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  • Hey all, just changed over the backend after 15 years I figured time to give it a bit of an update, its probably gonna be a bit weird for most of you and i am sure there is a few bugs to work out but it should kinda work the same as before... hopefully :)

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josemnorton

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I haven't been here in a while but I felt compelled to come here and write about how ridiculous the concept of the Scarlet feels to me.

Here's a little anecdote:
Luxury car salesman turns to customer and says:
- We have this amazing new Rolls, with a super advanced engine with tons of horsepower and the best thing is it only costs 50,000 dollars!
The customer looks amazed but asks:
- Really? What's the catch?
And the car salesman answers:
- Tiny catch... It runs on fixed wooden tires.

I mean, how do you except to position a camera for the indie filmmaker that includes a FIXED lens? At a time when people are shooting with DSLR's mostly because of the interchangeable lens feature and that future low-end cameras (in the same price range as the Scarlet) like the Sony NEX FS100, include interchangeable lens mounts, you come with a camera that will bring the market back to the DVX100 age. But in breathtaking 3K RED RAW!

You can't rely solely on the RED RAW extravaganza (which I love, by the way) and expect people to buy a camera because of that.

One happy end for the customer in the anecdote could be him actually purchasing the Rolls but modifying it so that he can have the freedom to put whichever tires he deems fit. If I were to buy a Scarlet, I would only buy it so that I could modify it by removing the fixed lens and putting in a PL mount. And if such thing is possible, then that's what many of us will do.

With the Scarlet, you're taking away the freedom that made me passionate about the RED brand to begin with.
And that freedom is something that every indie filmmaker can relate to.

However, I can't express how amazing the EPIC is and what a wonderful job you've done with it.

Lastly, thank you for allowing us to vent about our frustrations, our dreams and your products.
 
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I think you mean a $10,000 Rolls Royce with stock wheels you can't change.

I'll take 3!

-michael zaletel
 
Jose, RED is making an interchangeable lens Scarlet as well. According to people in the know the lens on the 8x fixed would be more expensive than the whole camera by itself so think of the fixed Scarlet as a high end zoom with a free camera brain on the back.
 
Dude, buy the interchangeable Scarlet instead...

I see the fixed as an inexpensive option for motion capture and special effects (3K reference files for improved motion tracking - means you can use smaller objects as trackers)

Why would you get offended that a company offers you options?
 
I think your anecdote is more applicable to the DSLR than to the fixed lens SCARLET - I would say that h.264 acquisition = little wooden wheels....

whereas the lens on the fixed lens SCARLET looks damn nice. RED has learned a ton about building nice lenses, you probably shouldn't worry...+ RAW + HDRx + 3K. I really don't see much to be offended by. It is going to be a great little camera package.

There is always EPIC-S...
 
The fixed model is still modular (not the lens/brain but the rest is). You can buy it for its zoom and buy a cine scarlet and some primes later on. Its a good zoom for the price considering all the other parts can go on your cine model as well. This is the ideal cost saving way to slowly make your way into using red gear. So without this route I would personally be hard pressed to get ample glass and a cine model at once....so not everyone thinks the 8x is a bad idea, I for one cannot wait to buy it!!! It is costing me as much as a quality zoom would AND HAS A CAMERA ATTACHED TOO! Pretty cool stuff if you ask me!
 
I really don't understand this. People are way hung-up on the idea that fixed lens cameras are somehow 'less than professional and/or desireable'. It's all about options. An affordable camera with a good zoom range, no backfocus issues, HDRx, 3K RAW and, judging from ted's demos - a KILLER autofocus feature is very compelling to me. Shallow DOF is not the be and end all.

I think people are going to be suprised at the quality of the lens and just what they can achieve with Scarlet.

Adam
 
No way Jose ;) Your post is just so far out of sync with Red and community ... you're bitching about something
that everyone else is DYING to have released. Red most of all. See the issue there?

It doesn't mean it has to be anyone's ONLY camera -- unless one fixed lens is all you need (which is the case
for certain industries) ... but it's going to be one of the best ways for people to start with Red, as well as serve
many other purposes.

And as others have noted, there is always the interchangeable version or the Epic-S ...

I'm all for constructive criticism, but idle complaining with no real purpose or value hurts this forum :(

Anthony
 
Theres a time and place for each different scarlet, I can definitely think of many many situations where the fixed lens scarlet would be the best option and others where the interchangeable scarlet would be the best option. Soooooo thanks RED for giving us both options
 
Why not just wait and see how good (or not) the Scarlet lens is before bashing the concept?
 
There are cost and size savings with fixed electronic zooms, so it's not a bad thing to have both types of Scarlets. If you don't want the fixed lens version, don't buy it. Sony made the fixed-lens EX1 and the interchangeable lens EX3... I was talking to a guy who worked for a film school's camera equipment room where they bought some EX3's and he said in retrospect they should have bought more of the EX1's instead because most students just use the kit zoom on the EX3 anyway and they could have bought more bodies if they had gone with the EX1.
 
