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  • Hey all, just changed over the backend after 15 years I figured time to give it a bit of an update, its probably gonna be a bit weird for most of you and i am sure there is a few bugs to work out but it should kinda work the same as before... hopefully :)

Surprise...?

now what are we going to Record on. is it going to be RED Flash?
and with that.. do we get the 4k 60fps on RED Flash too?
 
mikeburton said:
Jim, if you could enable the LCD/EFV desqueeze to go with this amazing piece of information you just shared I will do a cartwheel on the ceiling :) This is freakin incredible! I couldn't ask for anything more as this compliments my anamorphic set I'm putting together.
Click to expand...

Hi Mike,

I guess you got something wrong here.

Jim explained we get a native 2.4:1 mode, so this does NOT use any anamorphic lenses at all. In fact, to create a 2:1 squashed cinemascope filmout you actually need to squash the image when recording it to film.

The new mode is a 1:1 pixel mode and does not have anamorphic pixels. In fact that whish would exceed RED ONE's capabilities, as it would need to record 4.5k by 3.75k in anamorphic mode, which is already way larger than the sensor is, not to speak about its unfortunately too excessive pixel amount that exceeds the pixel compression speed of RED ONE's encoder.

But still the desqueeze function would be cool for those using anamorphic lenses in other modes...

Just to be clear.

Axel
 
Axel Mertes said:
Hi Mike,

I guess you got something wrong here.

Jim explained we get a native 2.4:1 mode, so this does NOT use any anamorphic lenses at all. In fact, to create a 2:1 squashed cinemascope filmout you actually need to squash the image when recording it to film.

The new mode is a 1:1 pixel mode and does not have anamorphic pixels. In fact that whish would exceed RED ONE's capabilities, as it would need to record 4.5k by 3.75k in anamorphic mode, which is already way larger than the sensor is, not to speak about its unfortunately too excessive pixel amount that exceeds the pixel compression speed of RED ONE's encoder.

But still the desqueeze function would be cool for those using anamorphic lenses in other modes...

Just to be clear.

Axel
Click to expand...

Yeah, I shortly realized that after I posted. Jumped too soon but thanks for the explanation anyhow. The Desqueeze is all i really want anyhow.
 
I doubt we can do a de-squeeze on the LCD monitor path, but there are external monitors that do that.

Jim
 
Martin Weiss said:
I know exactly what you are talking about. My wife has to endure it til November. (But I did go and see "Sex and the City" with her. So I guess we are even...
Click to expand...

Maybe you can get as far as an Epic with that!

Martin Weiss said:
Maybe there should be a special "Support group for wives of not-quite Red owners"
Click to expand...

Hahaha, SGWNQRO !
 
Jannard said:
We were trying to hold off talking about this until the codec errors were completely killed (we think they are with the build coming in a day or two), but there has already been some discussion about this so here you go:

The RED ONE will soon be able to shoot 4.5K, 2.40:1 at 30fps. Expect to see this very soon.

Jim
Click to expand...

Jim,

as we are on it (again):

When will there be a custom mode, that we can adjust freely between x and y resolution and resulting possible maximum frame & compression rates?

Most industrial cameras support modes like this, so you have adjustable windowing / region of interest and adjustable frame rates, exposure time etc.

I really like the idea of supporting new modes, but in the long end we would need dozens of modes, which could mean a lot of confusion for a user.

Therefor I strongly vote for having the chance to make user adjustable presets, which we can store and recall, and also share here on the list if require (by exchanging the "dimension" values here).

Many wanted e.g. highspeed at lower resolutions, or very excessive modes like 4K * 0.5K at higher frame rates, or 3K * 2.5K anamorphic just to name a few. We had many threads about such wishes, each wish being valid for the particular user(s) asking them.

So it sound to me like a wise decision to consider having a "custom" mode that allow all the users to cover such modes within some typical given restriction if required. Such restriction could even be coming from the codecs, like requiring x/y axis to be multiples of 2, 4, 8 or 16 etc. - such typical stuff...

We know there is a maximum pixel compression speed, a maximum line read-out speed, limitations on full-well-capacities for exposure, sensor width/height etc.

So give us something to play even more excessive than what we have right now.

And, not to forget:

Thanks for what you and your team have achieved until now. You made us feel a lot of our days way brighter...

Cheers,
Axel
 
Jannard said:
I doubt we can do a de-squeeze on the LCD monitor path, but there are external monitors that do that.

Jim
Click to expand...

That's not the can-do attitude I would expect from you guys.

A $17 grand 4k resolution camera you can do, in spite of people everywhere saying it's impossible, but anamorphic desqueeze on the monitor, oh my god that's just asking too much...

I mean why on earth would you want to support anamorphic lenses? It's not like anyone uses these lenses any more... except, you know... Chris Nolan, Michael Bay, JJ Abrams, Stephen Soderberg, PT Anderson, Stephen Spielberg, Louis Leterrier, Francis Lawrence and Wes Anderson all shooting their latest movies on anamorphic lenses. Yeah, except for those guys, nobody uses these lenses any more.

R.
 
