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  • Hey all, just changed over the backend after 15 years I figured time to give it a bit of an update, its probably gonna be a bit weird for most of you and i am sure there is a few bugs to work out but it should kinda work the same as before... hopefully :)

ODEMAX - where is the info?

For the geeks in the room who haven't heard the term...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Last_mile

BTW...It will be interesting to see if the codex will compress the 4K stream enough where the content can over come some of the technical hurdles/bottlenecks during the last mile...
 
Paul Ellington said:
It's business, it's called that for a reason. If you like shooting which is what I thought this forum is about then be happy. Otherwise please by all means, invent your own tech, file for patents, and then see how much you'd protect your baby. Again, it's business, not personal. Some of the arguments made here make me scratch my head.
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Paul. Ever since Red announced the Redray player and 4K laser projectors aimed and targeted to HT consumers as well as to the film production market, this forum truly became all things Red.
 
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I emailed them yesterday. I stated given their no response to emails of others, if they didn't reply in a few days, I would assume they are defunct and would so post.

If this is the way they treat their end users, I don't want anything to do with them.
 
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To be honest, it's just like the Dragon.

Let's sit and wait for info.

We can have endless debates, discussions, arguments & rants - but RED do things a certain way and I don't expect we'll hear much until NAB. Or, maybe a pre-NAB release or something at the end of March.

There's no point in getting annoyed about it. Those who have been around on this forum for a long time, or long time Red users have got used to announcements and then delays. Red have been much better of late, with more updates and schedules they're keeping to in terms of hardware etc.
 
Red is not Odemax. They keep saying so. But HT consumer end use of Redray depends on Odemax. Maybe there will be others to replace Odemax or maybe it is just hibernating and will arise in glory. But you know what, I won't forgive them for treating US that way. They can go without my money.

And I don't need a Redray now. If content becomes available I can reorder the Redray and my guess is that Red will take the order and ship it and it might even cost less. My answer is. Let's just cancel our orders and wait. Then we won't have any expectations to deal with. I'd rather have a good surprise rather to feel dissapointed on the actuality rather than the hype of the first announcements. Redray shipping in January, Odemax rolling out at Sundance, full launch of Odemax in March.
 
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mark haflich said:
Red is not Odemax. They keep saying so. But HT consumer end use of Redray depends on Odemax. Maybe there will be others to replace Odemax or maybe it is just hibernating and will arise in glory. But you know what, I won't forgive them for treating US that way. They can go without my money.

And I don't need a Redray now. If content becomes available I can reorder the Redray and my guess is that Red will take the order and ship it and it might even cost less. My answer is. Let's just cancel our orders and wait. Then we won't have any expectations to deal with. I'd rather have a good surprise rather to feel the dissapointed on the actuality rather than the hype of the first announcements. Redray shipping in January, Odemax rolling out at Sundance, full launch of Odemax in March.
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NAB would be my bet after Sundance was missed.
 
I just talked to my bomb squad rep. He was super and we agreed that they would call and get permission to charge my card thus maintaining my que in line and I could thus cancel at that time. He sent me a very personalized email. First class customer service. I have no problem with Red, just Odemax.
 
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Several days and no answer to my email to Odemax. Not even a stay tuned. They are acting like they are defunct.
 
mark haflich said:
Several days and no answer to my email to Odemax. Not even a stay tuned. They are acting like they are defunct.
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It could be that or it could be they are running silent amidst heavy competition, lawsuits and delays. In the Red Universe however a "delay" isn't so much a delay as it is a premature announcement. :-)
 
while its rude of them to be so vocal on RedUser only to go silent now, and its frustrating to be told an announcement and launch would come.

Plus it being incredible lame... I still hope they pull this off as it would mean a great deal to many indy filmmakers and give the much needed slap around the face to distribution.
 
Personally, it not only looks bad on Odemax if they don't come through on ALL their promises or just plain disappear overnight never to be heard from again, BUT, it looks just as bad on RED. Jarred was the first to sing their praises and pump their hardware solution with the Odemax distribution platform. So, where does that leave RED if Odemax is no longer? Pretty RED faced if you ask me. And, after all the hype on Odemax all we get is a generic "we are not affiliated with Odemax" comment. Bunk on both parts so far if you ask me. This is not speculative anger, but a real reaction based on the actions of both companies to date.
 
