious and paying producers and DOPs have their own ideas of which lenses they want to use - often ones that neither you or I would choose or recommend. That's why (besides my argument about the limited FOV of Nikonos 15 on Epic) I have said a dedicated housing for only Nikonos lenses is very limiting. Housings like AquaVideo or Gates are designed the way they are because of the additional options we get: the increased overall clarity and color saturation we get from being able to use wider lenses, versus the absolute corner sharpness if you are considering only the pure image. But just as important to shooters that do narrative motion pictures, music videos, etc is the flexibility to use a variety of lenses because they are going for a specific look.

Sometimes they have legitimate reasons, other times I will recommend a certain lens and the producer will say "No, the Producer or DOP wants to use a certain zoom, or Super speeds or whatever ... so that's what we're getting." And you just have to go with it ... and having flexibility makes all the difference in actually getting the job or rental.

 

[Mauricio Handler]

Thanks to all those with a positive feedback on the new Rouge housing- for all others, well you will have to live with the fact that customers (not necessarily those on this forum) have
a new option when it comes to housings to take their Reds underwater.
it is interesting that every time someone introduces a new product - those manufacturers already on the forum try to put the new products down!
Now we are looking at volume and displacement of these housings as a new criteria for innovation! I don't think we want to go there.

Amphibicos Rouge is the only housing on the market utilizing Red Codes to control all aspects of the cameras- funny that no one has mentioned the fact
that Red actually released these codes to Amphibico! This is huge.

Regarding Size, volume etc - well, Rouge has a 9.25" glass dome which to my inexperienced eye will display water just nice enough for me to not even consider this aspect or having to get into technical testing for displacement.
The housing- when finished will be about 2" smaller as the rear door will be shortened- an optional larger back is available for those wanting to mount their monitors in the rear.

Amphibico and Aquatica would gladly supply any one of the manufactures on this forum with the 9.25" glass domes as some of you have and or are already using the 8" originally from Aquatica- so these ports cannot be so bad!

Ah- one more very important point- one that I DO base my purchase decision on: The Rouge comes in Silver color!! try matching that....

Lets continue keep it light guys- it is unlikely that anyone of us on the forum will be buying each others gear as most of you are already set.
All housings showcased here have great merit- these include Gates, Deep X as well as Aqua Videos.

For now- I like what I see in ROUGE.
Amphibicos flagship housing is l the only one purpose designed to take full advantage of Red Codes which makes camera control a breeze and separates this housing from all others.
They have designed and manufactured a housing especially optimized for this camera, using the finest material available, state of the art machining process, cutting edge electronic programming and decades of experiences in this field.

lLets bring out the best in us by celebrating innovation..... Lets leave the sales pitches to dealers and trade shows... ! we are all going to do well.

Mauricio -

 

[Rudi Herbert]

Hello guys,

Just to let you know that there are a couple of new articles about Mark Thorpe and George Evatt's projects at UnderwaterCinema.com, enjoy! Please help us promote the site, pass the word around, send links to people you know may like the content. Thanks!

 

[Mark_Thorpe]

Cheers Rudi,
Much appreciate the airtime on your platform.

Mark.

 

[Pawel Achtel]

...it is interesting that every time someone introduces a new product - those manufacturers already on the forum try to put the new products down!...-

I think you set yourself up by providing incorrect and misleading information about the size and weight of your housing and others kindly brought it to your attantion despite your continued denial and avoidance to clarify this issue. I don't think you will gain much credibility or respect here by false advertising.

Perhaps you can follow your own advice? Just a quote...

.... Please open / start another thread on another section of Reduser.net
All that want to hear from you and about you and your products can follow you there.
I read this forum every morning over nice cup of coffee which I desperately want to
begin to enjoy again!!....

...Ah- one more very important point- one that I DO base my purchase decision on: The Rouge comes in Silver color!! try matching that.... -

Really?

3Deep is made entirely out of titanium and Silver in colour. But, unlike your creation, it will never corrode and it is scratch resistant.

I thought Gold was more desirable than Silver. With DeepX, we use hard anodizing type III followed with a sealing process. We do not use paints or powder coating, which rub off and scratch far more easily. Try matching that...:001_tt2:

I would like to see footage now - from all of us... .stories, techniques, ideas, etc.
Lets get back on track and lets keep the camaraderie.

Indeed, as you said, we look forward to your own contribution. I would like to see some footage, 1:1 frame grabs, or whatever that would let us see what this product can and cannot do.

Also, can you explain if Amphibico has improved the reliability of their electronic controls that daunted us for decades, including the Amphibicam fiasco. All main players suggested here that mechanical controls are the way to go for the ultimate reliability .... and we took this even a step further by offering titanium controls as standard...and 5 year warranty on those controls. I believe Amphibico gives only 3-month warranty on their products if they are used professionally, is this correct?

