Sun Time Lapse

[Samuel Haskell]

I am trying to shoot a time lapse on the epic of the sun rising and going across the sky until about noon.

What filters should I get/ what do I need to protect my camera/sensor.

Also, what frame rate should I shoot at to get the smoothest image, what RC should I shoot at?

Thank you

 

[Christopher Barrett]

This time of year that scene will take about 5 hours (in Chicago, where I am). How long do you want the clip to last? Let's use 5 seconds as an example...

5(seconds) * 24 (fps playback) = 120 frames
5 (hours of scene) = 300 minutes
300 / 120 = 2.5 ... shoot a frame every 2 and a half minutes. You could also just shoot more and adjust the clip speed later to your liking.

Plug in your own sun duration and you should be good.

Filters? ND for sure. HDRx to boot for DR.

My Too Sense...

 

[Pawel Achtel]

25 seconds at 24 fps is 600 frames; shot over 5 hours gives you one frame every 30 seconds. So, you will need about 12 - 14 stop ND when shooting at ISO 320, depending on your f stop and shutter.

 

[Liam Hall]

25 seconds at 24 fps is 600 frames; shot over 5 hours gives you one frame every 30 seconds. So, you will need about 12 - 14 stop ND when shooting at ISO 320, depending on your f stop and shutter.

That won't work. If he's shooting from dawn to noon, he's in a wide shot. 14 stops of ND will end in extreme underexposure of everything except the glowing orb. HDR is his only hope. Do an exposure test the day before at noon - depending on the weather, that should be the brightest part of the day.

 

[Radim Schreiber]

I believe the biggest issue you will have is change in exposure from day to night, more than 8 stops. How do you control exposure so you achieve smooth transition? You may choose to let the sunset go very dark, but that may not be very pleasing to the eye.

 

[Christopher Barrett]

This is why I always use my 5d2 for Timelapse... Set it up with aperture priority auto exposure and leave it alone while I'm shooting motion elsewhere with my Reds.

 

[Pawel Achtel]

That won't work. If he's shooting from dawn to noon, he's in a wide shot. 14 stops of ND will end in extreme underexposure of everything except the glowing orb. HDR is his only hope. Do an exposure test the day before at noon - depending on the weather, that should be the brightest part of the day.

Why not? I routinely shoot 2s shutter with 10 stop ND at f/8. If you shoot 15-30s shutter, your ND would need to be around 14. Example:

http://vimeo.com/29347608

 

[Pawel Achtel]

If you normally shoot 24fps with a 4 stop ND, when you slow down to 1 frame every 30 seconds, your exposure goes up by about 1000 times, which is about 10 stops. Thus, 10+4=14 stops ND.

 

[Christopher Barrett]

If you normally shoot 24fps with a 4 stop ND, when you slow down to 1 frame every 30 seconds, your exposure goes up by about 1000 times, which is about 10 stops. Thus, 10+4=14 stops ND.

Not sure what you mean by that.... there's no reason you couldn't shoot at 1/48th (for example) regardless of the interval. Your shutter speed does not have to be relative to your FPS.

 

[Pawel Achtel]

Not sure what you mean by that.... there's no reason you couldn't shoot at 1/48th (for example) regardless of the interval. Your shutter speed does not have to be relative to your FPS.

Sure, if you don't mind jerky footage and lack of motion blur.

 

[Jim Hoffman]

What about sensor issues from facing your camera into the direct sun ?

 

[Graeme Hay]

Er... your going to burn out the sensor or lens if you try to do this with an ND filter...

The sun's light is intense and normal camera or telescopic equipment isn't designed to be pointing right at it for long periods of time.

Baader Film or Thousand Oaks Filter are the solar filters you will need to use.

http://www.flickr.com/photos/gkhay/6011756934/

But at Sun Rise or Sun Set you will see nothing though these filters, because the sun's energy (light) is so much lower due to diffraction of the atmosphere.

You may also want to look at an equatorial mount which if properly set-up will track the sun for you.

 

[Samuel Haskell]

25 seconds at 24 fps is 600 frames; shot over 5 hours gives you one frame every 30 seconds. So, you will need about 12 - 14 stop ND when shooting at ISO 320, depending on your f stop and shutter.

What would an optimum histogram's features look like for this type of time lapse, with regard to ISO and f-stop.

Thank you all so much for giving me your feedback. This is great.

 

[Samuel Haskell]

depending on your f stop and shutter.

what f stop were you shooting at in that vimeo clip, that look beyond spectacular.

Thanks

 

[Pawel Achtel]

what f stop were you shooting at in that vimeo clip, that look beyond spectacular.

Thanks

thanks for the compliment, it was about f/7, ISO 400

 

[Liam Hall]

Why not? I routinely shoot 2s shutter with 10 stop ND at f/8. If you shoot 15-30s shutter, your ND would need to be around 14. Example:

http://vimeo.com/29347608

Fair enough, you did say dependent on shutter. How is the infrared contamination on the Epic with 10 stops of ND?

 

[Pawel Achtel]

Fair enough, you did say dependent on shutter. How is the infrared contamination on the Epic with 10 stops of ND?

I used 5D II, but I don't think it is any different than the Epic as far as IR is concearned. I use a special ND filter that does not contaminate the image with IR as much as most other ND filters do. It is hard to find a heavy ND filter with reasonably flat transmission across the spectrum. Most dyes are transparent to IR.

Also, it helps if your lens can focus IR on the same plane as the visible spectrum - most lenses don't.

 

[Radim Schreiber]

the scene becomes very dark around 25 seconds. If the iris was adjusted properly, we could see more detail.... but question is how to do it smoothly over this period of time?

Why not? I routinely shoot 2s shutter with 10 stop ND at f/8. If you shoot 15-30s shutter, your ND would need to be around 14. Example:

http://vimeo.com/29347608

 

[Pawel Achtel]

the scene becomes very dark around 25 seconds. If the iris was adjusted properly, we could see more detail.... but question is how to do it smoothly over this period of time?

Racking aperture has several challanges: it has to be done with a servo, it has to be very slow, you don't know when to start racking as the brightness drops in a non-linear, sudden and unpredictable way...and, you may run out of stops anyway: the difference between day and night is more than 10 stops. I look forward to HDRx and time lapse features in the Epic

 

[Thomas Pohl]

Probably an EOS is a better choice for timelapse. For day to night shots I use the the AV Mode and afterwards a Deflicker Plug In in After FX ( that's sometimes necessary). And if the sensor is treated to hard by the sun a repair (or a new camera) is much cheaper than with my RED.
By the way: The RAW-Import-Mode in After FX gives you a great variety of parameters how to interpretate your RAW-Footage. Quite comparable to Redcine X.

Cheers
Thomas.