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  • Hey all, just changed over the backend after 15 years I figured time to give it a bit of an update, its probably gonna be a bit weird for most of you and i am sure there is a few bugs to work out but it should kinda work the same as before... hopefully :)

RED Scarlet for ENG work?

Good points Stephen & Joseph, you would have hoped they started down this road a long time ago (Instant Avid Integration from the Camera). I shoot with a P2 setup for broadcast clients for that very reason, it instantly integrates with their avid suites at the end of the shoot. We swap out the 64GB cards with the producer and off we go for the next shoot.
 
Nice rig Steve!

But for me, ENG needs ND filters. There's something about an ENG camera which I really need. Don't like searching through menus for simple stuff like shutter, etc. It needs to be in an easy to reach space without taking my eyes off the VF.

But will the 2/3 interchangeable scarlet impact ENG users... Definitely I'll just use it as a good B camera, and a good excuse to dust off my 16mm lenses.
 
Thanks Chris...

Yes, filters are a hassle with a rig setup like that on RED One. The ease of switching ND filters with a filter wheel on a 2/3" camera is great. With the rigs pictured I changed screw-on ND filters quickly - the only way to do it on RED with those setups. Because I almost always use 35mm stills lenses on my REDs, without matte boxes and follow focus units, I always carry a small folding case containing screw-on ND filters, and I've become very fast at changing them out.

I believe both the 2/3" Scarlet models will have wide use in non-hardlined EFP and ENG production. That will depend on their final specifications. We'll see...
 
Nope...but I like the concept. I'll have to check it out...
 
I'm with Steve on the ENG business. Can't see TV stations handing out Scarlets to their news crews, but a sometimes stringer like myself will happen across or seek out stories to shoot and sell. Scarlet should be a handy little camera for that.
 
Just a thought for those of us thinking about Red for EFP work in the near future... perhaps a bolt on module with optical CC/ND wheels as in Digibeta/HDCAM/P2 camcorders. Maybe this could fit between the brain and the lens adapter of choice... throwing it out there. Really good to have an excuse to stop paying 60-70k for a camera body!
 
RED has confirmed their intention, subject to change, to have an internal 3-filter ND wheel on the fixed lens Scarlet. Combined with Scarlet's capability of shooting 1080p RGB (subject to change), this could help make the fixed lens Scarlet very usable in the EFP and ENG industries.

The specifications for the other Scarlet models may be finalized in RED's upcoming November 30 announcement. Epic camera specifications have not been finalized and announced as such. IMO since RED announced an internal ND filter wheel for the fixed lens Scarlet, there is a possibility that the same may be featured in other models of Scarlet (especially detachable 2/3"), and possibly some Epic models. If they figured out a way to fit a filter wheel into the fixed lens version, I see no reason why they couldn't have figured out a way to fit a filter wheel into some of their other new camera models.

Scarlet and Epic have both been positioned as modular, flexible, highly-utilitarian camera lines, usable in a wide variety of styles, industries, and genres. The combined EFP and ENG industries are by far the largest portion of the motion media industry - absolutely dwarfing the cine industry in terms of yearly production totals, number of workers, and amount of camera equipment bought. If RED wants to make a quantum leap in the amount of camera equipment, lenses, and accessories they sell, then making the new Scarlet and Epic models as EFP friendly and ENG friendly (some models) is IMO the way to do it.

Once the tech specs for all the new Scarlet and Epic camera models are finalized we'll have a clear picture on the level of usability of each model for EFP and ENG work. RED One is relatively EFP friendly, but not very ENG friendly. I expect RED's target market for certain models of Scarlet (both 2/3" models), and to a lesser degree some models of Epic (S35) to be squarely aimed at the EFP industry (along with the cine industry), and in some cases also the ENG industry.

I'm an owner of multiple RED One cameras. I mostly shoot hybrid EFP style with RED, using 35mm stills lenses exclusively, eye focusing, and screw-on filters exclusively (no MB). Me and my crews have learned to quickly change out screw-on filters, but an internal filter wheel in these new RED cameras would make our field workflow incredibly easier. If the filter wheel had a clear filter position then those who wanted to use a matte box/stage filter setup could put those accessories on the camera and shoot that way - but those who want to shoot hybrid style , EFP style, and ENG could simply and quickly use the filter wheel - we'd have both options at our finger tips.