Jannard said:
I doubt we can do a de-squeeze on the LCD monitor path, but there are external monitors that do that.

Jim
Click to expand...

Jim,

I guess many of us would accept if the image misses every second vertical row, or gets two rows merged, or every second line simply doubled. No one expects a smooth scaler here, but a usable image for framing in 1:1.

Like we still wish for the 1:1 pixel zoom :)

Ok, you gave us a small finger and we try to catch the whole hand. Take it as "good meant suggestions" and not as "they can't get enought" (because the latter has driven us all here...).

Thank you so much, so far,

Axel
 
Jannard said:
I doubt we can do a de-squeeze on the LCD monitor path, but there are external monitors that do that.

Jim
Click to expand...

What some third-party COULD do - is make a small box - lemo in and lemo out - just enough of a board/chip to de-squeeze the anamorphic - put it between the camera and the EVF -

Yeah I know - all the graphics/meters would be distorted - but who cares - we want them gone anyway -

Put a button on the box - de-sqeeze the DVI - send it on down the path to the EVF -

I think this would sell like hot cakes - DPs/operators don't want to look at a client monitor when shooting anamorphic -

PS - AWESOME move on the 4.5K 2.40 -
 
Ruairi Robinson said:
That's not the can-do attitude I would expect from you guys.

A $17 grand 4k resolution camera you can do, in spite of people everywhere saying it's impossible, but anamorphic desqueeze on the monitor, oh my god that's just asking too much...

I mean why on earth would you want to support anamorphic lenses? It's not like anyone uses these lenses any more... except, you know... Chris Nolan, Michael Bay, JJ Abrams, Stephen Soderberg, PT Anderson, Stephen Spielberg, Louis Leterrier, Francis Lawrence and Wes Anderson all shooting their latest movies on anamorphic lenses. Yeah, except for those guys, nobody uses these lenses any more.

R.
Click to expand...

We love anamorphic... we have anamorphic settings as standard format options. But until you try to build one of these yourself, please don't scold us. When we laid out the original design we made decisions that are now limiting some of our options. We have opened up more options than anyone had ever dreamed of when they plunked down their money. But we are out of space and squeezing just about everything we can from the system. We are very comfortable that we have given you more (at N/C) and will continue to improve many things about the RED ONE that we have room for. Build 16 is a great example. But it seems like no matter what we deliver, someone wants (impatiently) more. At what point should we be a bit irritated? When your request has a solution (external monitor) and attitude creeps in. Please forgive my harsh presentation. We have been working so hard for our customers that it is a bitter pill to hear this.

BTW, neither Peter nor Steven has asked for this. They seem just fine using an external monitor.

Epic... because it is a fresh sheet of paper design, will support this feature in camera.

Jim
 
Jannard said:
We were trying to hold off talking about this until the codec errors were completely killed (we think they are with the build coming in a day or two), but there has already been some discussion about this so here you go:

The RED ONE will soon be able to shoot 4.5K, 2.40:1 at 30fps. Expect to see this very soon.

Jim
Click to expand...

Jim Incredible news.....
Can you say what we might be able to record to RED Drive, Red Flash or both ?

Will RED be releasing an additional Redcode ?
 
cinepost35 said:
Jim Incredible news.....
Can you say what we might be able to record to RED Drive, Red Flash or both ?

Will RED be releasing an additional Redcode ?
Click to expand...

We will release a list of what can be recorded to what... and we are looking closely to see if we can coax a bit more data out of the system, but no promises. There are many obstacles to doing this and we are currently very close to the edge.

Jim
 
Jannard said:
We love anamorphic... we have anamorphic settings as standard format options. But until you try to build one of these yourself, please don't scold us. When we laid out the original design we made decisions that are now limiting some of our options. We have opened up more options than anyone had ever dreamed of when they plunked down their money. But we are out of space and squeezing just about everything we can from the system. We are very comfortable that we have given you more (at N/C) and will continue to improve many things about the RED ONE that we have room for. Build 16 is a great example. But it seems like no matter what we deliver, someone wants (impatiently) more. At what point should we be a bit irritated? When your request has a solution (external monitor) and attitude creeps in. Please forgive my harsh presentation. We have been working so hard for our customers that it is a bitter pill to hear this.

Jim
Click to expand...

Just keeping the pressure on dude, don't take it so hard. You have said yourself a billion times that the camera is a work in progress, so why act defensively when people treat it as such?

If people don't keep harassing you for this stuff, then it'll fall by the wayside. I've mentioned this stuff about a trillion times here, and been ignored every time. At least I got a reaction this time :)

I've spent the last ten years harassing people to support anamorphic lenses better in various things... back in my CG post production days, I got the programmers to give us anamorphic bokeh in VRAY, and Arnold (the renderer that was adapted to use in Monster House) among other things... and it took a lot of harassing to get them to do it. Kind of like the letter writing campaign in The Shawshank redemption.

So why should I stop now?

Put it this way: would you object to incorporating this feature if it were possible? Don't you agree that it would be useful? So why be defensive if people, you know, ask for it... It's not like it would hurt you or your camera to incorporate these suggestions...

Best,
R.
 
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