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  • Hey all, just changed over the backend after 15 years I figured time to give it a bit of an update, its probably gonna be a bit weird for most of you and i am sure there is a few bugs to work out but it should kinda work the same as before... hopefully :)

Schneider XENON FF vs Canon CN-E

Matt Ryan said:
yup ;)

So tell me CA doesn't bother you? lol
I hate CA with a passion, and the fringing... It sticks out like a sore thumb in a piece with higher end lenses.
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WTH? Who graded this? It would have been so easy to fix that CA in post!
 
Bob Gundu said:
WTH? Who graded this? It would have been so easy to fix that CA in post!
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I've been on a lot of jobs where they don't fix it... unfortunately
 
I shot detailed tests with the Canon CNE, the new Zeiss Super Speeds lenses benchmarked against Ultraprimes with the ACS Tech Committee. The Canon CNE lenses performed very well and on CA and sharpness and they performed better by a nose than the Zeiss Super Speeds and of course there is no wide fast Zeiss Super Speed. One issue here when comparing lenses is there is an inherent limitation in that the lenses have manufacturing variations and this budget sets probably have more variation than top of the line sets of glass. In a perfect world you would need to test multiple sets and work on averages BUT that is a lot of work. All of the lenses we have discussed should give you awesome results.
When you do decide on a set buy them on the caveat that you want a right of rejection on any lens that does not reach your standard. Test them to whatever standard that makes you happy.
 
To be perfectly honest. All three of these lens sets experience Chromatic Aberrations. In fact all lenses do. How much they "wrangle it" is another story. There's a lot at play here in terms of the elements design, the glass itself, and coatings.

I'm with Tom in terms of the concept of all of these series being very good, especially considering the price versus the alternatives.

The odd duck for me is the Zeiss CP.2 50mm T1.5. Which is interesting because this mimics my experience with the 50mm T1.3 Master Prime. However, Zeiss is getting "Otus with it" these days and solving some of these things. One day a few years from now there will be a set of those that I'll likely purchase. Also, they are just killing it with the Compact Zooms. Those things are a joy and a tremendous accomplishment from an optical engineering perspective.

The one thing I've learned from rental houses and DPs over the years is they prefer to have lenses that exhibit a unique character one way or another. And if you talk to anybody who has shot through a few tubes of glass they certainly can tell you want the prefer. Some like the Zeiss Master Primes and Ultra Primes for their "clinical" merits. Some find that far too boring. Recently we saw Shane Hurlbut choose the Cooke S4s over the Leica Summilux-C Primes due to the "depth" created by curvature of field, which is part of the Cooke Look. I know other folks who would feel the opposite. And I also know folks who choose lenses based on projects and base their selection by how they want to render the story.

My personal preference in lenses is inspired by their technical and artistic merit. I'm real picky about certain things for motion work. Mechanics, weight, breathing, draw, image shift, flare, contrast, even field illumination, field distortion, field resolution, chromatic and optical aberrations. All of it. It's always best to test any set of glass before a purchase of this size. Lenses can be a life long investment. My kit has been growing over the last 15 years and it seems more and more glass is showing up. I'm good with that. I'm a lens nut. This lust has only been fed more by the last couple years being around a lot of quality glass. But I do use all of the glass I have acquired and rent when necessary. Usually for their strengths or uniqueness. Which is also what has influenced the glass I own.

The real question is what do you enjoy using and how do you want it to look.
 
I did pretty thorough testing on these lenses before making my decision to buy the Xenons. What I like most about the Xenons is their organic feel and creamy bokeh. It's very gradual, rich and has a character that I responded to more than the CNE's or the Zeiss. I wanted a lens set with a bit of character and so far my clients have responded enthusiastically to the look. It seems to be somewhere between the Cooke and the older Zeiss looks.

While there is some CA in a testing environment (I've had them on several lens projectors), I haven't found it to be a huge issue on projects thus far. But, I know that I tend to stop most lenses down at least a stop from WO to get toward their sweet spot and these are no exception. From 2.8 on they're pretty clean.

