Open question to BM: How would you feel if you just bought Resolve?

[Rob Ruffo]

And, like most users, never did 3D or 4K finishes. Would you be upset? Be honest now.

Also, what is your thinking? Please explain.

As a last question, can you see how your moves will inevitably bring down the income of most pro colorists (I am not one, I am a director/DP primarily but many colorists are good friends)? We can say it's all about the art, but the reality is if producers have copies of DaVinci on their desktops for free, they are going to try and get their daughters to do it. This will not kill the high-end jobs, but it will reduce the total number of paying jobs by wiping out a huge chunk of the middle to low end, which will bring down even high-end rates, with so many colorists out of work, to the point where making a living at grading will become impossible for all but a select few. Do you think this is "wonderful democratization?"

 

[Dave Blackham]

Its a great product. No regrets and Id buy another licence.

 

[Alan Gordon]

I'm just really hoping BM has some tricks up their sleeves for paying customers.

I'm not so sure that I regret it, because I have made the money I spent back, but at this middle-low end, it does kind of hurt.

But for now, until I have a 4K job, I'm keeping Lite installed because I don't need to bring my valuble dongle on-set for DIT looks.

 

[jake blackstone]

Its a great product. No regrets and Id buy another licence.

I'm sure Rob would gladly sell you his

 

[Rob Ruffo]

Yes I would. PM me with an offer or tomorrow I am phoning B&H to try and get a refund. In the few weeks I've had it, I've obviously made no R.O.I. yet, and upcoming paying jobs can be done 100% with free version. Neat Video is better for noise reduction, so that feature is a bit useless.

I rant about this for similar reasons to why I ranted about DSLRs - (although DaVinci is admittedly great, I have no complaints about functionality at all - whereas DSLRs are sub-par). "Democratization" is sometimes great, but taken too far it is simply a race to the bottom where no one can make a living and standards are non-existent.

 

[jake blackstone]

When original iPhone was sold for $699, I bought one. I think, 6 weeks later they dropped the price to $299 and Apple refunded the price drop to the original purchasers. I got mine. Love Apple
But I'm sure, users of original Final Touch don't share my affection for Apple

 

[Tom.Wong]

I think I've made my money on my resolve license over 10x over already in under a year. The price of the license i negligible in my opinion. The price of one of my GPU's alone is only 200 dollar less than the license. My rocket card cost 4x more, and tower cost 6x more. hell, even the control surface costs more than the license. You buy these thing so you can work, you work and make your money back, and than it's profit. It's a pretty standard business practice in this industry, just because the software is free doesn't mean they don't have to spend all that money in equipment either. Being locked down to 1 gpu alone, I'd lose half my clients, they want to see the performance. Being locked into 1080p resolution output only, hurts me too because I'm asked for 4k quicktimes and dpx all the time because they want the resolution to be able to pan and scan and punch in with the color already baked.

I really don't so see the big deal, that thousand dollars you're saving for sticking with the lite version can only go back to the color suite in a very minor way, and you're still limited in what you can do. and finally, I'm sure Jake can attest. If people are coming to you simply cause you have a Resolve, and not because they love your work, and want you to work for them and give them a great looking piece... well I think I've said enough.

 

[Rob Ruffo]

The fact that others have done it does not make it right. Other people are mugging tourists right now - does that mean I can do that too and it's fine? Besides, Apple Color at least cost SOMETHING.

 

[Rob Ruffo]

I think I've made my money on my resolve license over 10x over already in under a year. The price of the license i negligible in my opinion. The price of one of my GPU's alone is only 200 dollar less than the license. My rocket card cost 4x more, and tower cost 6x more. hell, even the control surface costs more than the license. You buy these thing so you can work, you work and make your money back, and than it's profit. It's a pretty standard business practice in this industry, just because the software is free doesn't mean they don't have to spend all that money in equipment either. Being locked down to 1 gpu alone, I'd lose half my clients, they want to see the performance. Being locked into 1080p resolution output only, hurts me too because I'm asked for 4k quicktimes and dpx all the time because they want the resolution to be able to pan and scan and punch in with the color already baked.