I'll add my voice to those that suggest that some word from ODEMAX is appropriate. Seems pretty lame to make such a big statement and then go completely silent. I want to be supportive, but...
:-(
 
It's a shame ODEMAX doesn't appear to be open for content providers yet.

We are currently willing and dealing with distribution rights for one of our projects and likely to carve out much what could have been offered through their service. With the next project possibly several years away, it is unlikely that their service, if and when it eventuates, is going to be of any use to us for a while.

Yes, an update would be helpful.
 
mikeburton said:
Personally, it not only looks bad on Odemax if they don't come through on ALL their promises or just plain disappear overnight never to be heard from again, BUT, it looks just as bad on RED. Jarred was the first to sing their praises and pump their hardware solution with the Odemax distribution platform. So, where does that leave RED if Odemax is no longer? Pretty RED faced if you ask me. And, after all the hype on Odemax all we get is a generic "we are not affiliated with Odemax" comment. Bunk on both parts so far if you ask me. This is not speculative anger, but a real reaction based on the actions of both companies to date.
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That's one thig I don't like about Red. They do damage control in the worst corporate sense. Rather than saying we put too much faith in Odemax, we really thought they were going to pull it off by March, we hyped our partnership with them, they fooled us. They have problems we can't discuss. Red just ignores what they said in the past and now go silent and say we are not them yada yada. just like Red is now saying we really intended a March delivery for Redray. That is not what they said in December.

Obviously, this really does not harm anybody but I think they think they are smarter than us. Their pricing model does attract a lot of fans and vigorous defenders of whatever they do. They can do no wrong.

I particular;y love those fans who excuse anything based on Red having more important things on their plate. red even uses that one. One must run a company in a way that too much doesn't get on one's plate. Consumers except price brainwashed ones don't accept a your product is not that important to us, we are working on other more important things and because of this we don't even have time to promply communicate to you. Wink wink. The fan boys suck that up. a consumer looks elsewhere. Fortunately for Red, there is nowhere else to look.
 
roryhinds said:
while its rude of them to be so vocal on RedUser only to go silent now, and its frustrating to be told an announcement and launch would come.
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Er... I don't think ODEMAX was ever vocal anywhere. RED announced their existence and purpose. But yeah, it's been totally silent since then. Hopefully there will be something at NAB and REDRAY (with ODEMAX distribution system) will hopefully come shortly after. I'm not giving up yet. It's just that most companies are not as transparent and vocal as RED. And has Jarred has pointed out, ODEMAX is not RED.

For many of us, myself included, the REDRAY player is attractive on its own. However, the content distribution network is key. A $1400 player is going to be an expensive sell without the network. UHD/ 4K players from other manufacturers are coming in the not too distant future, possibly later this year, in time for holiday shoppers. While RED had the only truly functional 4K player at CES, well Sony and Samsung did have their integrated systems on their TV's, but that's different... Anyway, RED was the only one with a functional player on show. However, UHD players were announced by several makers and most of them were only waiting for H.265 finalization before pushing forward. The three to watch in this arena, IMO, are Roku, Apple and Boxee. Mark my words. Roku will have a UHD player driven by Netflix, Amazon and others on the show floor at CES 2014 and they may even be shipping units by then. And I bet it will be under $300. Their latest and greatest 1080p model (Roku3) is pretty slick and walks all over AppleTV, even does apps and allows anyone to create channels and distribute, and it's $99. REDRAY has a serious up-hill battle ahead of it in the consumer space at their $1400 price point. The *ONLY* way RED is going to attract consumers at that price point is if they can deliver the content better than anyone else.

RED can jump up and down screaming about how awesome the .RED codec is. H.265 UHD is comparable in file size and bandwidth to .RED and is an open standard. H.265 compressed UHD may not be as technically capable or good, but for 99% of potential customers out there, none of them will be able to tell the difference. And it will deliver near flawless 1080p within the narrow bandwidth we have right now that's being used by iTunes, Netflix, etc..
 