The 100mm is on order and for the interim I have the GL Optics 18-35 1.8 (300º focus) to cover the wide end. Intercutting the the GL and the Xenons has been pretty seamless.

Here's a GLOCK spot that I did on my Epic-M (@5k) with the Xenons, GL 18-35 and a Fujinon Cabrio 19-90. All of the lenses balanced fine in Davinci. This spot will be on a variety of cable networks (FX, SyFy) and the outdoor/sporting networks, and there will be a :90 second extended online version released next week.

http://vimeo.com/92949149

For the curious:
Schneider Xenon - All frontal shots (through windshield) and close-ups in cab, all steadicam (including front driving shots).
GL 18-35 - Interior profiles on cabbie, passenger
Cabrio - Jib of cab traveling

Anyway, I hope this is helpful.

- HAL
 
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Phil Holland said:
Nice looking spot Hal!
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For sure it's nice looking. But totally crazy content there.

The thief is a full-on "Dockers Dad" wearing an open shirt and blazer
and when he says "hand-it over pal"...well it's kind of bizarre.
Don't think I've ever seen a handgun ad on television..ever.
Is this Glock spot really going to air on SyFy and FX
 
Steve Das said:
For sure it's nice looking. But totally crazy content there.
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Not that bizarre. With the popularity of shows like Top Shot with serious target shooters competing for "top dog" and some cash it's become rather popular these days. Lot's of other gun related things can be found outside of the major cable channels.

This particular spot is more or less flexing the muscle of what Glock is about and it's been used in Law Enforcement for a long while. So not totally out of bounds.
 
Steve Das said:
For sure it's nice looking. But totally crazy content there.

Don't think I've ever seen a handgun ad on television..ever.
Is this Glock spot really going to air on SyFy and FX
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Steve, I understand your surprise, but Glock's been advertising on cable since I started shooting spots for them four years ago. Mostly sports, hunting networks and web until recently, but they are playing on a wider range of networks this year.

I shared the spot to hopefully add to the lens discussion. I hope the content isn't a distraction. :)

H
 
Thank you all for your advices ! This forum is really a cool place to get help.

Today I saw the rushs of a music video a friend just shot (EPIC + CANON CN-E) and I was really impressed by the image straight from the camera !
But there are really nice shots too in Hal's spot.
I guess it is just a matter of taste...

I am not sure if the EF mount would be a problem with lenses that big ?
 
It is like buying Ferrari with average 2L engine inside.
What's the point of buying nicely designed and built lenses if optics inside is average. Makes more sense to rent and get Otus one year later, or just get by with Zeiss ZF for a while or get rehoused Leicas.
It will be funny if people using Sigma ART $1,000 lenses will be doing circles around Schneiders.....
 
I've been shooting with the Xenons and I'm very happy with what I'm getting. Jiri, have you shot with them? I own ZF's and yet I prefer the creaminess of the Schneiders. Zeiss is a long way off from a full Otus set, and further from cinema versions... when those come, let's compare prices. Haven't shot the Sigma, so I don't have an opinion there, but when they have a set of 5 cinema lenses I'll gladly give them a try.
 
Tim Morten said:
I've been shooting with the Xenons and I'm very happy with what I'm getting. Jiri, have you shot with them? I own ZF's and yet I prefer the creaminess of the Schneiders. Zeiss is a long way off from a full Otus set, and further from cinema versions... when those come, let's compare prices. Haven't shot the Sigma, so I don't have an opinion there, but when they have a set of 5 cinema lenses I'll gladly give them a try.
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Hi Tim,
i had them in my hands and could not test them. They look great but from what i have seen on "ipad", i am not impressed with thei sharpness and CA. Otus on other hand with Nikon Iris is far more interesting piece glass for me. I know they do not have a set yet but surely it is the one to have next 2 years. Anyway all the best.
regards jiri
 
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