I really don't so see the big deal, that thousand dollars you're saving for sticking with the lite version can only go back to the color suite in a very minor way, and you're still limited in what you can do. and finally, I'm sure Jake can attest. If people are coming to you simply cause you have a Resolve, and not because they love your work, and want you to work for them and give them a great looking piece... well I think I've said enough.

I'm not talking about me - CC for me was merely a holistic add-on to my DP skills - but I can't see how this will not hurt the little guy - who, as as I specifically said, RECENTLY bought Resolve, or is already struggling. Some of those little guys are good friends.

 

[Alexis Vanier]

Please everyone realize that there is a huge psychological impact to taking something from a nearly negligible cost to making it free. How am I supposed to explain to a producer that I'm working on his stuff with something that's actually free... and I'm charging him for it.

Free is still a F word. It should be used sparingly.

I'm personally outraged by BlackMagic's move. I believe it's simply irresponsible towards the business as a whole.

If anyone starts a class action, I'm in.

 

[jake blackstone]

There are no basis for a lawsuit, based on $0 price alone. BM includes plenty of free software with their hardware products.
On the other hand, if they are trying to dump their product and as a result to kill off all competition, that's different.
But then again, all BM would have to do is to keep $1k price in place, even if nobody would pay and they are in the clear.

 

[Rob Ruffo]

Alexis, I think in Canada we could demand our money back. So says our lawyer neighbor. No court, just straight-up consumer protection law here. European owners of Davinci could probably do the same, even easier, but not sure. Same for Autralia. The 1K price for features we don't use, or it could be shown almost no one uses would not hold water. I will be getting my money back from B&H. I hope BM loses TONS of money from this irresponsible move - it is what they deserve for such terrible treatment of their paying user base.

 

[Alexander Ibrahim]

Alexis, I think in Canada we could demand our money back. So says our lawyer neighbor. No court, just straight-up consumer protection law here. European owners of Davinci could probably do the same, even easier, but not sure. Same for Autralia. The 1K price for features we don't use, or it could be shown almost no one uses would not hold water. I will be getting my money back from B&H. I hope BM loses TONS of money from this irresponsible move - it is what they deserve for such terrible treatment of their paying user base.

B&H is an American company, and you have to abide by our laws.

That said ... I plain old just don't get your outrage. It simply doesn't make sense to me.

I trade on my skills, not on my gear.

I've already been competing with Color users and Colorista users and people using Final Touch in pirated versions of AE.

This doesn't change that.

Resolve is actually a pretty difficult piece of software to use. I think its harder than Color for example. Once you get rolling, you still have the huge problem of a skill set to build.

I think any producer worth a damn will get that. The ones who don't get it ... do you really want to work for them anyway?

 

[Martin Widerberg]

The possibility of this producing more talented colorists is a good thing, I think. The technology we work with are changing rapidly. Switching from one editing system to another, and now coloring tools. Frustrating? Maybe. I think roll with the punches is a more creative approach.

 

[Ramesh Jai]

I really don't know what the problem is. It's BM's call to decide what they want to do. You are welcome to ditch Resolve and move on to other alternatives out there, more expensive ones if that's what you like. Perhaps BM wants to bank on the indie generation who are many many more than the corporate, established post production houses types. I even think PP houses will have a bigger talent pool to choose from when hiring just because more people would have become proficient in the software. In my opinion, nay I know, it's a step in the right direction.

Food for thought - Imagine Sony was the company that developed and sold the RED One. Guess how much it would cost? Anyone? Anyone?

PS. I have the paid full version of Resolve.

 

[Dan Kanes]

Many producers I know still have @aol.com email addresses - so that should give you an idea of what they know about technology.

