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  • Hey all, just changed over the backend after 15 years I figured time to give it a bit of an update, its probably gonna be a bit weird for most of you and i am sure there is a few bugs to work out but it should kinda work the same as before... hopefully :)

Thoughts on Color

Vladus said:
There is one stupid thing (only stupid solutions now occur to me) I'll try on Monday, but I don't give it a big chance: my edl is in the same folder as dpx files - i'll try to move it elsewhere.
Click to expand...

This is very odd. Do you get Pro Video phone-in support these days?

Cail
 
I've tried to sign in to Silicon Color Message Board, hoping that I'll find some answers there, but no luck.

Seems like their forum is dead. They should at least let it open for reading...
 
Can anyone confirm Color is actually ABLE to conform edl with dpx files?

If it worked in Final Touch then possibly guys from Apple screwed it up while messing with XML...

One more thing regarding relinking (doesn't work for me also): when you import dpx seqence to color you see it in browser collapsed (as one item), but when you try to relink/reconnect you see each file separately. Isn't this odd?
 
This may have already been addressed in the pages I didn't read, but talking to THE guy at Apple who wrote most of Color as Final Touch HD, if you want to do log, you're doing DPX.

And YES they have a conform solution, is how Final Touch 2K worked. Haven't done it yet myself, but will probably sooner rather than later.

-mike
 
I know Color SHOULD be able to conform dpx files, but I've lost few days trying to do it according to user manual. It seems like Color is misinterpreting edl source timecodes, thus not finding the right source files.

I'm trying to find anyone who pulled this off in Color.

Anyway, we have reported this issue to Apple (Bug ID# 5251111) and are waiting for response.

Short projects workaround would be to render Avid 2K timeline to single dpx sequence and cut it to independent shots in Color, but I'm sure this is not the way it meant to be...
 
DPX Conform in Color

DPX Conform in Color

FINALLY! We have figured it out.

So, the joke was an Avid's cmx EDL. To make DPX conform work, you need an edl that is EXACTLY formatted. Looks like edl parser in Color is VERY sensitive about empty spaces between items (character length of each item). It's redicilous, but that's it.

This is one line of an edl that works:

001 reel V C 01:07:26:21 01:07:28:24 00:00:22:21 00:00:24:24

Count the characters (including spaces) of each item, it has to match.

Another thing is NOT to check USE AS CUT LIST check box, and to pick just the folder with dpx files, not enter it, when browsing for SOURCE DIR.
 
Vladus said:
FINALLY! We have figured it out.

So, the joke was an Avid's cmx EDL. To make DPX conform work, you need an edl that is EXACTLY formatted. Looks like edl parser in Color is VERY sensitive about empty spaces between items (character length of each item). It's redicilous, but that's it.

This is one line of an edl that works:

001 reel V C 01:07:26:21 01:07:28:24 00:00:22:21 00:00:24:24

Count the characters (including spaces) of each item, it has to match.

Another thing is NOT to check USE AS CUT LIST check box, and to pick just the folder with dpx files, not enter it, when browsing for SOURCE DIR.
Click to expand...

BAD WEB EDITOR! It left out empty spaces. So i'm gonna put dots instead.

001.reel......V.....C.......01:07:26:21.01:07:28:24.00:00:22:21.00:00:24:24

Update your user manuals accordingly.
 
The problem was in the way Avid exported cmx formatted edl.

We do offline on Avid and then we scan film negative to 2k dpx files using the exported edl. Scanning facility (Northlight scanner) has no problems with Avid's edl.

But, when we tried to conform edl in Color (link to dpx files) to my suprise it didn't work. It took us few days trying various tricks with renaming dpx files, folders, etc. No result. Color did import edl, but there were just empty (red crossed) clips on Color's timeline - no picture.

In Color there is a window to the right of the timeline, where the timecodes for each clip are displayed. We have noticed that the timecodes don't match the ones in edl. That was obviously a problem why Color couldn't find matching dpx files (each dpx file contains timecode in it's header).

