***UNDERSTAND THIS*** ..and you will have less expectations!!

[Ketch Rossi]

Nor Canon or Nikon or any other Still Cameras from any manufacturer will present and bring you anything even remotely close to what RED is and will be offering as far as "MOTION CAPTURE" goes, in any of their current Still Cameras configurations and that is IT!!! Also this will be very unlikely to change any time soon, not certain of it, but pretty positive about it

This Still cameras are making truly incredible advancements in their fields of STILL IMAGING and even so I hate how they do it, sucking you in with bits of improvement and always holding something for the next MODEL, they are still nonetheless improving their systems, and the new 1D IV is the very example of it!

Now Motion capture in this cameras is still and will continue to be a high compression process and never will get to the quality of your expectations, so don't wait for it and gain some extra sleep

If anything the TRUE disappointment as in the new 1D IV should be that they made NO effort in the shooting frame rate, other then the Burst up from 110 to 121, not impressed here at all, was surely expecting at list a 30 to 60% speed increase in the actual Frames Per Second capture, and the fact that does not even sports the same 18MP of the little 7D, now this is some Shit that you should complain about it, and not the constant talk about how they don't do a good video cause of this or that, they never will!


Scarlet and EPIC will be Motion Cameras with Still capture, which were design from start with both in MIND, and are not trying to go back inside an already existing system designed for only one purpose and now make it work for two purposes totally different in each other's needs, and this is not a small task, not a small one by a large margin.

A while back I made a Rant Thread to Canon, but it was do to my status of mind in that particular period, and now i fill a bit better and think that Canon still is the Top Game in the 35mm Still world and with the new D IV series has again proved to be so.

RED, is however to my opinion the only true contender that can make and deliver a system in every format that will meet and surpass each and every one's expectations, as far as the handling of each body, and their fill, is a different story as you will have many that will still like and enjoy and prefer their 35mm bodies type for still capture, mostly do to the larger Thicker bodies of the Scarlet and Epic, while the MF645 world will not have this issue, as the 645 camera systems are just about the same and or bigger, other then that, I will see no reason to NOT sale out all current photographic and video gear in any size, from 2/3 to 35mm to MF 645 and 617.

There is and wil be also considerations in their capacity of High sync, high ISO, MP count (not so much but still important), and more so how their new AF lenses will handle on their respective line of products, minus the 617 off course, for still imaging, and yes even for MF645 today's current camera in this format are pushing the agenda of the AF for both their camera designs and Fast AF operation as well as their lenses.


Then again.. so much has yet to be seen

 

[Bryce O]

But I want a 12,000 - 25,600 iso cam that weighs less than 2 lbs... :tongue_smilie: And I want it today.

 

[Ketch Rossi]

The ISO will have to see the final specs on the Scarlet and Epic, as far as weight remember that all modules can be placed apart form the main Brain it self, so you might get pretty light, still 2LB is unrealistic with any good lens, remember, good glass is heavy, faster Glass is even heavier

 

[Ace]

I guess most of the frustration was due to many on this board "not getting any", and that any = scarlet. Everyone is eagerly awaiting the ultimate handheld soloution and these nikon/canon longings are only symptoms and side effects of how badly everybody lusts after Scarlet.

 

[morgan_moore]

Well if you look at still camera development

The nikon D100 could shoot RAW but it took two minutes to write a couple of frames to the card

So for general use it was compressed image only camera

But this camera taught me what RAW was and I wanted it

I ended up often using two D100s with the same lens , swapping bodies while the other was writing to the card

When was that ? I dunno - four or five years ago

My point ? that IMO these things may get their act together and fairly quickly

It is obvious that the current gen are just a taste

On the econmoics of getting bad stock footage and wasting money on the trade up wheel there is of course a good argument for RED right now..

S

 

[Ketch Rossi]

He he, I guess that too Ace, but the 30th is near and time seems to really fly this days, so will be there sooner then they know .

 

[Ketch Rossi]

Yes Morgan, but again do remember that Still capture is very, very different from Motion capture, and I'm not a tech guy by far, but do understand the basics, and they tell me that Raw of any codec at true 24P will be given by this manufacturers, on amy of their current models, also remember that Canon has their line of Motion cameras as well and they need to stand careful of what they do, nnot to step on their own feet, and nikon is far from achieving anything close to it, as so far has demonstrated to be the last boy in this cause.

 

[morgan_moore]

Eh

My point is that in a few years stillswise the impossible has become possible, CaNik are now getting their teeth into motion

And may again make the impossible possible

The question is what to do in the interim

S

 

[Ketch Rossi]

While we are learning every day that the impossible is really just an other obstacle (believe me I should know something about this) there are limitations in everything in life, and it will take possibly a lot more then this companies are willing to do to make this a reality, especially for pricing, as I believe that if RED can do what they do, then others with the same or larger resources can do it to, question is, will they??

