Welcome to our community

Be a part of something great, join today!

Log in
  • Hey all, just changed over the backend after 15 years I figured time to give it a bit of an update, its probably gonna be a bit weird for most of you and i am sure there is a few bugs to work out but it should kinda work the same as before... hopefully :)

SLR Magic APO HyperPrime mini review

Thanks Paul.

I was just curious because "true Cinema" lenses tend to have a large front element while lenses that are rehoused still lenses tend to have a front element that is much smaller than the housing. But here, with the two lenses pictured above, the lens that is a re-worked stills lens has the larger front element and the lens that from inception was a cine lens has the smallish front element and the "rehoused" look to it.

Seeing the two side my side, it is interesting that the typeface for the "50mm" and T-stop labeling is quite similar if not the same. Makes me wonder if in their development of the Sigma Cine line Sigma was studying Andrew's work.
 
I have no idea about lens optics designing, but it seems the trend is towards larger front elements for whatever reason that may be.

I would *guess* that it's because one of them has a larger projected image circle than the other ? Aren't the Sigma's designed for 135 format and the SLR Magic doesn't have that restriction ?

(and yes I said restriction because of the strange ideology that 135 is the best image circle even when you're not using a 135 format sensor)

JB
 
I think its lens design. The middle portion of the glass is 'better' quality than the outer part. Thats why you get a 'better' image when you stop down the aperture. Also for the APO's they are exactly the same weight and lenght. Putting a larger element could also mean a way to balance it ..
 
krzysztof jankowski said:
What do you mean by "thicker mount" ? The EF mount flange distance is 44mm and can't be less or more. Thinner adapter will not work properly if the camera flange distance is correct.
Click to expand...

The original Ursa mini 4.6k EF, seems to have a slightly thicker EF mount. PL mounts on cams can be shimmed, EF is supposed to be exact across the board. But its not. The new adapter is working for me now.
 
Jeroen Alexander Damen said:
I think its lens design. The middle portion of the glass is 'better' quality than the outer part. Thats why you get a 'better' image when you stop down the aperture. Also for the APO's they are exactly the same weight and lenght. Putting a larger element could also mean a way to balance it ..
Click to expand...


Being as the "middle" of the image of the image circle of a lens is typically of better quality than the edges, does that mean that the image produced by a "FF" lens onto a s35 sensor is of better optical quality than the image produced by that same lens onto a FF sensor? In other words, the lens is overshooting the s35 sensor and as a result the s35 sensor is only getting the better part of the image ( the middler part ). Whereas on the FF sensor the crappier parts of the image circle are hitting the sensor and being used in the image. And if true, in that, s35 sensors only used the sweet-spot of a FF lens...while sensors larger than s35 more include the poorer performance of any FF lens? If so, does that mean that a LF lens is going to produce a better image on FF than does a FF lens since, again, the overshooting of the LF image circle means that the FF sensor is only taking in the sweeter part of the image produced by the lens and not taking in the softer edges of the image circle?

For the best image quality, always use a lens for which the image circle significantly overshoots the sensor of the camera you are using?


Jeroen Alexander Damen said:
the APO's they are exactly the same weight and lenght. Putting a larger element could also mean a way to balance it
Click to expand...
For the record, the SLR APO 50mm has a smaller front element than the Sigma Cine 50mmm, not larger. I doubt that any lens maker would have weight consistency dictate optical elements when consistency of weight throughout the set is easily achieved by way of the design of the housings. Or in other words, you wouldn't sacrifice optical quality just to attain consistency with the weight of the set. If the better optical design increases weight you could just add weight to the other lenses in the set rather than give up the better optical design for sake of cutting weight to match the lighter lenses in the set.
 
John David Pope said:
Being as the "middle" of the image of the image circle of a lens is typically of better quality than the edges, does that mean that the image produced by a "FF" lens onto a s35 sensor is of better optical quality than the image produced by that same lens onto a FF sensor?
Click to expand...

I don't believe this has anything to do with IQ. This seems to be a common misnomer.

Look at this review of the Veydra MFT format lenses where they SPANK the Zeiss CP's (no slouch of a lens in terms of sharpness)

"If you’re a CP.2 fan, you’re going to have to talk about the look of the lenses, or how they handle, or something similar to explain why you like them. Because, to be quite blunt, the Veydras just kick some serious resolution butt in this comparison."

https://www.lensrentals.com/blog/2018/01/finally-some-m43-mtf-testing-25mm-prime-lens-comparison/

They specifically compare the CP's at the same image circle to make it fair.

Then look at this.
https://www.lensrentals.com/blog/2018/03/veydra-cine-mini-prime-mtf-optical-bench-tests/

When comparing a nantive MFT mount 25mm 1.2 Olympus PRO lens...

"This is actually very good for an f/1.2 lens, much better than the Canon 50mm f/1.2, for example. It maintains excellent sharpness in the center half of the image. It’s still quite sharp, although with some astigmatism, out to the edge"

MFT as a mount was conceived to make it easier to design for more telecentic lens designs. It was designed for digital sensors. 135 format is really a legacy format that was originally designed for film cameras.

When a native MFT lens is on a MFT sensor, you generally are going to get a better result as shown above. The lens benefits form being used on the image circle is was designed for.

JB
 
Just got the 85mm apo. looking forward to comparing it to the 50mm apo, as well as the 80mm summilux.