Jeff Kilgroe said:
Er... I don't think ODEMAX was ever vocal anywhere. RED announced their existence and purpose. But yeah, it's been totally silent since then. Hopefully there will be something at NAB and REDRAY (with ODEMAX distribution system) will hopefully come shortly after. I'm not giving up yet. It's just that most companies are not as transparent and vocal as RED. And has Jarred has pointed out, ODEMAX is not RED.

For many of us, myself included, the REDRAY player is attractive on its own. However, the content distribution network is key. A $1400 player is going to be an expensive sell without the network. UHD/ 4K players from other manufacturers are coming in the not too distant future, possibly later this year, in time for holiday shoppers. While RED had the only truly functional 4K player at CES, well Sony and Samsung did have their integrated systems on their TV's, but that's different... Anyway, RED was the only one with a functional player on show. However, UHD players were announced by several makers and most of them were only waiting for H.265 finalization before pushing forward. The three to watch in this arena, IMO, are Roku, Apple and Boxee. Mark my words. Roku will have a UHD player driven by Netflix, Amazon and others on the show floor at CES 2014 and they may even be shipping units by then. And I bet it will be under $300. Their latest and greatest 1080p model (Roku3) is pretty slick and walks all over AppleTV, even does apps and allows anyone to create channels and distribute, and it's $99. REDRAY has a serious up-hill battle ahead of it in the consumer space at their $1400 price point. The *ONLY* way RED is going to attract consumers at that price point is if they can deliver the content better than anyone else.

RED can jump up and down screaming about how awesome the .RED codec is. H.265 UHD is comparable in file size and bandwidth to .RED and is an open standard. H.265 compressed UHD may not be as technically capable or good, but for 99% of potential customers out there, none of them will be able to tell the difference. And it will deliver near flawless 1080p within the narrow bandwidth we have right now that's being used by iTunes, Netflix, etc..
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Jeff,

Do you know the ETA for the H.265 UHD codec release?
 
If REDRAY was shipping last March 2012 the price point may have been justifiable but now it seems not as attractive. And the distribution behind it appears shaky at best. So, if i just need a compressed format to play 4K out to a 1080p TV (Which is only 99.99999% of whats available to view the media on right now and for at least another year) then i already have that. Its called Apple TV, my computer, my laptop, hell my iPad. Not trying to diminish the significance of what the Redray player could do but lets face it, by the time it is shipping and is in the hands of the masses it will probably be rivaled by another set top box manufacturer ie Apple TV, Roku, like Jeff mentioned that will be a third of the price with a much larger user base and distribution model. Think about it, even if ODEMAX gets their you know what together how much content and who is going to be watching / more importantly purchasing that content. Yup you guessed it, only you and i who frequent this forum and maybe a handful of others who decide to buy it for their home Sony 4K projectors.
Like i mentioned in my "Cancel my Order" thread, it seemed like a good idea at the time of announcement but now that i've had time to digest it doesn't seem like a product worth its weight, especially in the next year when that price is bound to drop dramatically once the competition releases there boxes.
 
BRANDON JAMESON said:
Jeff,

Do you know the ETA for the H.265 UHD codec release?
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It's manufacturer specific, just as H.264 is now. There are going to be lots of different implementations. However the H.265 spec is now final and I think the last ends are bing tied up. I'm expecting to see some H.265-based equipment in the pre-release stage at NAB. Some of the key players in defining the compression spec have been working and developing all along. As with H.264 on it's release, new products will be somewhat slow to arrive. The new compression spec takes a lot more compute power to encode and decode than H.264 does. So it's not a matter of adapting the codec to existing products, it requires more powerful hardware to run it.
 
To me the apply of RedRay and ODEMAX was that they are aimed at the Cinema.
Other companies like Apple TV or NetFlex UHD would be for the home which RedRay can do as well but its the Cinema element that is the biggest game changer to me.

Now if you could distribute your film on ODEMAX and the audience has the option to view it in a movie theatre or if they have their own home theatre, bet it monitor or projector and could watch the same film at home or go to a cinema... that's a pretty cool distribution model.

Making films is all about distribution, if you can't recoup your money to produce the film and make some on top of that then what is the point of making that film. And the world is growing with more and more indy films that need a way in. We all can't be the few that work with major studios and have unlimited budgets to accommodate creative accounting.
 
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