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  • Hey all, just changed over the backend after 15 years I figured time to give it a bit of an update, its probably gonna be a bit weird for most of you and i am sure there is a few bugs to work out but it should kinda work the same as before... hopefully :)

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Steve Wake said:
Joseph: I don't get how a fixed lens camera can have Telephoto and Wide-angle MOUNTS. So I assume you mean adapters that screw on or bayonet on to the front. Last I remember Jarred said these were on the back burner. Though Gibby expected/hoped someone like Century/Schneider to have something available. Have you seen something you can talk about?

And while I'm asking questions, here are a few that you might be able to answer: does Scarlet have an HD-SDI out? Was the Base I/O module displayed at NAB? And does the Base I/O have HD-SDI out, digital audio in?

Thanks!
Click to expand...

Sorry, I meant that you can screw (or mount) a lens adapter on the front of the FIXED lens. I can neither confirm or deny those units being placed "on the back burner". I have not seen that reference myself.

The Scarlet does not have an HD-SDI port built into the brain. That is one of the key I/O differences between the EPIC and Scarlet. The Base I/O Module was not on display at NAB.
 
Its an odd position to take: "I don't want this product, and because I don't want it-- I don't want the factory to build it for others to buy." I would hope that Red saves people from buying inferior motion picture cameras such as DSLR's with their launch of the Scarlet Fixed. Great lenses mean nothing if you can't pan without Jell-o. No Master Prime will prevent line-skipping on the sensor. There isn't a Cooke S4 prime in existence that I'm aware of that will compensate for Moiré. I'd rather own a fixed lens 3K camera than an interchangeable lens HD camera.

I'm offended that there are people who want to limit the tools that I have access to as a filmmaker. I can see uses for a 3K image up-rezzed to 4K being preferable to a 5K image down sampled to 4K for certain projects. I want the Scarlet Fixed to shoot an entire movie.
 
I have a friend who has a 5D Mark II. He never takes his 24-70 off the damn thing. He pretty much has a FIXED 5D2 as far as I'm concerned... Scarlet fixed is what an F2.8? all the way through the zoom. That's pretty damn good my friend. Not to mention the fact that you have most every popular focal length to tell your story...

I wouldn't compare it to a Rolls with wooden tires, that's a bit melodramatic don't you think?? ahaha.. How about a Rolls with wicked comfortable, highly functional, vibrating seats that are welded to the chassis?? I think that's more accurate...
 
Is there an interchangeable Scarlet?
Is the Cinema still going to happen?
If indeed there is a choice between fixed and interchangeable, then the original poster has a simple solution to his problem - buy the Scarlet Cinema.

However, a few things are becoming evident.
1. The only mention of the Scarlet in all recent announcements is of the Fixed Lens model.
2. One must presume from the latest delay announcement that the Fixed is the first to be released.
3. There have been many rumors of the death of the Scarlet Cinema.
4. In spite of many opportunities, no-one from Red has ever denied the rumors.

In another thread, it was announced that the Scarlet will be delayed because of the lack of supply of lens parts.
To which many responded 'but there are no lens parts in the Cinema. Release that first.'
But there has been no response from Red.

If there is no choice in the Scarlet range, then I'm afraid I begin to agree with the original poster.
A simple look at the history of cameras will confirm that professionals need to swap lenses.

Sometimes one needs extreme wide angles or extreme telephoto angles. It seems unlikely that the Red Fixed lens can satisfy every shooting requirement.
Even if it did, cinematographers can be very fussy when picking the tools of their trade. Often a cinematographer will test out different makes and models of lens before a project, selecting one which he feels matches the mood of the project.

Great and innovative tools should always give the professional more choice, more freedom, more room for creativity. If they start to restrict or limit choice or creativity, then I doubt that professionals will choose them.

There's an argument that says that the Scarlet is not a tool for the high-end feature film professionals, and that its place in the market is for industrial, wedding, corporate, and documentary filmmakers who have a different set of requirements.
That's true.
And maybe Red don't want to launch a Scarlet camera that could be used by the high-end feature film makers in opposition with their own Epic.
After all, they've been telling us for a long time that resolution is vital, and that only 5k will do.
And yet 'Black Swan' was shot on 16mm with much lower resolution.
Maybe Red is scared that if they release the Scarlet Cinema, professionals will see that 3k looks absolutely fine on the cinema screen, that 2/3 sensors can give shallow depth of field, and that 16mm optics can work wonderfully. Then they will lose Epic sales.

I'm speculating wildly here, and the truth is I have no idea why Red are not talking about the Scarlet Cinema any more.
It simply doesn't make sense.

Paul
 
Paul Spurrier said:
...
After all, they've been telling us for a long time that resolution is vital, and that only 5k will do.
And yet 'Black Swan' was shot on 16mm with much lower resolution.
...
Click to expand...

Paul,

Can you honestly answer the following, "Did you actually see 'Black Swan?'"

B/c I did and it looked horribly grainy, which worked for THAT movie. But I can't see how "Black Swan's" look in any way threatens other formats' viability.

As for the need for interchangeable lenses. The Scarlet Fixed is a ~$6K camera. It should be evaluated w/ that context in mind. And I have to think that wide-angle and telephoto adapters will be made for it. Maybe not ideal, but again, we're talking 3K for ~$6K.
 
Thanks for the info David and Joseph. And I'm sorry I helped prolong the life of this silly thread.
 
Paul Spurrier said:
I

A simple look at the history of cameras will confirm that professionals need to swap lenses.
Nonsense! Does that make someone who chooses not to swap lenses not a professional? Silly blanket statement.