Worth noting - my 85 came with the black shroud piece.

Also - have others with the 85 noticed that it is a bit difficult screwing in 82mm filters to the front of the lens? Mine fit, but are a bit finicky to start screwing in
 
Anyone have an idea as to when the ef mount versions are dropping?
 
Drew Thomas said:
Anyone have an idea as to when the ef mount versions are dropping?
Click to expand...

The EF mounts are just the PL mounts with an adaptor on. Something you can do right now (I have). SLR Magic have a new lower cost adapter they are offering though, and i don't know when, could be by end of this month.

cheers
Paul
 
Drew Thomas said:
Anyone have an idea as to when the ef mount versions are dropping?
Click to expand...

This is the reply from SLR magic

"Thank you for your email enquiry.

The EF version comes with removable EF aluminum mount,

Delivery will start around June if you order from our resellers.
If you order directly from us and get into the waiting list now, delivery
will be second half of May.

Price:
SLR Magic APO HyperPrime CINE 25mm T2.1 lens in aluminum EF mount - US$2,599.00
SLR Magic APO HyperPrime CINE 32mm T2.1 lens in aluminum EF mount - US$2,599.00
SLR Magic APO HyperPrime CINE 50mm T2.1 lens in aluminum EF mount - US$2,099.00
SLR Magic APO HyperPrime CINE 85mm T2.1 lens in aluminum EF mount - US$2,599.00

If you buy the whole set of 4 APO lenses with case, the price is US$9,500.00
excluding import duty/tax charged by your country.

Courier cost: US$ 60.00/lens, and US$50.00 for each additional lens
If you order 4 lenses with case, courier cost is US$230.00 "
 
ill share some stuff shortly shot with these
 
I decided to make a short review/ making-off of a job i did last week with the APO's. I am making it also for SLR Magic to use. It might give a little more info about working with the lenses and what i like about them .. Im in no way a Hollywood DP, but im unique in my own right i guess, since i create TV commercials from 'script' to 'grade'.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=frAYkc7tHIE

Hope you guys like it ..
 
Last edited:
John David Pope said:
Being as the "middle" of the image of the image circle of a lens is typically of better quality than the edges, does that mean that the image produced by a "FF" lens onto a s35 sensor is of better optical quality than the image produced by that same lens onto a FF sensor? In other words, the lens is overshooting the s35 sensor and as a result the s35 sensor is only getting the better part of the image ( the middler part ). Whereas on the FF sensor the crappier parts of the image circle are hitting the sensor and being used in the image. And if true, in that, s35 sensors only used the sweet-spot of a FF lens...while sensors larger than s35 more include the poorer performance of any FF lens? If so, does that mean that a LF lens is going to produce a better image on FF than does a FF lens since, again, the overshooting of the LF image circle means that the FF sensor is only taking in the sweeter part of the image produced by the lens and not taking in the softer edges of the image circle?

For the best image quality, always use a lens for which the image circle significantly overshoots the sensor of the camera you are using?


For the record, the SLR APO 50mm has a smaller front element than the Sigma Cine 50mmm, not larger. I doubt that any lens maker would have weight consistency dictate optical elements when consistency of weight throughout the set is easily achieved by way of the design of the housings. Or in other words, you wouldn't sacrifice optical quality just to attain consistency with the weight of the set. If the better optical design increases weight you could just add weight to the other lenses in the set rather than give up the better optical design for sake of cutting weight to match the lighter lenses in the set.
Click to expand...

Hi John. I can recall Andrew of SLR magic saying in a interview, that the APO's work on FF, but are designed really for S35. i agree with you, that it is the intended design that usually guarantees the best results. But i also know that the smaller the lens, the harder to get the same equivalent resolution. The bigger the lens, the more likely you will get 'mistakes' like falloff and vignetting. Im sure there is a sweet-spot technically for everything, right?
Many things go into consideration in lens design. But mostly i think filmmakers, and artists alike, are willing to trow all technical specs overboard, when the look or feeling is whats desired. Therefore, i can see lens manufacturers, like slr magic who are mixing optical formulas with several pieces of glass, do the same. I know it took Andrew quite some time to find the right organic sharpness.

The sigma 50mm is one stop faster. So meaning the front element is like 2x bigger to start with i think. So maybe relatively the APO 50mm might be bigger .. not sure here. Weather weight gets achieved with glas or metal i dont know, but since optical glas is precious, i think you're right
 
I scanned through this whole thing pretty quick cause I wanna try em. Did I scan over Phil or Matt somewhere? What did they say? I don’t do anything crazy until those guys say so. Phil...Phil...
 
I think Andrew and team are at cinegear along with everyone else, so maybe Phil etc will get to talk and see the APOs if he hasn't already. I'm scanning the interwebs for updates!

I'm not aware of a full frame vs S35 design mandate. The APOs work fine on my A7sII as well, even the 25. I do believe a conversation or discussion was had on whether a wider lens should have less image circle or be slower but that was a long time ago and goals change. There was a good thread on the BMD forum but i think this thread is a bit more up to date. I'm pretty sure going forward it would be for a full frame image circle but i'm not the authority by a long way.

cheers
Paul
 
Here's Andrew at Fujinon stand talking about new Anamorphot adapter:

 
Last edited:
any news when the 32mm is ready to order in a set and in europe?
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top