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  • Hey all, just changed over the backend after 15 years I figured time to give it a bit of an update, its probably gonna be a bit weird for most of you and i am sure there is a few bugs to work out but it should kinda work the same as before... hopefully :)

RED One Mission Statement...

I talked to Ted about this and he said there will be a Red One sensor upgrade available at the same time as Epic
 
I think a lot of people are still conditioned in the ways of thinking by Sony and Panasonic and the such. Just because a bigger better more expensive product comes along, doesn't mean your existing product is obsolete. People are just going to have to understand that with RED. Especially not when your product is indeed upgradable.

Go out there and make images, tell stories, help others who pay you tell stories, whatever. RED ONE shoots 4k (for 17.5k) and its more than 95% of everyone here can handle.
 
i don't think many people are realizing, "epic" is a different camera all together.
 
Ince the Mysterium X can be spun into 2/3 and S35 formats, im sure they can create a RED ONE compatible version too...unless they had a brilliant breakthrough in i/o aswell.

Since they are releasing the SDK and a firmware build that finally fulfills the camera's potential (that's the gist of what I got from Jim's comments) It's possible that they are releasing the camera "into the wild." Where third parties will evolve the camera in terms of software and possibly even hardware in the future, while RED concentrates their efforts on routing the old boys' counter efforts against the RED ONE with EPIC and SCARLET.

The very fact that RED RAY records 4K should be a clue that they are not abandoning the RED ONE.
 
absolutely - red is not sony - I doubt they're going to bury the Red one, or lock it out of upgrades just because it now has a bigger brother. That said, you can't expect every upgrade on the Epic to make it to Red One as i imagine they'll be two different platforms.

having worked with the red one a lot, i've already developed quite a fondness for it, and would be sad to see it become obsolete.

The continued firmware development has shown that the RED one's platform is flexible and base on which to build- I'd like to think given the RED mission statement that the full $17,500 rebate toward epic does not indicate the red one will die, but rather to ensure that current red owners/those on the waiting list feel they have not been locked out of any future developments, and have a real choice going forward.

parallel to this, i hope we'll see all three existing cameras continue to develop and be upgraded.
 
I think its just a very very generous offer that Red have thrown in here. Sooner or later they are bound to release a camera thats "better" than the Red One. It just come soo much sooner than anyone expected. I don´t think Red will ditch the Red One just because they done a tremendous work getting a new camera ready in only a year from now.

If Epic costs around $40,000 I then can choose to upgrade in my own pace, getting a full $17,500 trade-in for a great camera that I will be able to use atleast a year before Epic arrives (Name another company that would have done the same thing?). Aint that the coolest shit?

Or if I choose to keep my Red, and replace it with a newer sensor later on thats super too. I feel that Red stands true to their mission more than ever.
 
ok c'mon guys CALM DOWN PLEASE!

Think about what the RED ONE IS..not hat it IS NOT....consider yourself lucky that Jim even made it.
 
I think we all have to look at Epic as the rental house version of Red. It will cost much much more than the Red One, have industry-standard connectors, support higher data rates and RGB, and just be more 'finished', bulletproof and idiot-proof. It won't be the kind of camera an average to midrange shooter will buy for themselves - it will be something you rent like an Arri 535 or a Viper.

I don't think anyone should regret owning a Red One, just like no one regrets owning an Arri 3. Epic is the top of line feature camera and will be priced to match. It will be marginally better than Red One for high-end 5K end-to-end workflows, but I believe Epic is meant more as Red's answer to the D21's and Dalsa's of the world.

I think we can all agree that certain hoped-for features have taxed the processing power of the Red One to its max. How much more can we expect out of a $18000 camera? I'm expecting the Epic will allow every possible output on every port. One set of framelines for the operator and another for the director while the AC watches a 1:1 zoomed, focus enhanced image. Scaled modes where any portion of the sensor can be used for any resolution. Higher frame rates and lower compression. Interface with third party decks and recording systems.

In short, Red has announced a big brother for the Red One. It takes nothing away from the awesomeness of Red One, it's just bringing the Red revolution to the big guys.
 
Shawn Nelson said:
I talked to Ted about this and he said there will be a Red One sensor upgrade available at the same time as Epic
Click to expand...

....And I feel a lot better now. That's really all I needed to know.

Actually when I first saw the Epic I thought I thought, "Wow, this must be their '70mm' camera"(I didn't really think they'd have a 70mm sensor, but you get the picture), then I saw '5k' and I thought oh no it's replacing the Red. But maybe it really is their '70mm' camera vs. the '35mm' Red One.
 