Also, the auto and fly by wire features in the fixed lens Scarlet, posted here on RED User by RED Team since 10-30-09, bode extremely well for broad utility in mobile, fast-paced shooting environments like non-hardlined EFP and ENG :hurray:
 
Steve Davis said:
Just a thought for those of us thinking about Red for EFP work in the near future... perhaps a bolt on module with optical CC/ND wheels as in Digibeta/HDCAM/P2 camcorders. Maybe this could fit between the brain and the lens adapter of choice... throwing it out there. Really good to have an excuse to stop paying 60-70k for a camera body!
Click to expand...

I don't think you could put a filter wheel between the lens and the brain, because the lens is designed to focus at a particular distance and having the extra space in between would throw this off. You'd probably be able to compensate with the focus wheel in the middle of the range, but at either end you'd have problems.
 
RED has confirmed (subject to change) that the removable lens Epic and Scarlet cameras will have a 5-way adjustable sensor block, which is the way we'll adjust back focus. Seems to me that could also enable the use of an internal filter wheel if enough space was provided between the lens flange and the movement range of the sensor block.

B4 cameras have built-in sensor wheels, and B4 lenses have back focus adjustments just above the lens flange.

I don't think having an internal filter wheel in the new removable lens cameras is technically impossible. I just think there would be design hurdles to get over, plus there isn't a big demand for internal filter wheels coming from those who will use the cameras exclusively in cine style - they like to filter with matte box stage filters, and most of them have never used a camera with an internal filter wheel. Then again, these cameras are being positioned as fitting into whatever industry you want/need them to - stills, EFP, and cine - and the combined EFP and ENG industries are by far the largest camera equipment market in the motion media industry.

It will be interesting to see what RED did on filtering when the final specifications for the new cameras are announced.
 
focus

focus

Not sure if this a dumb question or not...but is there any way to focus besides manually with a red1 or scarlet? If you are running and gunning/eng sometimes you don't have the time to make sure your focus is perfect manually. Also, sometimes you would need an external monitor to focus really well. If you have a focus puller you have time between each shot. The work I do I don't.

I currently have an hpx170 and although I don't use full auto focus all that much, it is a handy option in certain circumstances and having a focus assist is really nice when I have a couple seconds to use it. Most of the time I"m in manual and then hit the focus button when I need if I'm in a rush and then it goes back to manual.

Question is, how do people focus quickly with a scarlet/red one?
 
Scarlet for "ENG" work?

Scarlet for "ENG" work?

As the RED ONE was not intended in any way shape or form for ENG use, that only makes sense.

I believe that the new cameras though are well suited to on-shoulder, run-and-gun type operation.
 
So the scarlet will have auto focus capabilities? No ND Filters I suppose. What about a b4 lens connection? To be able to have servo zoom is handy sometimes but not as essential as nd or auto focus.
 
Scarlet for "ENG" work?

Scarlet for "ENG" work?

So the scarlet will have auto focus capabilities? No ND Filters I suppose. What about a b4 lens connection? To be able to have servo zoom is handy sometimes but not as essential as nd or auto focus.
Click to expand...

Yes it will.

But I'm puzzled. Tell me of a professional ENG camera that has auto-focus?
 
Stuart English said:
Yes it will.

But I'm puzzled. Tell me of a professional ENG camera that has auto-focus?
Click to expand...
scarlet? :cool:

autofocus on both 2/3" models? or just on the 8x fixed?
 
It's more than just autofocus

It's more than just autofocus

Stuart English said:
Yes it will.

But I'm puzzled. Tell me of a professional ENG camera that has auto-focus?
Click to expand...

I suppose you could say the Sony PMW EX1, EX3, and the Z series and Panasonic's equivalents. They may be more cross over semipro cameras but they get used a hell of a lot in broadcast - especially ob docs where often producers, researchers or directors shoot a lot of the material these days. Really at the price point of the scarlet this is the market they are going to be touching on whether they are aiming for it or not. But you have a point about the higher end true ENG cameras, autofocus not normally present there.

I really get that what Red are offering is amazing at any price and double so because of the price, but my sense is that the cameras remain mostly targeted at the high end cinematography and film world rather than broadcast or that that is where they are coming at it from. For a film cinematographer the Scarlet will just about blow their minds.