 

[Will Keir]

How many players do we have in the Epic underwater housing game? 2D for now.
(please help me update prices to reflect the current market)

~ Gates Deep Epic ~ http://www.gateshousings.com/news/gates-announces-deep-epic-housing/
Price: Aprox. $20,000 (price may need updating)

~ Pawel's Deep X~ http://www.achtel.com/DeepX/index.htm
Price: $20,000 10/4/12

~ EQUINOX UNDERWATER VIDEO HOUSING ~ http://www.equinoxhousings.com/products/RED-EPIC{47}SCARLET-HOUSING.html
Price: $7,500 (price may need updating)

~ Aquavideo's Digital Cinema Underwater housing ~ http://www.aquavideo.com/
Price: ???

~ Amphibico ROUGE ~ No good info on their website to date.
Price: $13,000

Anyone I am leaving out? The underwater "tubes" such as , EpicCam ( http://www.epiccam.com/ ), I left out for obvious reason.

 

[Frazier Nivens]

Rudi,
Just sent you a PM about saving Aquarius, please get back with me asap on it.

Frazier
Didn't have your email.

 

[Rudi Herbert]

Frazier,

Just sent you an e-mail, sorry about the delay. In essence, my friend who has contacts at BP told me that is his experience, this is too small a thing, with too little press visibility and too obscure/sophisticated a profile to be easily understood by the general public, for BP to undertake the complex motions they follow when they get involved in something. But he will try and so can we. Also, although $3 million is nothing in the bigger scheme of things, most people who'd be willing to invest in saving aquarius would like some sort of say in what they do, and as it stands, all programs are strictly run by the NC university, so it is hard to cough up all that money and have no input at all. Things like opening the habitat to art and film projects for example, which as of now are highly regulated and mostly frowned upon. But anyway, let me write to a few more people and see if anybody has any suggestions.

In the meantime, why don't we try to come up with a video petition appealing to BP and post it online, something "signed" by all of us, where we all read a 5-10 second part of a script, an appeal to BP, and we publish it and update it as we go?

Aquarius will be permanently closed down on December 31st for those who don't know. The world's only underwater lab will be no more.

 

[Frazier Nivens]

Frazier,

Just sent you an e-mail, sorry about the delay. In essence, my friend who has contacts at BP told me that is his experience, this is too small a thing, with too little press visibility and too obscure/sophisticated a profile to be easily understood by the general public, for BP to undertake the complex motions they follow when they get involved in something. But he will try and so can we. Also, although $3 million is nothing in the bigger scheme of things, most people who'd be willing to invest in saving aquarius would like some sort of say in what they do, and as it stands, all programs are strictly run by the NC university, so it is hard to cough up all that money and have no input at all. Things like opening the habitat to art and film projects for example, which as of now are highly regulated and mostly frowned upon. But anyway, let me write to a few more people and see if anybody has any suggestions.

In the meantime, why don't we try to come up with a video petition appealing to BP and post it online, something "signed" by all of us, where we all read a 5-10 second part of a script, an appeal to BP, and we publish it and update it as we go?

Aquarius will be permanently closed down on December 31st for those who don't know. The world's only underwater lab will be no more.

Just sent you an email at length about all this. Was writing it as you were posting.
Frazier

 

[Mauricio Handler]

Ahh my dear Powel

You have absolutely no sense of humor.... sorry but Im not playing your game on this forum.

I just wanted to inform all of those interested what Amphibico had just released.
In time there will be samples, tests, reports etc but not from me as this would seem too self serving.

We all know on this forum that there is only one perfect housing option out there with only one technical guru-
Deep X- Titanium.... and in Silver- damn! how did I miss that.

If I wanted to get into a pissing fight I would just pick up the phone and call my ex wife!

Again, thanks for all of you that contacted in private... remember we are not each others customer base.

Lets keep up the great innovation and creativity.

 

[Frazier Nivens]

Always nice to hear new developments

Always nice to hear new developments

Ahh my dear Powel

You have absolutely no sense of humor.... sorry but Im not playing your game on this forum.

I just wanted to inform all of those interested what Amphibico had just released.
In time there will be samples, tests, reports etc but not from me as this would seem too self serving.

We all know on this forum that there is only one perfect housing option out there with only one technical guru-
Deep X- Titanium.... and in Silver- damn! how did I miss that.

If I wanted to get into a pissing fight I would just pick up the phone and call my ex wife!

Again, thanks for all of you that contacted in private... remember we are not each others customer base.

Lets keep up the great innovation and creativity.

Nice to hear about new developments, release dates and information on housings But I do get tired of hearing the same old put down of any other housing other than Pawels Deep X.

 

[Will Keir]

Can anyone confirm the current price of the Gates underwater housing and the Aquavideo please?

Thanks

 

[Ken Corben]

Mystical Mermaids 3D

Mystical Mermaids 3D

Shot a challenging underwater 3D project recently.
3D plates in Fiji, EXT DAY shot to match 3D underwater talent on green screen.

You can check out the project at this link:
http://www.reduser.net/forum/showthread.php?86677-Mystical-Mermaids-3D&p=1074007#post1074007

And the video on the proiect's kickstarter page here:
http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/1608213503/49974126?token=6d91a676

Shooting the EPICs in 3D underwater is absolutely fun!

Sharky