Simple fact people always want the latest and greatest!
 
car3o said:
i don't think many people are realizing, "epic" is a different camera all together.
Click to expand...

No, that's exactly the problem.

A lot of people bought into the ideal that RED ONE was a new camera system designed by with the specific intent to stay up to date and top of the line over time at a considerably lower pricepoint than usual. Now RED's first major announcement in image improvement/resolution comes in the form of an entirely new camera that's over twice the cost? It's puzzling at best, especially when there's almost no case at all for the creation of a 5k camera (other than maybe being able to blast away 4k at some insanely high FPS, that and yeah, "F&%K YOU Sony"...we get it). To be fair of course that doesn't mean that a 5K camera is bad, it just makes some question the future potential of the RED ONE now that it's not the flagship of the RED line.

That and kiss off the any rental plans for your RED ONEs. Once the retal houses start stocking a camera that operates roughly the same, is lighter, smaller, (assumingly) provides a better image in almost every way, AND is still cheap compared to competing high end cameras, renting a RED ONE is going to be rather difficult at best. Saying it'll rent because there's still an HVX market doesn't make sense now either, because unless some bulletproof magic workflow tool that doesn't cost $17K comes out JUST for the RED ONE, then there's no difference between using a RED and an EPIC (assuming of course there's no major change in workflow).

After all that, I have to say Epic probably isn't a bad thing, it's just utterly puzzling at this point. Until RED comes out and details what improvements justify creating a new camera entirely and make it cost so much more we can't say if it's worth it or not at this point.
 
post changed: the post was incomplete, i wanted to express that i dont agree with users who think its mistake that red offers cameras above and below the red one, and i think its sad that some people complain if a better camera comes to the markets.
 
It's all gravy in my book. I sent an email two years ago to Jim asking about an 8k camera. Here's his reply...

---------------------------- Original Message ----------------------------
Subject: Re: Big Red
From: "4k" <4k@red.com>
Date: Fri, April 28, 2006 6:53 pm
To: ira@filmservicesnw.com
--------------------------------------------------------------------------

Ira,

I won't say that 6k (or 8k) is on our horizon... we have our hands
full with getting the 1st one right. But I think once we have
accomplished that, using our experience to build in both directions
(consumer and 8k) will be well within our reach.

Thanks for the support.

My best,

Jim


>>>>

I won't take credit for EPIC but my mind's been on hitting the 35mm sweet spot digitally for years (35mm = 6k of resolution with about 1k of that res as actual grain)

So I'm thrilled, whatever the cost, I've been used to renting 35mm cameras for a long time.
 
I find it funny that everyone is worried about the Epic. To me it just seems like comparing Ferrari's to Lamborghini's. It is extremely weird that they came out with a 5k camera, but as far as rentals are concerned I am far more worried about the Scarlet. Everyone here seems to think it is a good "b" cam....yeah maybe on a big budget shoot. I was planning on using my red one for student level productions. Who the hell is going to rent from me a 4k camera, when they can buy a 3k camera for the price of 2 days of my rental. I am seriously scared of scarlet...I really don't see the big difference between it and the red one, warranting a 14 thousand dollar difference...Also, 4k is already overkill for most of us so....yeah scarlet....scaring me big time....making me rethink everything.....my camera is ready next month....what to do???
 
iflowers said:
It's all gravy in my book. I sent an email two years ago to Jim asking about an 8k camera. Here's his reply...

---------------------------- Original Message ----------------------------
Subject: Re: Big Red
From: "4k" <4k@red.com>
Date: Fri, April 28, 2006 6:53 pm
To: ira@filmservicesnw.com
--------------------------------------------------------------------------

Ira,

I won't say that 6k (or 8k) is on our horizon... we have our hands
full with getting the 1st one right. But I think once we have
accomplished that, using our experience to build in both directions
(consumer and 8k) will be well within our reach.

Thanks for the support.

My best,

Jim


>>>>

I won't take credit for EPIC but my mind's been on hitting the 35mm sweet spot digitally for years (35mm = 6k of resolution with about 1k of that res as actual grain)

So I'm thrilled, whatever the cost, I've been used to renting 35mm cameras for a long time.
Click to expand...

I wonder who sent that to you... it wasn't me. That is not my email address. Not that the message is wrong, but I never sent you that email.

Jim
 
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