 

[Chad Lancaster]

I find it amazing that after red has announced their modular system that canon/nikon are still making you buy an entire new camera every time something is updated..

 

[morgan_moore]

(Re KEith)

Will they ?

I really dont know

If you look at those 'pro' DSLR cameras they seem to have lost their way over the years

Active D Light, Programme Mode - WTF is that stuff about ?

What about something useful like programmable restriction of the AF hunt on short lenses (as a water housing user that would be a boon no more sharp drips)

Decent flash synch with proper flashes ?

Pro DSLRs dont seem that pro to me and neither does the attitude of the companies that produce them

S

 

[Ketch Rossi]

CHAD,

the answer to that is simple, RED Scarlet and EPIC are not available yet, neither we know when they will be, and for those that have work to do, they must buy the best camera system available to them to do the JOB!

 

[Craig W. Bickerstaff]

I find it amazing that after red has announced their modular system that canon/nikon are still making you buy an entire new camera every time something is updated..

What's so amazing about it, they have a proven model and working cameras ready for the store shelves.

 

[Ketch Rossi]

Well Morgan that is because this companies are putting new features to entice the market, but have always failed miserably to listen to the Pro needs.

This is why most true Pros, have moved to MF cameras, for more but not excluding the reasons you mention, and Flash sync speeds coming to 1/1600 of a second, is one of the much looked after functions that Pro, photographer wanted for long time on the MF too

The market is what it is, and we just can do very little about it, other then just buy what best is available to complete our task, for both pleasure or work..

 

[morgan_moore]

This is why most true Pros, have moved to MF cameras, for more but not excluding the reasons you mention, and Flash sync speeds coming to 1/1600 of a second, is one of the much looked after functions that Pro, photographer wanted for long time on the MF too
.

Yeah in 2005 i bought a Hassy and 22mp for 'near Red money'

it was so Red like with constant firmware upgrades, and a trade in program for the 'brain' with the body retained and a bitch like workflow - one felt like the software was being written by 'Lars' or 'Bengt'

To be honest the D3x blows it out of the water for use-ability nowadays - the pros are not buying hassies any more - they are lurking on RedUser eyeing up another market sector !

As I evaluate Red/Scarlet I will keep that path well in mind

To be fair on the old blad it did pay for itself and still makes wonderful images today (at 50ISO !)


S

 

[Ketch Rossi]

Yeah the Hassy I think is close to have served their purpose in the Pro community as they are really going the wrong direction, and Phase is really taking over the MF Pro market.

I'm shooting with Phase One P30+ system now, but will be selling very shortly in the hope of RED's announcement

 

[morgan_moore]

Well my story is a little more complex than just hassy, I have a sinarEmotion back on H1 and had a kodak proback before that (still best colours ever) but 90% of my earning shoots are D3 - because it is quicker, not because it is better

Looking at your P30 in the marketplace now would you not prefer a D3x - I would

my concern is if I invest in Red that in two years I would be better off with a (guess) "Nikon D5Xs"

With motion Im not earning yet, just getting some straight to web work - I think I will be earning in two years, with stills I am earning every day

If you are earning today shooting motion then forget DSLRs and get the tool that you need to do your work now

Maybe get a 5d for some beauty BRoll

Revisit DSLRs in two years for earning tools

My guess

S

 

[Ketch Rossi]

Well, good tough, my path however is well laid out before me and I see RED

My true and only Passion is STORYTELLING and I do so in both Motion and Still Image Capture, so EPIC will serve me well, and I will look no further, I don't have too many years left in me to do this any way so the rest of the time will be spent in Still capture and Digital manipulation, a much slower paced Hobby/Passion/Business that I can continue to do till a pass away.

But I know for sure that Once with an EPIC in my hands I will absolutely look no more!! Okay possibly a change of Brain here and then

 

[morgan_moore]

a nice feeling to stop hunting

my suspicion however is that if you want decent ISO and FF and AF at least for stills

the scarlet aint going to deliver on the ergonomics and lenses

meaning the hunt must continue for me

S

 

[Ketch Rossi]

Well for me the Body size is not a problem as I'm used to the larger MF bodies + Digital Backs, and the ISO is surely nice in low light, but I really never shot anything over 400ISO in twenty years

However I do understand the need fro higher ISO, and this is were most manufacturers are now headed.

I also shoot mostly in Full Manual and rarely use AF, but when I do, I like to have the most responsive and fast precise AF I can get, both form camera and lenses.

I do trust that RED will deliver! This first Batch of Brains, might not deliver for us all, but I believe will do so for most, and all you have to do, is move to the next Brain, for added features, if this are not Upgradable with Software or within a similar upgrade of the R1 with direct change of the Sensor.