Today, one of our operators compared Avid's edl to FCP's edl and discovered that particular items in two edls don't match in means of their length (roll name, letter V as video track, etc.). We have then edited Avid's edl in TextEdit so that now each item contains the exact same number of letters (including space characters).

After this, Color was able to read the edl correctly and immediately found the source footage (dpx file sequence). Hooray!

I'm a bit disappointed in the way developers programmed the edl parser (piece of code that reads edl and extract timecode values from it), being TOO sensitive to actual number of characters (reel name has to be exactly 10 characters including empty spaces, etc.).

Sorry, I don't know a better way to explain it.
 
Vladus,
That sucks.
Be sure to send your explanations here to FCP feedback, with a nit of edl samples to show them the problem.

Did you try to import the edl into fcp and export it again?
That might work to correct the formatting, a bit faster that manual editing.
Thanks for the heads up!
 
EDLMax might also fix the formatting for you.

2- There's subtle differences between the EDL formats (CMX, grass valley, sony, etc.)... the EDLMax website has an article on that.
 
Anders Holck said:
Vladus,
Did you try to import the edl into fcp and export it again?
That might work to correct the formatting, a bit faster that manual editing.
Click to expand...

Thanks, I'll try it, definitely. Wouldn't want to TextEdit 3000-cut feature :)
Or maybe I'll write an AVID/FCP EDL converter. :)

Well, actually I wouldn't grade feature in Color. There are many issues left to solve by Apple (random crashes on Save, curves being screwed when moving ending points, even shortcuts don't work properly - try copy grade to membank1,...)

Anyway, I hope we'll see some Color updates soon. GUI really stinks, not just in terms of design but also functionally. I'm waiting for JL Cooper's Eclipse CX and hope it has a good support in Color (editable).

Last thing is to buy some grade reference monitor (DCM23 from eCinemasys looks promising) and throw out our Sony SD CRT.
 
Nope! thats great.. understand totally now :)

What kinda mac ya grading 2k dpx's on? whats ya playback fps of raid etc?

also are you using the xt1900?

I contacted e-cin about the new dpx and fx line but no response.. :-/


S
 
flameop said:
Nope! thats great.. understand totally now :)
What kinda mac ya grading 2k dpx's on? whats ya playback fps of raid etc?
also are you using the xt1900?
I contacted e-cin about the new dpx and fx line but no response.. :-/
S
Click to expand...

We have 8core MacPro demo, but still waiting for ATI card. Demo came with low-end Nvidia (unusable 8-bit).

Raid is custom built 8-drive external sata 3,6TB raid capable of >500MBps when configured as raid-0 (Highpoint RocketRaid controller).
 
(DCM23 from eCinemasys looks promising) and throw out our Sony SD CRT.
Click to expand...
Their new DPX line looks better... it might do better black level than the CRT (i.e. on dark scenes, where the CRT gets better since flaring is less bad when the scene is dark).

But 600 bucks seems a high price for "automatic space inserter".
Click to expand...
They have a 15 day trial (I think it's 15). And... *cough*theyshouldprobablyshortenthattrialsincetimedoesntflyasfastwithmultiplecomputers*cough*. Sorry, that was one long cough.
 
They probably need to update their website. You can presumabley get a quote + arrange a demo if you contact their sales.

Their 24" DPX monitor is about $25k USD, in the same price bracket as the Sony BVM-L. Their 40" DPX I believe is about $50k USD (?).
 
Vladus said:
Another thing is NOT to check USE AS CUT LIST check box, and to pick just the folder with dpx files, not enter it, when browsing for SOURCE DIR.
Click to expand...

To be fair, this is pretty clear in the manual - the 'cut list' is for when you're importing a single video file with an EDL describing all the cut points.
 
cailyoung said:
To be fair, this is pretty clear in the manual - the 'cut list' is for when you're importing a single video file with an EDL describing all the cut points.
Click to expand...

Maybe you're right, but actually I thought dpx sequence is interpreted as a single video file.
Anyway, that wasn't the issue. I have tried both ways, before discovering the problem was in Avid's edl formatting.

Cheers,
 
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