I might buy a resolve license when I need to use it. For now, I still charge clients for any work I do with the free software. Just because it cost me $0 doesn't mean I shouldn't charge a client for my time learning how to use it, and then using it on a set.

 

[Chris Adler]

This is the silliest post I've ever read. Using the same line of logic it should be illegal for anything to come out that allows people to compete with seasoned industry professionals. Resolve is a tool set that does nothing on its own. A colorist either has skills or they don't. The price of the tools they use should be irrelevant. If you can be replaced by Bob from down the street because he has the free version of Resolve then he's marketing better than you, or he's a better colorist. That's business.

I'm hoping that since the product is free a lot of those crappy HDSLR movies that go without any attention to color will now get some.

 

[Rob Ruffo]

B&H is an American company, and you have to abide by our laws.

That said ... I plain old just don't get your outrage. It simply doesn't make sense to me.

I trade on my skills, not on my gear.

I've already been competing with Color users and Colorista users and people using Final Touch in pirated versions of AE.

This doesn't change that.

Resolve is actually a pretty difficult piece of software to use. I think its harder than Color for example. Once you get rolling, you still have the huge problem of a skill set to build.

I think any producer worth a damn will get that. The ones who don't get it ... do you really want to work for them anyway?

I have the luxury of picking and choosing clients - but to answer the question for many struggling individuals I know personally - good people working hard and doing the best they can - they would work for them because they need to pay the rent.

Buying equipment should be an investment with an R.O.I. - it's, again, not about art or skills or any of that, buying gear is all about business. Red has given us an amazing R.O.I. on our camera. Our lenses, too, continue to be a fabulous investment. We have Joker Bugs here that have paid for themselves many times over, and we plan to get more. This is not, at all, what I talk about to clients (I could rent those same Joker Bugs for a job, and charge the client the same thing (so to the client it makes no difference what we own) , but I don't have to so I put this money into our cash flow) - this is only what I talk about to our accountant. My accountant would say BM screwed us over, plain and simple. I will do everything I can to never buy anything from BM again - they have lost my respect, and I'm sure I am not alone.

As for laws, if you openly sell to Canada or Europe, you must abide by our consumer laws or you will be barred from doing so, and I'm sure BH does so - BH is a great company in my experience.

 

[Rob Ruffo]

This is the silliest post I've ever read. Using the same line of logic it should be illegal for anything to come out that allows people to compete with seasoned industry professionals. Resolve is a tool set that does nothing on its own. A colorist either has skills or they don't. The price of the tools they use should be irrelevant. If you can be replaced by Bob from down the street because he has the free version of Resolve then he's marketing better than you, or he's a better colorist. That's business.

I'm hoping that since the product is free a lot of those crappy HDSLR movies that go without any attention to color will now get some.

No Chris, you completely miss the point. That is not at all what I am saying. People here sometimes don't understand that what they call "open democratization" which in it's true form I applaud, in some cases is really a race to the bottom where no one can make a living except those doing top-end budgets with top-end representation in Hollywood or for mainstream commercials. I have both the aforementioned, so this is not about me, this is about taking care of the business as a whole with respect, rather than having a scorched earth policy that hurts many people, most especially your own customers, to make a few quick bucks and sell a few more video cards.

You don't see Jim burning his Epic owners by releasing a Scarlet that is almost the same except for a few trivial, unlikely to be used by most, features, because he is smart enough to realize that would be burning his own customers, and because he, unlike BM, is worthy of my respect.

 

[Mark Wilkinson]

4k finish is easily worth $1k, it seems to me.

I'd guess BM is watching the clock tic down towards Adobe's release of CS6 with IRIDAS. They have a limited amount of time to get people committed to their product before it becomes very difficult to sell as a software stand alone pkg.

Unless, of course, Adobe does something stupid (like Apple) and roll the technology into Premiere as a plug-in. Or implements it in AE like Color Finesse.