Great and innovative tools should always give the professional more choice, more freedom, more room for creativity. If they start to restrict or limit choice or creativity, then I doubt that professionals will choose them.
Nonsense! Creativity is not defined by the tools one uses nor do the tools one uses define their "professional" status.

There's an argument that says that the Scarlet is not a tool for the high-end feature film professionals, and that its place in the market is for industrial, wedding, corporate, and documentary filmmakers who have a different set of requirements.
That's true.
Yes and you keep trying to define who is professional and who is not. Budget does not make people "High End Feature Film Professionals". There is more crap produced in Hollywood and elsewhere with big budgets and no matter how much money is thrown at it ... it is still crap.

And maybe Red don't want to launch a Scarlet camera that could be used by the high-end feature film makers in opposition with their own Epic.
Maybe you are are right... who knows.

After all, they've been telling us for a long time that resolution is vital, and that only 5k will do.
And yet 'Black Swan' was shot on 16mm with much lower resolution.
When you tell a good story and when I say tell the story I mean write, direct,shoot,edit and deliver, the audience rewards you. And that could be a doc, a wedding, a drama or Black Swan.
Click to expand...
 
Paul Spurrier said:
...

However, a few things are becoming evident.
1. The only mention of the Scarlet in all recent announcements is of the Fixed Lens model.
2. One must presume from the latest delay announcement that the Fixed is the first to be released.
3. There have been many rumors of the death of the Scarlet Cinema.
4. In spite of many opportunities, no-one from Red has ever denied the rumors.
...
Click to expand...


1. The only mention of the Scarlet in all recent announcements is of the Fixed Lens model.
2. One must presume from the latest delay announcement that the Fixed was the only Scarlet model to be delayed by the tragedy in Japan.
3. There have been many rumors that the rumors of the death of the Scarlet Cinema are false.
4. In spite of many opportunities, no-one from Red has ever denied the rumors.

Wow. Coming up with completely unsubstantiated conjecture and presenting it as fact really is kind of fun I guess.
 
Paul Spurrier said:
However, a few things are becoming evident.
1. The only mention of the Scarlet in all recent announcements is of the Fixed Lens model.
Click to expand...

Come to think of it, they haven't spoken much about the EPIC-S either. Is that supposed to mean they are scratching it off the board?

Paul Spurrier said:
2. One must presume from the latest delay announcement that the Fixed is the first to be released.
Click to expand...

If I'm not mistaken, the FIXED Scarlet has always been projected to be released prior to the CINEMA Scarlet...no?


Paul Spurrier said:
3. There have been many rumors of the death of the Scarlet Cinema.
Click to expand...

With none of them having any grounds to base such a rumor.



Paul Spurrier said:
4. In spite of many opportunities, no-one from Red has ever denied the rumors.

Paul
Click to expand...

Perhaps not online in most recent times...but if it were RED's job to counter every unfounded rumor, cameras would never be shipped
 
Paul Spurrier said:
Is there an interchangeable Scarlet?
Is the Cinema still going to happen?
If indeed there is a choice between fixed and interchangeable, then the original poster has a simple solution to his problem - buy the Scarlet Cinema.

However, a few things are becoming evident.
1. The only mention of the Scarlet in all recent announcements is of the Fixed Lens model.
2. One must presume from the latest delay announcement that the Fixed is the first to be released.
3. There have been many rumors of the death of the Scarlet Cinema.
4. In spite of many opportunities, no-one from Red has ever denied the rumors.
Click to expand...

Were you at NAB? Did you check out the mini primes in the Scarlet showcase? What were they for, if not the Scarlet Cinema?

True, they didn't actually show the Scarlet Cinema (unless I missed it). But the above telegraphs their intentions pretty clearly. And they've been very clear about no more tease or pre-announcement or deposit-taking; you'll hear more about Cinema when it's in stock, ready to ship - that's my bet.

Unless you want to subscribe to some conspiracy theory, and say the mini primes were shown as misdirection, to deflect accurate rumours of Cinema being cancelled.... :001_rolleyes:

Mike
 
Paul Spurrier said:
If there is no choice in the Scarlet range, then I'm afraid I begin to agree with the original poster.
A simple look at the history of cameras will confirm that professionals need to swap lenses.
Click to expand...

Really? Cause Henri Cartier-Bresson made some of the last century's most memorable images with just a 50mm lens and a relatively "slow sensor." Ozu made some of Japan's most noted cinema using only a 50mm lens and a similarly "slow sensor."

A talented artist can get a lot of mileage out of a quality 8x zoom. Others will never have enough options to get the job done. It's the nature of the craft. I've known a lot of people over the years that were always stopped short of achieving their goals by the long wait for a forthcoming new motor or a new fast zoom or some other piece of equipment that would complete them and make the visions of their dreams into a reality. And then I've known people who'd kludge together whatever it took to make things work. I feel a lot more secure with the guy who's epoxied a wide-angle converter on the front of his "inferior" zoom and dried the whole camera out over a campfire when it went in the river (true story, BTW...and not with a film camera, with a video camera) than the guy who laid on the couch whining about the chromatic aberration apparent in the lens he'd been waiting for two years to use to make his perfect project that never ended up getting finished. Closers make stuff work. Heh...ABC...Always Be Closing. Second prize is a set of steak knives. Third prize is 'you're fired.' Heh...sorry. Had to. ;-)

If the Scarlet 8x is right for you then buy it and use it...well, use it UP. Use it until the wheels come off. If it's not right for you then buy something else. And go whine at those people about how limited you feel. Cause feeling limited by gear is usually a sign of something else going on.
 
josemnorton didn't do his homework and is offended ... LOL
 
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