I imagine a full scarlet rig with a zoom lens, pro IO module, battery module and shoulder rig will significantly undercut the price of a regular pro broadcast HD EFP/ENG cam like the PMW-350L by a factor of 2 or more. From what I've heard the imagery from an EX1 or EX3 is pretty close to something like the 350L and is considered acceptable for generating 100% of a programs content for broadcast by the BBC. An EX1 or EX3 is a lot closer to the scarlet in price point (especially bearing in mind you would need some extra modules in the package to get you a viewfinder, full size xlrs, genlock and a shoulder brace and on board mic). A lot of people coming to a new camera will look at it in comparison to other cameras at it's price point so invariably the scarlet gets compared to the likes of the HVX's and EX1's. At this level it's not quite so black and white. For most working in broadcast anything above 1080P isn't going to get used, certainly not by clients or in transmission anyway - so there goes a major feature of the Scarlet. If users want to shoot in Red RGB scaled 1080 mode they will presumably need to set the look in camera as it will get baked in to some degree. On the EX1 and most broadcast cameras there are numerous handy switches and controls for direct control of all the baked in settings like white balance and gain so they can be accessed quickly in breaking news type situations, so far these are not shown as being present in any form - modular or otherwise, for the Scarlet. The few programmable buttons revealed so far would not cover these as you would need them for switching between iris, focus and zoom control on the lens ring during shooting. Then there are lenses - sure you could buy a 2/3" brain, a B4 mount adapter and a broadcast zoom lens (and from Gibby's reports suffer some soft imagery due to the extra glass involved) - but the lens in the Scarlet fixed is only 8X. I know it will be a very high quality 8x with all the resolution needed to look pin sharp throughout at 3K (fatastic for filmmakers wanting to shoot 3K), but it is only 8X. Many broadcast ENG lenses, including the one packaged with the EX1 and EX3 come in at 14X and have a built in switch in 2x extender. This gives the user great flexibility in fast breaking news situations or on ob docs and reality shows. These versatile lenses usually come as part of the package with these ENG cameras too so count them in the cost. There are also many other little operational features that have slowly sprung up in these sorts of cameras that are specifically targeted at the run and gun ENG style shooter which may or may not make their way onto the scarlet (haven't seen many in the specs released so far). The most important feature for ENG use would probably be interlace mode. Despite the move to LCD and plasma screens by consumers (which are natively progressive display devices) all broadcasters that I know of broadcast interlaced material - even the few who have taken up the HD mantle (well certainly the BBC anyway). Although there may be ways around this and it may only be a perceived problem producers and others in big TV news gathering organisations will not see 1080i and may just simply discount the Scarlet for their quick turnaround production needs.

Perhaps one could shoot 1080@60p for USA or 1080@ 50P for UK and get it to playback/output in realtime from the edit as an interlaced 30 or 25 frames per second? Even so I think a lot of execs would need to see it for themselves to be convinced. 1080i as a spec in camera however and they wouldn't give it a second glance.

So to my mind if you are shooting only for broadcast news and run and gun stuff it is not so straightforward a choice as to whether to buy a Scarlet or not. Other cameras may just be slightly better suited to the job.

This has been the dilemma in my mind as I have imagined myself focusing on ob docs for the future.

The main attraction of the Scarlet for me is it's ability to excel in other forms of acquisition. If I want to shoot a drama for someone or for that matter do any other kind of work apart from ENG style then it would enable that big time. So don't get me wrong, I love the Scarlet specs I've seen so far, I love the price and am very likely to get one as my one and only camera, all of the above points have just been a sticking point in my mind due to my imagined direction in terms of the main type of scenarios I'm likely to shoot.



Disclaimer. I may have got some things wrong, above, don't take my views as being totally correct or authoritative views of an industry insider. I may come across as thinking I am, but I'm not really. I did a TV broadcasting degree some time ago where I did live multicam studio work, ENG, EFP and just about everything else then worked for a while as a one man video department for a multimedia company but haven't worked in the industry for a while so that limited experience and snippets from the net as I plan my re-entry into the field are where I get my knowledge from. I would appreciate the perspective of a seasoned pro like Gibby or someone working wholly in ENG or ob docs on my opinions expressed above.
 
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By the way Steve Gibby, thanks once again for your informative posts sharing your workflows with us on this forum. They have gone some way to allaying my fears.

Also the point about Avid workflow integration is a good one too, but I'm sure Red will be on top of that, they are nearly there already and that's with 4K R3D's!.
 
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