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  • Hey all, just changed over the backend after 15 years I figured time to give it a bit of an update, its probably gonna be a bit weird for most of you and i am sure there is a few bugs to work out but it should kinda work the same as before... hopefully :)

Scarlet-W or Weapon Magnesium?

Brody_B

Brody_B

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So I have a deposit on the Scarlet-W, waiting for allocation still, but I got to thinking I might want to go Weapon Magnesium instead. Is there less value per dollar when buying the 3x more expensive Weapon mag over the S-W? What does the Weapon mag do better than The Scarlet-W, Better Low light? Much Better image? Can you really notice the better compression ratios?
Basically, is $20k more really worth the upgrade?

I am aware of the spec differences, 6k sensor size, etc. but would like to hear from folks with real world experiences.

Any advice is appreciated!
 
We shoot 6K and 5K Dragon every week.

For me, the 6K upgrade over 5K is certainly worth it, for numerous reasons.

6K not only looks better, but the FOV of the larger 6K sensor is superb. On interviews, it helps us get in closer with longer lenses in smaller rooms, which I love.

Lower compression and better highspeed at 5K are also a plus!
 
Nick Morrison said:
We shoot 6K and 5K Dragon every week.

For me, the 6K upgrade over 5K is certainly worth it, for numerous reasons.

6K not only looks better, but the FOV of the larger 6K sensor is superb. On interviews, it helps us get in closer with longer lenses in smaller rooms, which I love.

Lower compression and better highspeed at 5K are also a plus!
Click to expand...

Awesome, Thanks for that input.

+1 Weapon mag.

Anyone else?
 
Hey Brody, I think it would depend on the things you shoot. While I love 6k, andacknowledge that is superior over 5k, the majority of things I shoot do not demand it - 5k gets the job done to an incredibly high standard. The only downside to it is the crop, which is small.

I would suggest having a think about the jobs you're shooting, and particularly how the workflow is handled. In my experience, the data rates and hardware demands to get 6k running smoothly is a bit scary for some.
 
This is oddly a tougher decision than you might think mostly due to Scarlet-W's rather disruptive price point and overall features.

Weapon MG gets you more frame rate options, 5.5K & 6K resolutions, and more image plane height if shooting anamorphic. I personally like the larger 6K format for lots of things and just shot something at 5K 96fps on Weapon Forged. Almost can't live without that now. But that's my unique usage case. If you can afford Weapon MG and see some of the benefits of those features it would likely be worth it.
 
I've been using my Scarlet-W and haven't missed my epic dragon. On paper I didn't love the new system but after using it the weight and prores became real game changers for me and it's now hard to go back to using my dragon.

Ive had this debate for a while about upgrading my dragon to a magnesium. I love having 6k and the higher frame rates but it doesn't feel like it gives me much more than the scarlet for the price. I don't get more prores frame rate or resolution. I don't save weight. I dont get more LUT. It's really just 6k, compression and frame rate and I have no complaints with the results I'm getting on the Scarlet-W compared to 6k on my dragon.

If I were starting from scratch with no skin in the game I would go scarlet-w and never look back. My problem is that the scarlet-w seems to have made my resale value worthless on my dragon. I almost think I could do better selling my scarlet-w and upgrading my dragon

The big engineering question I want to know is if the different boards change the image quality at all. The carbon weapon has extra power to handle 8k so does that mean it trickles down to help the 6k? Is the magnesium image any different? Or is the Scarlet-W any different? I know these differences would be marginal but I'm very curious. Like when you use a 1D instead of a 5D and see a different kind of creaminess to the image even though the resolution and compression is the same.

Also, if anyone wants a great dragon package for 20k send them my way....
 
Scarlet weapon bang for buck is the clear dollar per pixel winner in the Red line up.
I personally won't go magnesium weapon because the specs are down on the carbon, if your going to go to weapon. Go the whole hog.
Scarlet weapon is by far the giant killer in the math specs dollars equation.

If your looking for the best deal of all. Watch out for all the Second hand Epic Dragon bodies over the next 12 months.
Second hand Epic Drahons are by far the clear winners. Especially when RED drop the price of Epic Dragons ( not confirmed ) thry are collecting hundreds golf them as trades. They ain't going to chuck them in the bin are they.

I'm still so happy with the performance of my bunch Epic Dragons. I'm still not needing to rush out and purchase a Weapon as yet.
Not until I see a real reason to jump up.
Weapons are better cameras, no doupt. But image wise Epic Dragon still over delivers from my stand point.
 
i havent noticed any difference between magnum and woven (faster cpu), when shooting 6k 24p ... if that helps. my "feeling" is weapon 5k is about equivalent to epic dragon 6k, but i loose a lot of height(vertical field of view) for anamorphics on 6k vs 5k. so if i was shooting a lot of anamorphic the 6k is better, for spherical it doesnt matter as much.
 
Agreed, the Scarlet W is a tremendous value proposition. Smaller data footprint, more 35 cine lens coverage without loss in the corners.
 
I would think it be great to start with the Scarlet W first and have a good sense of feel with it. If you like to upgrade it in the future to a weapon, it will be possible anyways!
 
Just to complicate things further:) I think with the growing interest in the 4.6K Ursa at such a low price point I would wonder when the Scarlet W and Ursa tests start and that having the scale and reach of 6K in the MG becomes more of a point of distinction at the lower entry point which is getting ever more competitive beyond whatever we say here in this corner of the world. That area of the market is going to get very crowded and rife with passionate opinion. I can already feel a level of shall we say 'smug' among the Ursa 4.6 camp that they have a killer camera close to Alexa look for under 5 grand. People are shooting tests showing it to be equal or superior to the old Dragon. Not me, so don't yell at me:) Just look at the threads.

I can't agree entirely with the go whole hog with Carbon argument either if you are needing to be mindful of cash-flow. The extra money for me buys limited extras over MG, and other than the 8K which is interesting but again things will come and things will change, the future is most likely a new sensor as Red readily admits. So unless you are raking in the money, on big jobs etc... The MG could be the most affordable Red offering that sets you just a notch above the camera wars that are building. Not to say the Scarlet is a slouch by any means. It is not. But it's spec puts it in a fight directly with other offerings.
 
if you arent in the rental business and just shooting your own projects then the scarlet-w is the best buy for the buck. maybe even the raven you dont want to invest in PL glass.
if you ever want to make your money back, or if you even care about renting it out at all, or need a big name camera to get a job, then the weapon is the only option.
i already see scarlet-w's renting out for basically pennies a day, never mind epic dragons for the same price.
too bad they kept the scarlet name because producers know this as the low budget free camera, i often see them being used for behind the scenes crews even.
 
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