What would Jesus do? Buy the Scarlet Cinema, except he's got a hot date with some wooden cross around this time of year...
 
josemnorton said:
I haven't been here in a while but I felt compelled to come here and write about how ridiculous the concept of the Scarlet feels to me.

Here's a little anecdote:
Luxury car salesman turns to customer and says:
- We have this amazing new Rolls, with a super advanced engine with tons of horsepower and the best thing is it only costs 50,000 dollars!
The customer looks amazed but asks:
- Really? What's the catch?
And the car salesman answers:
- Tiny catch... It runs on fixed wooden tires.

I mean, how do you except to position a camera for the indie filmmaker that includes a FIXED lens? At a time when people are shooting with DSLR's mostly because of the interchangeable lens feature and that future low-end cameras (in the same price range as the Scarlet) like the Sony NEX FS100, include interchangeable lens mounts, you come with a camera that will bring the market back to the DVX100 age. But in breathtaking 3K RED RAW!

You can't rely solely on the RED RAW extravaganza (which I love, by the way) and expect people to buy a camera because of that.

One happy end for the customer in the anecdote could be him actually purchasing the Rolls but modifying it so that he can have the freedom to put whichever tires he deems fit. If I were to buy a Scarlet, I would only buy it so that I could modify it by removing the fixed lens and putting in a PL mount. And if such thing is possible, then that's what many of us will do.

With the Scarlet, you're taking away the freedom that made me passionate about the RED brand to begin with.
And that freedom is something that every indie filmmaker can relate to.

However, I can't express how amazing the EPIC is and what a wonderful job you've done with it.

Lastly, thank you for allowing us to vent about our frustrations, our dreams and your products.
Click to expand...


Well said.
 
No one is forcing anyone to buy this camera. I'm sure it'll sell itself just fine. No need to get offended over something you obviously don't want to buy.

I previously had a DVX100. It was a GREAT camera! I'll probably love the SCARLET just as much, if not more I suspect!

Btw. don't destroy your SCARLET Fixed. Buy the "Cine" version. Way easier to get your PL lenses mounted on, and you don't even have to pick it apart.

The SCARLET will undoubtedly rock! Why wouldn't it with that company behind it??
 
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Didn't the Hvx 200 had a fixed lens?? And was, and maybe still used widely in the indy community.
I am not so concerned about the fixed, as I am sure that here and in other communities solutions will be created.
Maybe converters, maybe ways to mount different lenses.. There is one thing sure it is gone be a great camera with a matching lens at a ridiculous low price .
Ooooh and not to forget HDR and higher speed rates.

It is a great deal....if the car has wheels that fit it...it is just a great deal!!

And you can always take the interchangeable one, with a mount you can choose.
 
josemnorton said:
I mean, how do you except to position a camera for the indie filmmaker that includes a FIXED lens? At a time when people are shooting with DSLR's mostly because of the interchangeable lens feature and that future low-end cameras (in the same price range as the Scarlet) like the Sony NEX FS100, include interchangeable lens mounts, you come with a camera that will bring the market back to the DVX100 age. But in breathtaking 3K RED RAW!
Click to expand...

I think you just totally missed the point and purpose of this camera... As others point out, there is an interchangeable lens version. RED is even making their own set of T1.5 'mini primes' for that camera, and such a package should appeal greatly to indie filmmakers.

The fixed lens model is what it is. It has an 8X fixed zoom with 35mm equivalent focal lengths from about 28mm to 224mm. That is a very useful range and the camera will be positioned at a variety of markets that can benefit from the compact, fixed-lens nature. Broadcast, documentary, live event, EFP, ENG, etc.. Not everyone here is a "filmmaker" nor is everyone here interested in working with primes or even interchangeable lenses for every task. If the fixed-lens Scarlet doesn't appeal to you, that's just fine, you don't have to buy one. As has been mentioned, there are plenty of other options -- 2/3" interchangeable "Scarlet Cinema", EPIC-M, EPIC-X, EPIC-S (formerly Scarlet S35), and the good ol' RED One. Like the Epic line of cameras, the interchangeable lens Scarlet will have the ability to swap lens mounts -- PL, mini-PL, B4 (w/ optical correction), etc...

I really don't see how you can be offended...?

Another little thing to think about... For any HD camera on the market with B4 or other similar electronic lens mount, the lens itself will typically cost 2 to 3 times as much as the entire fixed-lens Scarlet will. Think about that. Fixed Scarlet, ready to shoot package, should be price-comparable to entry prices for cameras like the HVX200, Sony EX1, etc..
 
For years I've been reading Apple forums and as the user base has gone through the roof, so have the number of people who feel that the company should service their exact need. As their love grows for Apple they start to project emotions on this one way relationship; complaining if their personal dream product isn't made, or Apple release products that seem out of step with the consumer's wishes.

This reminds me of that great scene in Goodfellas where Henry 'breaks his cherry' by getting arrested. Congrats RED team, you've moved closer to world domination.
 
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